Spring rates yz2

[washy13]

Hi

Does anybody know the spring rates for these new springs that have come out ?

[Philim]

Yatabe spring rates

[Arn0]

This table does not contain the YZ2 spring. Have a look here, update done minutes ago: http://www.petitrc.com/reglages/UniversalSpringChart.htm

[neallewis]

That spring chart Philim posted above is not quite right. It's a hard thing to do and Arn0 has done a great job compiling it for sure. Modulus of elasticity constant of the spring steel was guestimated (for the Yokomo ones), and is different for each spring set..

TeamYokomo.eu have just released this measured one:

http://courgette.jml.net/~neal/RC/Yokomo/YZ-2-Spring-Chart.jpg

I was working on one similar myself with the Gforce spring rate gauge, but they beat me to it ;-)

I'll try complete the older Yokomo springs to complete the chart.

[Allan1875]

Now you need to help me out Neal. I only deal in springs rates at lbs/inch.

When I stuck n/cm to lbs/inch into google and tried conversions, I definitely wasn't getting the right figures. Anyone tell me how to convert them? :thumbsup:

[neallewis]

Now you need to help me out Neal. I only deal in springs rates at lbs/inch.

When I stuck n/cm to lbs/inch into google and tried conversions, I definitely wasn't getting the right figures. Anyone tell me how to convert them? :thumbsup:

Yeah I was getting silly numbers too, hence why I've not published my table...
One thing is for certain the AE pound "lb" rating of their springs is a bit nonsense. It's a weight, not a force. They do not mean lb/in either? I figured I'd start with "known" ratings, and calculate/convert back from metric force to the "lb" rating. silly numbers.

I just figured I'd go with the N/CM scale of the gauge, and refer them all back to that scale.
http://www.gforce-hobby.jp/images/products/G0132.jpg

[skyaflake]

That spring chart Philim posted above is wrong. Modulus of elasticity constant of the spring steel was guestimated, and is different for each spring set..

TeamYokomo.eu have just released this measured one:

http://courgette.jml.net/~neal/RC/Yokomo/YZ-2-Spring-Chart.jpg

I was working on one similar myself with the Gforce spring rate gauge, but they beat me to it ;-)

I'll try complete the older Yokomo springs to complete the chart.
If you are going to add the 'older' Yokomo springs, measure the YS and YAS as well, because you don't know HOW (Probably using a GForce thing, but nobody knows.) Bjorn did measure. If you get ~the same results, it should be OK.

[washy13]

That spring chart Philim posted above is wrong. Modulus of elasticity constant of the spring steel was guestimated, and is different for each spring set..

TeamYokomo.eu have just released this measured one:

http://courgette.jml.net/~neal/RC/Yokomo/YZ-2-Spring-Chart.jpg

I was working on one similar myself with the Gforce spring rate gauge, but they beat me to it ;-)

I'll try complete the older Yokomo springs to complete the chart.


Cheers Neil :thumbsup::thumbsup:

[Fozzy1989]

Only just started running Yokomo for the first time with the YZ2, what's the difference between the different sets? I'm guessing it's the length of the spring?

Cheers
Chris

[Allan1875]

Only just started running Yokomo for the first time with the YZ2, what's the difference between the different sets? I'm guessing it's the length of the spring?

Cheers
Chris

Yeh the Carpet ones are shorter.

[J'MM'N]

Neal, please carry on with your calculations. Would still be good to see how the old Yokomo and the Associated springs fit in with the newer Yokomo springs.

[spud31]

i think the chart needs decimal point moving so front purple are 72.8 n/cm as that = 6.44 lb

[neallewis]

i think the chart needs decimal point moving so front purple are 72.8 n/cm as that = 6.44 lb

Do you mean lb/in?

You may be right about the decimal point, but those readings (on the yokomo.eu chart) are straight off the Gforce spring rate gauge. I bought one, and I was wondering the same after using it. Anyone got a gauge tester?

OK, I pulled out the AE Yellow front spring, rated at 3.75lb (lb/in or lbf?) by AE.
Measured on the gauge gives a value of 6.227N/cm. Using web based unit converters these convert to 0.551 ib/in.
Moving decimal as you suggest gives 62.27N/cm = 5.51lb/in.
Clearly not the AE rated value of 3.75lb!
AE front whites = 3.30lb, measured 5.450N/cm or 54.50 = 4.81lb/in

Something is not right.

I only have AE spring sets with their "known" values, plus the Yokomo springs sets rated by colour.
I'm not sure I trust the AE ratings, given they are lb (mass), not lb/in (torque). Unless they mean pound-force (lbf) (force)?
Either way you can't convert a unit of mass or force into a unit of torque. Related, but different things.

Maybe the AE ratings are arbitrary, just like the colours. so it matters not what the actual values are only that they are heavier or lighter compared to the others in the set. This ties you into a set, and makes conversion between brands difficult and a bit of guess work, which in turn makes you go out and buy the full set.

I guess then the point of the spring rate gauge is so you can check your own springs for match, and to measure them all yourself so you can compare against that scale.

[neallewis]

Neal, please carry on with your calculations. Would still be good to see how the old Yokomo and the Associated springs fit in with the newer Yokomo springs.

I will, even to justify the cost of the spring gauge to myself ;-)
It's a bit of spreadsheet hell, and I'm super busy at work right now, but I'll get it done soon as.
I've got original Yokomo bmax set, Yatabe arena set and the new Yokomo YZ-2 set, plus AE big bore set. It's a bit of a task with them all set out on the bench :thumbsup:

[PaulRotheram]

a comparison between the ae big bores and the new springs would be very appreciative from my self. They're what im planning to use so any reference to what the team drivers will use would be beneficial.

[RogerM]

Neal, N/cm to lb/in is simply a case of multiplying the N/cm number by 0.571401

If you do that with the AE whites in your example you get 3.11lb/in ... now if the displacement on your gauge was only an effective 95mm then that would be spot on.

By effective displacement I mean that it is entirely possible that the first few mm are just "settling" everything down and not actually compressing the spring, this will be amplified if there is any slop in the plunger at all or the springs aren't dead straight.

To get around this I suggest you pre-compress the spring by a few mm (5mm would be fine) and make sure that when you displace your gauges plunger by 1cm it achieves the full 1cm of travel.

That way the numbers will be much more consistent.

When I tested AE springs on my work's tensile/compressive tester (£50k worth) they were with in 1%

Hope that helps

[Allan1875]

N/cm to lb/in is simply a case of multiplying the N/cm number by 0.571401



You are an absolute top lad mate :). At least that lets me stick them in a spreadsheet and get close now. :thumbsup:

[neallewis]

Neal, N/cm to lb/in is simply a case of multiplying the N/cm number by 0.571401

If you do that with the AE whites in your example you get 3.11lb/in ... now if the displacement on your gauge was only an effective 95mm then that would be spot on.

By effective displacement I mean that it is entirely possible that the first few mm are just "settling" everything down and not actually compressing the spring, this will be amplified if there is any slop in the plunger at all or the springs aren't dead straight.

To get around this I suggest you pre-compress the spring by a few mm (5mm would be fine) and make sure that when you displace your gauges plunger by 1cm it achieves the full 1cm of travel.

That way the numbers will be much more consistent.

When I tested AE springs on my work's tensile/compressive tester (£50k worth) they were with in 1%

Hope that helps

Hi Roger, yes I can convert from N/cm to LB/in, thats easy as you say...

My point being with AE springs, they give the rating in 'lb' not lb/in or lbf. Which do they mean, as there is a difference, one is a force, the other a torque?

The spring gauge travel is exactly 10.0mm, hence N/cm. There is no slop, it's very well machined.
I position the spring compressed a few mm, zero the gauge, compress 10mm then read of result.

As I described above the results are way off AE expected, so either the gauge is junk, or something else is wrong?

[neallewis]

You are an absolute top lad mate :). At least that lets me stick them in a spreadsheet and get close now. :thumbsup:

It's not so simple Allan I'm afraid. Please be my guest and try it, and report back the numbers you get.
Convert the numbers from this chart to lb/in, but you still can't compare them with the AE springs (with AE ratings), until I measure them on my gauge as well.


I'll probably have to do all the yok and ae springs, get the results into a table and show both N/cm and lb/in on that, ignoring the stamped ratings from ae.

[neallewis]

When I tested AE springs on my work's tensile/compressive tester (£50k worth) they were with in 1%


Did you happen to tabulate your results when you tested? I'd be interested to see that spreadsheet. thanks.

[J'MM'N]

I position the spring compressed a few mm, zero the gauge, compress 10mm then read of result.

As I described above the results are way off AE expected, so either the gauge is junk, or something else is wrong?
Hi Neal, do you get different readings if you compress the spring 25.5mm (1") or is it the same rate as compressing 10mm.

I know nothing about how this works but if AE is calculated lb/in, can you not compress them 25.5mm to get a N/cm and then convert to lb/in. Or does it just give you the same rating as compressing 10mm.

[neallewis]

Hi Neal, do you get different readings if you compress the spring 25.5mm (1") or is it the same rate as compressing 10mm.

I know nothing about how this works but if AE is calculated lb/in, can you not compress them 25.5mm to get a N/cm and then convert to lb/in. Or does it just give you the same rating as compressing 10mm.

I see where you are going with this...
The torque is a measure of force over a set compression distance (10mm).
I couldn't accurately compress 1" with this gauge.

AE quote a weight or force rating, not a torque.

[Allan1875]

It's not so simple Allan I'm afraid. Please be my guest and try it, and report back the numbers you get.
Convert the numbers from this chart to lb/in, but you still can't compare them with the AE springs (with AE ratings), until I measure them on my gauge as well.


I'll probably have to do all the yok and ae springs, get the results into a table and show both N/cm and lb/in on that, ignoring the stamped ratings from ae.

I know mate, they are still out but what I was gonna do was take the example above by how much out the AE spring was, then try factor that in with a calculation.

I am gonna mess with it just now, let you know how I get on.

[RogerM]

Neal,

The AE springs where all with in 1% of stated values which are indeed in lb/in (lb mass per inch displacement).
Torque would be lb-in (lb mass multiplied by inch displacement).

[neallewis]

Neal,

The AE springs where all with in 1% of stated values which are indeed in lb/in (lb mass per inch displacement).
Torque would be lb-in (lb mass multiplied by inch displacement).

Penny just dropped... I've googled lb/in and it automagically converts your search to lb-in! you can't search for /!!!

Right, after a conversation with Allan, I'm back on track.

Bloody waste of time that degree in engineering was :thumbsup:

[Andrius]

Recently purchased YZ-2. Really nice bit of kit. Wondering any chance to make stock springs work good on carpet? Anyone can share stock spring shock setup for carpet pls? thanks

[Adam F]

Best bet is to try Tom C's silverstone setup earlier in the Thread, although you will need slightly stiffer springs..

[Allan1875]

Recently purchased YZ-2. Really nice bit of kit. Wondering any chance to make stock springs work good on carpet? Anyone can share stock spring shock setup for carpet pls? thanks

Tom C's setyp with stock springs will work fine on carpet. I tried the kit springs and all I lost out on was initial turn in as the carpet was a bit lazy but apart from that, decent enough.

I'd advise picking up Yatabe Orange for the front (YAS) and Green (YAS) for rear.

[Andrius]

Just ordered Yatabe front orange and purple rear springs before i read Alans post. Never mind, will use bigger pistons or thinner shock oil in the rear. First time going out with 1/10 2wd buggy. :)

[Andrius]

Wondering how durable YZ2 is? probably to early to take decisions, i hope i wont regret my new purchase. how durable bmax2 was? thanks

[mes]

The B-Max2 is a very durable car, I have broken two or three parts in total in three years.

[Andrius]

The B-Max2 is a very durable car, I have broken two or three parts in total in three years.

Sounds great. Hope YZ2 keeps same durability. Thanks

[PaulRotheram]

Has anything been rectified with official rates for these new springs? I'm baffled there's still nothing on petit rc, the springs they have are not the new yatabes being used.

It's making setup comparison very hard at the moment.

[Allan1875]

Has anything been rectified with official rates for these new springs? I'm baffled there's still nothing on petit rc, the springs they have are not the new yatabes being used.

It's making setup comparison very hard at the moment.

Nothing. If you look at the petitrc big bore chart that has all springs, there is a more accurate version on there.

I have collated them into a spreadsheet for easier viewing, please see attached. I don't believe it's a 100% accurate but it's certainly a lot more accurate than the previous one.

I believe Neal is still working on this.

[neallewis]

I believe Neal is still working on this.

In theory yes, but silly busy at work right now so not had a moment to measure them. My collection of new yz2 springs are still in packets.

[RDG 40]

Anyone finish this chart, just trying to compare associated springs

[11Gtollman]

I use these two spring charts to compare my associated springs with the yokomo ones and the yatabe ones. Come in handy quite often as they hav the same measurements. And I think it's pretty accurate?