Supastox - Racing mods

[whittaker52]

Hi All, sorry if this has been covered before, I had a scan through, but couldn't find anything.

I'm planning on building a Supastox over the winter, and i'm just looking at getting all the parts together that will get me started (indoor circuit) racing. Initially i'm planning on setting the car up as a 21.5 2S blinky race car - purely out of convenience with parts I already have - speed passion stock esc etc. Motor-wise, i'm kinda limited as there don't seem to be many stock 21.5t motors out there, but so far, the lead contender is the hobbywing xerun quicrun 21.5t 3650 stock motor. I had been looking at the speed passion V3 21.5t motor, but with adjustable timing, and no real way to lock at zero timing, it seems to be out?

I've read the guide that's on the GT12 facebook groups and that's clarified a few points, but I wasn't sure about a few things.

I'm planning on going for bearings all round - are there any major benefits over using ceramic bearings over just not metal shielded bearings, other than long-term wear? The bearing kit is about 3 times the cost for ceramics, but if it'll lead to better running, then I'd say it's worth it.

Ball diff seems to be a must as well, so that's certainly on my shopping list, as is the wishbone socket ball upgrade, but what about the wishbone upgrade that's available? is that worth building in too?

Are there any other things I should consider doing too?

Thanks in advance for any advice.
Best Regards,
Oliver

[SlowOne]

The ceramic kit is not worth the money IMHO. The rear bearings last ages as they are well shielded. The front bearings will most likely get wrecked in a hit before they wear out - I've done a couple.

Yes, ball diff is a must. Other little tricks include making sure that there are positive downstops for the springs at each end - use nylon washers so that the suspension rises about 1.5mm at each end and no more. Too much 'rise' and the car will be a bit snappy into and out of turns.

A spring kit is a good idea too. Check the Schumacher site for Chris Ashton's set up and follow along form there. Most of us ended up on 50 fronts at 44mm dis and 37 or 40 rears at 46mm. 37s if the grip is low (club night for example) and 40 when the grip comes up.

If the car is a bit wayward at the back then change the rear tyres first, don't fiddle with the front too much as you will lose the balance when the grip comes up. If the car understeers too much go to the harder rears first...etc.

I ended up on yellow rear springs in the outer holes and green front springs with about 1mm of droop. The standard camber plate works best.

Other than that, I haven't needed any spares for a whole season's racing at National level. Tyre wear is very low - I rotate three sets of tyres during the races and have worn the equivalent of two sets off them.

Best shell is the Ascari, best tyres are Contact, best additive is SX3. No I'm not sponsored by Schumacher, I've just tried it all and made an A Final with that lot and a good day at the office! HTH :)

[glenn french]

Please can you explane what you mean or what parts i need to Do ( positive downstops for the springs at each end - use nylon washers so that the suspension rises about 1.5mm at each end and no more. Too much 'rise' and the car will be a bit snappy into and out of turns.)

[mark christopher]

Join the Facebook page gt12 circuit uk, all the info is there

The long wheel base kit is worth getting, and you get the mi5 mod in it too, makes the car more stable.
Add a bearing in the site as the guide in the files section on the page.
Slow one is referring to droop, also in the guide is a droop screw mod, which we have found works better if used on the inner holes of the spring plate. Ask on the page for the David gale mod, but I'm sure its been updated in the guide.
Recent clubman's most used spider blue

[whittaker52]

Thanks for the help and advice. I've downloaded the guide and i've started getting everything together to get building. With the droop adjustments, is it just a case of trial and error or does less droop seem to work better and vice versa? I've had a thought about maybe using a selection of different length screws to control the droop so that perhaps set up could potentially be a bit easier than measuring each time, maybe even giving a better idea of what's working best? although it will just mean keeping a selection of different screws at hand.

I'll try and post up some shots when it's all done :)

Thanks again for the help and advice.

[mark christopher]

Too much faf tbh. No more than 1mm droop

[Danosborne6661]

Just thought I'd put a key pointers that I have on my set-up that may help you that you can research

- Maplin washers to replace the blue ones.
- Move Yellow spring out one hole on the back, change front to Blue springs.
- MI5 front end mod
- 30 degrees timing on motor, gear car to suit
- Ascari/Ferrari Bodyshell
- Rebuild diff as per the guide on the GT12 section of Facebook.
- Reduce droop? Haven't done this on mine yet but have been meaning to!

But to me, MOST importanly - weight balance!

- Target 950g overall weight
- 60% Rear, 40% front weight bias, or as close to as possible!
- 5mm washer to space off motor to try and recentre weight
- Add 30g-ish to non-drive side of pod to balance weight
- Add/move any other weight to try and get the car balanced left to right - makes the car LOADS more predictable.

Hope that helps :)

[mark christopher]

Droop screws are becoming more popular than the Maplin washers now

[whittaker52]

Well i've started work on the chassis. The first job I decided to do was wrap the chassis, just to give it a little bit of extra protection (see attached photos) It took a bit of work to design and cut, but it came out nice for the top and underside of the chassis.

I have also thought up with a few possible solutions for the front and rear droop - washers/spacers underneath the front suspension arm/rear suspension cage that will raise the arm/cage slight, or for the rear at least, using the other rear suspension mounts, using a pair of csk screws, riv nuts and spacers, hopefully just enough to achieve the desired effect and limit droop. Any thoughts on this?

[mark christopher]

Personally. Yuk on the chassis

Read the build guide and do the droop screws as that.

[whittaker52]

Hmmmm odd, I've just started working on building the front end and my kit appears to have come with the super hard black front springs! so I must have one of the early kits! Is it worth emailing schumacher about it, or just buy the blue front springs to replace them?

[Dombrasky]

The kit comes with black springs on the front yellow rear

[Danosborne6661]

As Rick just said, that's what it comes with :)

[whittaker52]

According to the manual in my kit, black front, yellow rear, but according to the version on schumachers website, blue front, yellow rear? Not that it's a major thing anyway, i'll be ordering some more bits soon anyway :)

[mark christopher]

early kits came with blue fronts and yellow rears, later kits with black fronts

[whittaker52]

Ahhhhhh okay, that would make sense. Ta :)

[whittaker52]

A little bit of an update (and a few more photos). The chassis is now built and the motor (hobbywing 21.5t sensored stock motor), servo (trackstar TS-400MG) and receiver are installed, I just need to solder the motor to the esc (a speed passion reventon stock club race esc) and I'm thinking of changing the battery connection so it just plugs right into the battery, rather than using deans connector and lead to try and save a little bit of weight (only a few grams, but I guess it all adds up).

I'll hopefully manage to get a few of the new GT upgrades when they become available, they seem to be trickling into schumacher at the min.

I ended up choosing the protoform pfm-12 body, which was a bit of a pain to get to fit reasonably okay, but it looks okay after 2 attempts to get it right! It also meant modifying the rear bumper a little so it fitted behind the body. While i'm on the subject of the rear bumper, what are the thoughts on the rear diffuser?

Thanks,
Oliver

[Danosborne6661]

A lot of people don't run the rear bumpers really. Diffuser looks cool but will have no effect on how it drives.

[DCM]

Dan, the rear diffuser does make a difference... it makes your car look super cool!! :thumbsup:

[Danosborne6661]

Haha, you got me Steve :)

Someone at our club has actually shaped the rear bumper to look like a diffuser!

[mark christopher]

id remove the rear bumper, most as Dan said don't bother with it.

don't expect much of the new gt12 to fit, its very different, in fact only the front beam/hubs will fit the older car along with the rear diff. lipo tray, rear pod and plates are all different.

[whittaker52]

Yeah, I thought the diffuser would probably be more of a visual/detail thing than functional, i'll have to look at ordering one soon to replace the rear bumper :)

Looking at my list, most of the GT bits I want to get are for the front end suspension, so hopefully there won't be too many compatibility issues.

I'm guessing most people race with the sensored motor/esc system too?

[mark christopher]

Yeh dont think there are many senorless systems homlogated

[metalmickey0]

Haha, you got me Steve :)

Someone at our club has actually shaped the rear bumper to look like a diffuser!
yep. that be me i reckon you refering too .:)

[hotrodchris]

Does anyone know the tyre rating of the kit tyres in the new gt12 kits?

[mark christopher]

Does anyone know the tyre rating of the kit tyres in the new gt12 kits?

On the back of the box

[hotrodchris]

So it is couldnt see it for looking, must of read through the Manuela 10+ times looking for it.
Thanks