TRF501X build

[stefke]

Since the "TRF501X in production" thread is becoming quite long, perhaps it is time to start some other threads about the car. Since I'm in the process of building mine, first one about the construction.

First : I'm not the first to notice, but the packaging of the TRF501 is not as logical as the AE or Losi cars i've build over the last years. Parts are not packaged together in building steps and you can have a hard time looking for the right screw, bearing, washer, etc. In older Tamiya cars, the bags were clearly identified and every part listed in the instruction manual mentioned the parts bag it was in. This is not the case in the TRF. On the other hand, the instructions are very clear and classic tamiya quality.

Secondly : On constructing the slipper clutch, I noticed that it was quite easy to build it with a rather dramatic wobble of the spur gear. After 3 rebuilds, it was fine though.

third : although the screws are definately better then with the ZX5, be carefull when tightening them and use a quality hex driver or you will round them.

Starting on the diffs now.

BTW, I noticed the manual doesn't mention the use of the bleeding holes on the shocks.

[FifteenthNeo]

Well, considering there seems to be a few members on here that have the 501, there seems to be a lack of finished painted bodies. Had anyone finished one yet?

[DCM]

heh, maybe it is due to a painter taking a week off from painting over christmas :D

[FifteenthNeo]

heh, maybe it is due to a painter taking a week off from painting over christmas :D

Have you anything planned, bodyshell wise. Has anyone tried fitting an MR4-BX shell over the top of the TRF501X?

[Elliott Hopkins]

The DI didn't have the labelled bags that the older Tamiya cars had.

Neo do you still have your DI? Or have you traded it in for an antique XX4?

Elliott.

[DCM]

you could probably get a BX shell to fit....

[FifteenthNeo]

The DI didn't have the labelled bags that the older Tamiya cars had.

Neo do you still have your DI? Or have you traded it in for an antique XX4?

Elliott.

I got rid mate and bagged myself a cracking B4. Didnt realise they were such a nice car. Got a XX4WE on its way too. Couldnt make my mind up really. I wanted the 501X but couldnt bring myself to get one. XX4 is a bit dated, but its race pedigree does speak for itself. Plus I wanted one years ago when I first started racing lol.

Back on topic. How is spares support for this buggy? I, myself, aint coming across a lot of spares on the net?

[kentech]

I already posted the link regarding my TRF501X build some days ago in the other thread...here it is again though.

The 501X has been built for some days already but today I posted the final photos. I have posted some comments along with many photos here:

http://kentech.blogs.se

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c99/kentech/150-5080_IMG.jpg

[TRF_Tastic]

Generaly happy with the build, the only issues that Im left to deal with are getting rid of the nasty standard turnbuckles for Titanium ones, (there seems to be a world shortage at the moment) and getting the shell sprayed!! Although I think that I have a plan for that.

[HairySteve]

Just uploaded a few pics of mine, unfortunately they were taken at the back of the shop where it's a bit dark. I've put it side by side with my DF-03 as a comparison. I've done a very similar paint job (fluorescent green backed with silver, and gunmetal) but haven't bothered painting the wing :D Unfortunately the other day while runnign the car around to try and bed in the gearing and the tyres it skidded at high speed and clipped a wall, breaking a front upright... :mad: I've asked one of my mates to order me a couple of parts so fingers crossed it'll be back up and running soon. :) Anyway, pictures...
http://images.domino.org/d/91489-1/DCP_1433.JPG
http://images.domino.org/d/91492-1/DCP_1434.JPG
http://images.domino.org/d/91501-2/DCP_1437.JPG
I'll get another body some time and give it to someone who can actually paint... :D
-Steve

[Hog]

Steve leave 'em that colour. It'll be fun watching you race outside on the grass at Faversham trying to see where they've gone!:D

[Bathy]

What tyres do you have fitted on your cars HairySteve? They look like something from the 80's :D

Cars look good mind, racing on grass is going to be interesting mind!

[HairySteve]

Bathy those are Schumacker fullspike yellows, about the only things that work at the Faversham track (wooden floor).... :D I should be able to see where my car is on grass, the colour's bright enough and if I do lose it I'll just carry on driving til someone complains about me shunting them off the track... ;) I'm looking forward to getting the 501 up and running in next years outdoor series, should be a laugh. I'm thinking of getting an X6 to run in 2WD as well, I find electric so much easier and more fun than nitro, no mucking around with engines or anything, just plug the battery in and off you go... :D
-Steve

[ramdrive]

Just completed my build...

The one tip I will give is watch the shim sizes. I built the spur with the wrong size and it was quite tight when seated. I rebuilt using the correct size and the spur is now very free. In fact the whole car will freewheel for a good couple of meters on my kitchen floor.

Must say the build was very easy, just waiting for my Novak 5.5r to arrive. Oh and getting the body painted by a pro hopefully.

Colin

[HairySteve]

Sounds like I'll be rebuilding mine with less shims then :rolleyes: What about belt tension, has anyone else noticed that the instructions settings are quite tight? One of my mates reckons I should go a bit looser on the belts, the guide pulleys on the centre gearbox should stop the belts jumping. Also has anyone figured out if the TRF uses 48 pitch or 0.5mod gearing yet? ;) If it's definitely 48 pitch then I'll get some Corally long pinions on order for mine...
-Steve

[FifteenthNeo]

Steve, judging by this link, they are 48dp
http://www.stellamodels.net/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=2784




Merry Xmas ;)

[ramdrive]

What electronics setups are you guys running in your TRF501X's?

I need a bit of inspiration :confused:

[HairySteve]

Cheers Neo, that's useful to know :D Looks like I'll be phoning Helger next week to see if they have any of those Corally pinions... :) Ramdrive, I'm running a KO 2133 servo in mine (with metal gears), an LRP Quantum Pro Reverse speedo, and a Spektrum micro receiver with capacitor. Seems to go well. ;) I'm thinking of shoving a Novak GTB brushless in it, the 8.5 (27 turn equivalent) for indoor racing and the 4.5 or 5.5 for outdoor racing.
-Steve

[FifteenthNeo]

Steve, I could be wrong, but isnt the 13.5R from Novak the 27T equivalent?
Dont hold me to it though.

The 8.5 is a 15-17turn equivalent I think

[HairySteve]

Could be. I asked the CML rep last time he was in and he said it was the 8.5 but he may be wrong. :rolleyes: The 8.5 is rated at 5800KV (5800rpm per volt I think) so that's very quick, so you may well be right about it being the 13.5 instead. I'll have a look on Novak's website, that's probably easiest... :D
-Steve
EDIT Yep, I've just found http://www.teamnovak.com/products/brushless/ss13.5/index.html?article-id=182 this info on the 13.5. I've also been reading about the other Novak motors and it sounds like the 5.5 and 6.5 are going to be best for the outdoor series next year... 5.5 for high traction (like Faversham's grass field) or 6.5 for loose dirt.

[TRF_Tastic]

I'm running in mine a KO 2363 servo, KO 302F reciever and a Quantum Comp 2 speedo seems to run great for me.

[darren]

LRP QC2 ESC
Air 94361 Servo
Spektrum
Reedy 7 x 2

--- OR ---- (depending on conditions)

LRP SPHERE COMP.
Air 94361 Servo
NEO 2 Star
Spektrum

[rado-steve]

Could be. I asked the CML rep last time he was in and he said it was the 8.5 but he may be wrong. :rolleyes: The 8.5 is rated at 5800KV (5800rpm per volt I think) so that's very quick, so you may well be right about it being the 13.5 instead. I'll have a look on Novak's website, that's probably easiest... :D
-Steve
EDIT Yep, I've just found http://www.teamnovak.com/products/brushless/ss13.5/index.html?article-id=182 this info on the 13.5. I've also been reading about the other Novak motors and it sounds like the 5.5 and 6.5 are going to be best for the outdoor series next year... 5.5 for high traction (like Faversham's grass field) or 6.5 for loose dirt.

Bollox Man, get a 3.5 Whacked in :o

[HairySteve]

I'm not that good at driving... :D a 5.5 or 6.5 will be more than enough for me. ;) Besides if I get an X6 for the 2wd competitions next year (which I'm seriosuly considering) then I'll need two brushless setups... I'm buggered if I'm swapping the motors and speedos backward and forward between cars all the time... :rolleyes:
-Steve

[STEWART]

Going to a trophy race on Jan. 6 2007 will tell you guys what i think of the car, as it sits the shocks and springs feel a little on the soft side but i will try it first before changing rates and whts.:p 445

446

[stefke]

Build is complete. Just started the on the body.

I like the look of the body, but ..........
What were they thinking when designing a body with such weird shaped windows and NOT including window masks. :(

[neiloliver]

It is crazy not supplying masks. I guess Jimmy will make some for his review car and then these will be for sale. I still dont like the shell, why could they not make it a classic shape like the ZX5? But I guess there will be no mistaking what your driving...

[stefke]

Not including window masks must be part of the weird sence of homour of the japanese:D :
"Let's design an impossible window shape and look at all those dumb white boys mess around with masking tape" :rolleyes:

BTW, I love the body shape. It looks mean and fast.

[DCM]

Stop moaning and get on with it, lol, or you could pay for someone to spray it for you.....

As for window masks, they are nowt more than a pain in the butt!!!

[bender]

Below is a picture of my car, now painted.

I thought masking the windows was easy, it was trying to mask other areas of the body that was hard :wtf:

Dont judge it too harshly, I hate painting :rolleyes:

[Dunc]

Looks good to me, Bender!

I collected my kit on Thursday - started building yesterday after a bit of prep with the carbon bits.

I have some of the alloy TA05 outdrives on order to try, so I'm hanging on for those before I go much further.

Has anyone else noticed the spur gear doesn't appear to run perfectly true? Is this just a combination of the friction pads needing time to bed in, i.e. flatten, and that it's currently not meshed with a pinion gear?

Cheers,

Andy.

[neiloliver]

looks cool! maybe the shell will grow on me. You might want to put some tyres on otherwise it will slip on your kitchen floor..

N

[rado-steve]

Ran Mine Yesterday down my local club and bent a shock shaft 1st time out :mad: Pish Flaps! ope I can get spares :o

Does seem a bit soft though, running 40wt oil in front and 35 in rear, anyone else found any springs that fit????

Have also raised the height of the front ball studs and shortered the camber links front and rear to stop it pitching and rolling so much!

Pinions are a bit of an arse too, think I need some of those spangly corally ones!

[Dunc]

Associated springs should be a direct fit. I bought some as I've no idea what rate the kit springs are, plus I don't think Tamiya have any alternatives currently available.

[B4james]

Hi,

I am not sure if it is so but I have heard that the associated unobtanium shafts will fit so it might be worth checking this out. I am not sure if it was the fronts or rears that they did this with though.

I should be receiving my 501 kit today or tommorow so I will check it against my B4 and let you know

[Dunc]

I was thinking about Associated unobtanium shafts, but I'm a little worried that although in principle they may fit, the mix of metric/imperial will allow for slight leakage due to an improper seal.

Does anyone know how Losi and Associated's system works in terms of the shaft length - is it related to the stroke? The longest Losi do, for example, is 1.2" but surely the shaft itself is longer than this (tip to tip, including thread)?

I'm worried about the strength of the steel (aren't they?) turnbuckles and shock shafts in the TRF501X kit, so I was going to give the titanium equivalents from the MR4-BX a try. They are slightly different lengths though; shouldn't be a problem with the turnbuckles, and hopefully won't adversely affect the handling regarding the shock shafts. I'm pretty sure they'll be a direct fit, I'll check first though.

[rado-steve]

Associated shock shafts won't fit, tried these when I bent mine! Tamiya shock shaft diameter is 3mm and Associated is 3.15mm :(

[kentech]

I posted a setup for the 501 on my blog a few days ago that I scanned from the latest issue of RC Magazine (japan) .

see here: http://kentech.blogs.se

[STEWART]

Strange they list the shock pistons as #1 and #2 but the pistons in the kit are numbered #3 #4 and #5 , go figure?

[jimmy]

maybe running AE shocks and pistons ? The ae pistons don't fit the 501X shocks unless you give then a bit of sanding so probably not using them in the kit shocks.


OR perhaps they are referring to the pistons by their AE numbers, so the largest holes would be piston 1, smallest piston3

I have mine built with piston 1 rear and piston 3 front - same as my BJ4 worlds

[TRF_Tastic]

Turnbuckles, Associated do some nice Titanium ones that are the right size for the 501, the Yoke ones are a fraction too long, and speaking with RC Champ they are putting together a Lunsford set of the right size as well, however they are waiting on delivery.

As for shock shafts I have no idea, I was going to look at slinging on the up rated DF03 TRF style shocks to see if they worked, and I also seem to remember that Schumacher still have in stock the shock shafts for the CAT3000 in various lengths, might be worth looking at.

I have also tried Schumacher springs and they sort of work as well, might be worth a try.

[Captain Harlock]

What's the difference between the Aerational shocks of the 501 and the blue aluminum shocks made for the DF03?

The aerational ones do not look stylish at all and quite similar in design to the yokomo's and AE's.

[Dunc]

As far as titanium turnbuckles go I've just ordered some from 3racing, but I'm sure there are plenty of other possibilities. I got 38mm (spot on) and 48mm (ideally should be 46mm, but they don't do any).

The shock shafts are a slightly trickier problem. However, the Kyosho RB-Ultima Type-R Evolution uses titanium nitride shock shafts that are almost identical in length to those used by the TRF501X:

Front
Kyosho = 37mm (#W6003)
Tamiya = 36.5mm

Rear
Kyosho = 46mm (#W6004)
Tamiya = 45.4mm

I don't know the diameter of the Kyosho shafts for certain, but the various spacers used in the dampers do have internal diameters of 3mm (the manual is available on the Kyosho website).

Plus, I'm assuming Kyosho quote the length using the same definition as Tamiya, i.e. from the lower edge of the lower circlip (used to secure the piston) to the end of the shaft (including the thread). Anyone know any different?

Does this sound like a reasonable solution or have I missed something obvious to everyone, but me?! :confused: :D

[Dunc]

Repeat post - doh! :D

[TRF_Tastic]

Dunc wouldnt mind knowing where you can get hold of those shafts from, if you could give us a clue I would be grateful.

Cheers

[Dunc]

Kyosho have a pretty good presence in the UK now, so I assume most model shops should be able to get hold of the shock shafts for you. Try http://www.kyoshoeurope.com for a list of main stockists.

Personally, I was going to get some bits from RC Champ anyway, so may just tag the shock shafts onto my order.

Whatever route you choose, hopefully they shouldn't prove too difficult to come by.

Did my post convinve you to give them a try too, then?! :)

[TRF_Tastic]

It will save me from going through all my Spare shock shafts to find one that might work.

[rado-steve]

Kyosho have a pretty good presence in the UK now, so I assume most model shops should be able to get hold of the shock shafts for you. Try http://www.kyoshoeurope.com for a list of main stockists.

Personally, I was going to get some bits from RC Champ anyway, so may just tag the shock shafts onto my order.

Whatever route you choose, hopefully they shouldn't prove too difficult to come by.

Did my post convinve you to give them a try too, then?! :)

Just ordered some from RC Champ, they are Special order Only :( 5-6 days from Tamiya! Arse!

Anyone Had any Luck with Pinions BTW?????

[Dunc]

Steve, were you just trying to order more of the standard shock shafts from RC-Champ?

It looks like the Kyosho shafts are a no go down to lack of availability. There appear to be some of the rear ones around, but RC-Champ said Kyosho had sold out of the front ones. A call to Kyosho UK confirmed the fronts are not available and they have zero stock of the rears. Kyosho USA have some fronts, but don't ship to the UK!

I'm going back to plan A and will try the Yokomo shafts. They're not quite the right length, but I'd rather have something that isn't going to bend. I'm being lent a set, so should be able to confirm their diameter in the next day or so.

You never know, they may be better. They should at least suffice until Tamiya (hopefully) release their own version.

If people are interested the Yokomo part numbers are:

40.7mm titanium nitride coated shock shaft #YS-5S-2T
43.5mm titanium nitride coated shock shaft #YS-5M-2T

[Dunc]

Regarding pinions, Helger do the Corally long boss ones. These should do the trick and are good quality.

[rado-steve]

Champ Can get them, they are just special order only at the mo!

[KingBob]

Glad to see i'm not the only one with shock shaft problems.

My 501 had it's maiden race this evening, got hit headon by another driver who was out of control, and actually snapped the shaft where the thread starts. Now i too need to find a replacement :(

[jimmy]

man thats bad luck - I have three sets each of front wishbones, hubs and hub carriers as well as some other bits, never broke or bent a shock shaft in my life so didn't think of it.
Its not a stopper though, stick some B4 front shocks on and carry on racing like it never happened ! :)

[DCM]

Just a thought, might be worth trying a set of Dark Impact shock shafts?? they are about the same length?

[Elliott Hopkins]

The kit shock shafts are rubbish (bendy).

Elliott.

[Dunc]

Do Tamiya use a different material for the Dark Impact shock shafts - I've not seen anything to suggest they do?

[TRF_Tastic]

Dunc the uprated TRF style DI shocks do look like they use a different material.

Just had to replace the reciever in my 501, what a pain in the arse job that was, re-routed the arial to use an old schumacher arial mount using the RHS undertray mounting screw as a fixing point, now no more trying to thread the arial wire through the bulk head.

[Dunc]

It's not very clear, they appear to be bog standard steel to me from all the pics I've seen. But then it's very difficult to judge on looks alone. Can any owners confirm material and length (from lower circlip groove to the end of the thread)?

I've not installed, or even used, it yet, but I have a Futaba 2.4GHz system for my 3VCS. The receiver has no external aerial wire at all, just a small 'nodule' on its upper surface. Very cool! :cool:

[jimmy]

the aerial wire routing is indeed crap at best - ok if you leave your receiver in but I can't afford another receiver so need to remove it after ever race to put in another car

[TRF_Tastic]

Dunc you poseur!!!

[Dunc]

Sorry, but I've been dying to get that in somewhere! :D

[Elliott Hopkins]

The threaded shock shafts are thicker.

[KingBob]

Anyone know the lengths of the DI shock shafts?

[Dunc]

The threaded shock shafts are thicker.

Elliott, I'm not sure I understand you - what threaded shock shafts?

[Dunc]

I've been able to get hold of a set of MR4-BX shock shafts and it turns out Yokomo quote the total length. This means the front (40.7mm) ones are virtually identical to the Tamiya, whilst the rears are around 5mm too short. So, I think I'm going to try the Yokomo shafts on the front and Tamiya at the rear so as to not upset the balance too much (hopefully the rears should be better protected and so less prone to bending).

I was confusing myself, but the Yokomo shafts are still steel. Only the coating contains titanium. So I guess Tamiya have simply used a poor quality steel compared to Yokomo (and others).

Before I forget, the Yoke shafts are definitely 3mm in diameter.

Hope that helps some people. :)

[Elliott Hopkins]

The shafts for the threaded uprated shocks (part #53926). That was a bit confusing wasn't it.

Elliott.

[rado-steve]

I've been able to get hold of a set of MR4-BX shock shafts and it turns out Yokomo quote the total length. This means the front (40.7mm) ones are virtually identical to the Tamiya, whilst the rears are around 5mm too short. So, I think I'm going to try the Yokomo shafts on the front and Tamiya at the rear so as to not upset the balance too much (hopefully the rears should be better protected and so less prone to bending).

I was confusing myself, but the Yokomo shafts are still steel. Only the coating contains titanium. So I guess Tamiya have simply used a poor quality steel compared to Yokomo (and others).

Before I forget, the Yoke shafts are definitely 3mm in diameter.

Hope that helps some people. :)

Do you have the broke-omo part number????

[TRF_Tastic]

Raced the 501 for the first time today and it ran ace, compared it with my pred, and it was far more predicatable to drive, however the kit settings are awefull for carpet, but overall here I have to say I had a blast racing buggies indoors today, 501 ace investment, Pred, managed to knock a corner off every race, and the brushless B4 that was just plain insane!!!!

[jimmy]

Just painted and stickered the shell, then put it on the car and noticed the rear end is super low. I dont have the undertray on there yet but the rear of the shell is well below the chassis..
There are no cut lines on the bottom of the shell but the manual shows it being cut straight.. Anyone else found this or have I dont something wrong ? :o



http://www.oople.com/rc/photos/misc/501xpaint02.jpg

http://www.oople.com/rc/photos/misc/501xpaint01.jpg

http://www.oople.com/rc/photos/misc/501xpaint03.jpg

[TRF_Tastic]

Loving the shell Jimmy, especialy the nice stickers down the side very good indeed!

Also what tires are you running on yours?

Also what springs are you using as well, sorry to be a pain with all the questions!

[Dunc]

Do you have the broke-omo part number????

Steve,

You should find the Yokomo part numbers in one of my posts on page 3 of this thread.

Cheers,

Andy.

[jimmy]

Hiaya mate, thanks! I spent a while on the shell (for me) and it wasa bit of a paint to cut those lines around the flames by hand for the chrome but worth it.

I will be running schumacher mini spikes but I put these dark impact tyres on for photos (as I have no schumachers yet)

Springs are AE blue front and green rear and it's what people generally use on the BJ4 worlds in the UK - so I thought I'd try them first

[Dunc]

Looking sharp, Jimmy!

Puts my effort to shame :( :D

Haven't trimmed my shell out yet, but you're right about the manual in that it shows a straight line for the lower edge.....

[Elliott Hopkins]

I say James that's a heady purple and lilac mix and a not-so-subtle 'diss' to the UK distributor. I think I've found some new wallpaper.

What's a touring car?

[telboy]

spot on jimmy! that shell is awesome. I only hope my attempt comes out as good as yours!:o

The chrome does finish the flames off nicely though even if it is a pain to cut by hand, but then, thats how I do ALL of the shells i paint :wtf: . Well worth the effort though.

did you make the 501x skull stickers too?

[jimmy]

Thanks mate.
Btw I think the reddy colour / pinky colour is in fact irredescent RED not violet or whatever.. it looks violet mixed with the purple.. I used red on this though.

I am a bit impatient with stuff like this and prefer to jump straight in - so airbrushing doesn't really suit me tbh, It just frustrates me.
I did all the stickers yeah, I thought the included ones were alright but I really like to do as much work as possible on the review cars! lol

[B4james]

Jimmy, wow what a paint job

I'm seriously loving it, I have sent my shell of for someone to airbrush and are getting them to paint in the 501 TRF scheme but instead of pink and the light blue they are doing a chrome section and fluro orange/yellow shading.

If it turns out half as good as yours I will be more than happy

[dallasv8]

the paint on that body is sweet.it would be a shame to get it dirty :)

[telboy]

I did all the stickers yeah

how did you make them?

[jimmy]

I drew them quickly in alias sketchbook pro, vectorised them in illustrator and tidied them up a lil bit, then set them up to print like all my stickers.

[Chris]

Hiaya mate, thanks! I spent a while on the shell (for me) and it wasa bit of a paint to cut those lines around the flames by hand for the chrome but worth it.

I will be running schumacher mini spikes but I put these dark impact tyres on for photos (as I have no schumachers yet)

Springs are AE blue front and green rear and it's what people generally use on the BJ4 worlds in the UK - so I thought I'd try them first

Are the tamiya springs (included in the kit) softer, harder or the same as the AE springs you used?

The rear body post is too low, you will notice when use the undertray.

[jimmy]

I can only remember the fronts, which are softer than the AE blues but harder than AE silver (next one down from blue) from what I can remember. This is holding both springs against each other and compressing them in the hand to see which one compressed first.

is there anything I can do about the rear body post ? Have I used a wrong part ?!? seems a bit silly that the rear of the shell is so low. I really don't want to cut it again :(

[stefke]

I just dumped the bodyposts and use the velcro. I prefer it to clips anyway.

[jimmy]

How is the undertray ? is it holding on ok ? I've not put mine on yet but it seems, looking at the manual, to be rather poorly attached.
The Yokomo BX has the front of the undertray under the front bumper, but the 501X is held on with tape - it just looks like it will catch on something and "peel back" in a rather nasty way, collecting dirt and grass as it goes.:eh?:

[TRF_Tastic]

Jimmy I have used two of the screws that normaly go into the blukhead to secure the front of the undertray which has seemed to have done the job admirably, with some more screws at the rear.

[jimmy]

Good thinking. I might try that approach also. I cut the undertray out but left a little extra up front and was going to try and tuc this under the bumper - but I think it will only cause problems now I think about it.

[Chris]

I can only remember the fronts, which are softer than the AE blues but harder than AE silver (next one down from blue) from what I can remember. This is holding both springs against each other and compressing them in the hand to see which one compressed first.

is there anything I can do about the rear body post ? Have I used a wrong part ?!? seems a bit silly that the rear of the shell is so low. I really don't want to cut it again :(

I have the same problem. If I race carpet with the car, I race only the upper shell. I created a new rear body posts like on the proto versions.

Can you compare the rear springs too? (tamiya vs AE green)

[jimmy]

Looking at it, the shell seems to be designed for two heights, one low down which sits low over the cells (no vertical corallys then) and low over the slipper layshaft (which would maybe rule out some high ESCs around there)

The moulding definately gives the option of running it higher though. I really dont wanna cut half my airbrushing off :( so I will leave it high i guess

[rado-steve]

Looking at it, the shell seems to be designed for two heights, one low down which sits low over the cells (no vertical corallys then) and low over the slipper layshaft (which would maybe rule out some high ESCs around there)

The moulding definately gives the option of running it higher though. I really dont wanna cut half my airbrushing off :( so I will leave it high i guess

Running Vertical corally's on mine no probs, Cut the shell right along the bottom, ditched the body posts (Body posts are gay on an off road car :D) and just used the velcro!

The Body has a nice hump that even a Novak brushless with fan can sit in :)

[rado-steve]

D'oh double post!

[rado-steve]

If people are interested the Yokomo part numbers are:

40.7mm titanium nitride coated shock shaft #YS-5S-2T
43.5mm titanium nitride coated shock shaft #YS-5M-2T


Cheers Dunc!!!

[Dunc]

No probs, just remember that whilst the front shaft should be a perfect fit the 43.5mm shaft is approx. 5mm too short for the rear and hence it's probably not a good idea to run it (you'll lose a lot of droop).

However, all is not lost as Yokomo appear to do a longer shaft that should be ideal for the rear:

49.6mm titanium nitride coated shock shaft #YS-5L-2T

Try this link: http://www.yokomousa.com/catalog/yok_catalog_hires.pdf

The shafts you want are on page 21, in the parts list for the MR4-BC.

:)

[jimmy]

The screws have pi$$3d me off!

I heard of others stripping them, and I was careful not to over tighten any - but taking the screws out of the bulkheads to attach the undertray 2 stripped out totally. Bah! What is the idea of sinking in the head slightly so you get EVEN less depth for the driver than the already shallow head ?

http://www.oople.com/rc/photos/misc/crapcrews.jpg

I don't like to mix my words, so I'll say these screws are actually crap for the purpose. No way you want to be wrenching on this car in a hurry at the track and risk the screw slipping like this. After this one stripped I was super careful and put loads of pressure on the others to make sure they didn't slip, but one did.
My new 501X is tainted :(

So, my next question - anyone released a proper screw kit for this car yet ?

p.s. anyone want to buy a car I can't take apart ?

[TRF_Tastic]

Jimmy, RC champ have done a screw kit that is for this car, I couldnt wait so I ordered the 3 racing ti screw kit for the Cyclone, most of the screws are the same and just used that instead.

[bigred5765]

break out the dremmel and a cutting disk?
i would be ,issed of to on a new car

[jimmy]

I am just wiping my eyes still. Sniff..
I will look into those screws, thanks

Anyone know a way to get these screws out without wrecking the chassis? I know the dremel cutting disc trick but it would make a mess with these CS low profile screws.

[bigred5765]

I am just wiping my eyes still. Sniff..
I will look into those screws, thanks

Anyone know a way to get these screws out without wrecking the chassis? I know the dremel cutting disc trick but it would make a mess with these CS low profile screws.

wear the disc down first so its real small in diameter not much bigger than the screw, so it doesnt cut the chassie

[Dunc]

Jimmy, I appreciate it's not as much use to you now, but I mentioned before on the other 501X thread a good place for stainless steel screws:

http://www.stagonset.co.uk/fasteners?output_frontpage=yes&cart_id=2375909_23212

Just use the parts summary in the back of the manual and away you go! They only do down to M3, but that's the vast majority in the kit. I got a set + spares for around £15 (inc P&P) and you should receive them within a couple of days. I've not come close to stripping a head yet, either on the Tamiya or my Pred.

Is there anyway way you can file/cut a slot in the head of the screw to get it out with a blade srewdriver?

[jimmy]

Good idea carl, I might try that

[jimmy]

Cheers dunc
I came nowhere near stripping the heads when installing them - but I couldnt beleive how tight they were to get back out! nothing I could do to stop it stripping. the driver was a tight fit and I applied proper man-pressure on it! haha

[Dunc]

Wow, what a flurry of posts! Clearly I'm a bit slower than most :D

[bigred5765]

other than that you need a specialist screw remover kit and small drills and a bench drill (big job)

[Elliott Hopkins]

3 Racing screws are ... and what is the technical term now ... the bollocks. I have a set in my DI. Sleek sexy and they feel as hard as nails.

Elliott.

[Dunc]

I applied proper man-pressure on it! haha

:D

I'm sure no-one doubts your manliness, Jimmy! Like you say, just shoddy screws, which seems to be quite a prevalent trend these days. Or is it just me?.....

[jimmy]

well, I made sure the rest were ok, and stripped another in the process.. it is really just the counter sunk screws into metal that are the problem. The button heads are OK.
Really peed me off has that though, it was all looking so nice, now I have a chewed up car

[DCM]

Jim, drill the head off, 3mm, or a 3.1mm drill bit, that should pop the head off, then you can get to the other side and remove the screw with mole-grips.

[telboy]

p.s. anyone want to buy a car I can't take apart ?

I'll give you a tenner for it!:D after all its knackered now.

I had the same problem with my 415msx. I put all the screws in the same way, tightened them lightly and just 'pinched' them tight. came to remove some for the same reason (to fit an undertay and underbody) and they were STUPIDLY tight and two screws stripped big time. I too was gutted and the only way to do it wasthe dremmel technique :( . I hadn't run the car so it wasn't that they'd worked tight from vibration etc. So I ended up with some little marks on the lovely new chassis.

fortunatley you cant see them now because of all the other scratches on there.

[jimmy]

same! I just pinched them tight, nothing silly.. but removing is another story! its like king kong broke into the house and tightened the hell out of them - and ran off laughing.

All three stripped heads are probably screws I dont need to use for now anyway, I have the undertray half-fastened on which should do. but still, I will have to deal with it at some point :(

[DCM]

Top tip, drop some blue threadlock (from your autoparts store) and don't nip them, just bottom the screws out. Probably the thread is a little harsh in the bulkhead and screws a little soft.

Give you a Tenner and a box of maltesers.....

[bender]

I had the same issues with the countersunk screws on both my MSX and Evo 5 too!

Yes, the standard c'sunk screws are crap (the recess for the driver is too short), but you'll also find its due to the steel screws "galling" with the allloy pieces. ie: they lock together, (I think galling is the right word, it's been a long time since I've had to remember this stuff).

I put some better quality screws on my car as soon as I got it, plus I put a little bit of silicone lube on the threads before screwing them in - this seems to help with the galling.

I found that if all else fails, a dremel with a round milling bit will remove enough of the head for you to pull the part off, or the vibration from the dremel will eventually loosen it.

[telboy]

Give you a Tenner and a box of maltesers.....

jimmy I'll give you a tenner....no, make that £10.25 and a whole box of celebrations!!!

BEAT THAT!:cool:

[TRF_Tastic]

Jimmy thanks for the tip about the B4 spring set, ran it last night on carpet with the B4 springs Red rear and blue front and it was magic, stuck just like it was a touring car, but a bit baggier!!! Anyone wanna buy my spare Pred? As this car is the nuts!!!

[jimmy]

nice one mate! red rear sounds a bit harsh I have to say, did you try different one on the rear like silver, gray, blue etc? I think red are super hard ?
Either way, if it works then thats cool. I guess without an anti-roll bar it might need something a bit stiffer, especially if its not a bumpy track.
Anyway, looking forward to running this car, it looks great

[Fabs]

I had the same issues with the countersunk screws on both my MSX and Evo 5 too!

Yes, the standard c'sunk screws are crap (the recess for the driver is too short), but you'll also find its due to the steel screws "galling" with the allloy pieces. ie: they lock together, (I think galling is the right word, it's been a long time since I've had to remember this stuff).

I put some better quality screws on my car as soon as I got it, plus I put a little bit of silicone lube on the threads before screwing them in - this seems to help with the galling.

I found that if all else fails, a dremel with a round milling bit will remove enough of the head for you to pull the part off, or the vibration from the dremel will eventually loosen it.

"galling" as you call it only happens when both materials are the same, which isn't the case here. And if you use a decent driver, there isn't any problem with the steel screws. I've been running TRF cars for 6 years now and stopped stripping them screws when I got a Hudy driver.

[stefke]

stripped one screw .... with a new Hudy driver :rolleyes:

[MattW]

I suspect the "problem" might actually be that they have matched the screw head angle to the countersink angle on the chassis.

Now obviously this is what you should do - but it does mean that the screw will grip the carbon very tightly - which is why you struggle to get them out!!

[jimmy]

"galling" as you call it only happens when both materials are the same, which isn't the case here. And if you use a decent driver, there isn't any problem with the steel screws. I've been running TRF cars for 6 years now and stopped stripping them screws when I got a Hudy driver.

The fact is that the screws took a LOT more force to remove than insert. The screws are poorly designed for the task, the hex is too shallow. You shouldn't gloat because you do not have this problem, many of us have quality drivers with a good fit, but that much force running through a shallow hex is not good. I unscrewed every screw last night with great care but still stripped one more.

There is a problem, since I am not thick but still managed to strip three screws - obviously with your many years of ownership of these "unique" screws, you are accustomed to their frailties, but I was not. I suspect other people will have the same problem (read this thread) so it's part of the review to mention when something is a problem. And they are indeed a problem - for whatever reason. Perhaps if Tamiya included a Hudy driver (I see nothing wrong with mine!) the we wouldn't be having this conversation.:eh?::o:eh?:

[jimmy]

I suspect the "problem" might actually be that they have matched the screw head angle to the countersink angle on the chassis.

Now obviously this is what you should do - but it does mean that the screw will grip the carbon very tightly - which is why you struggle to get them out!!

Thanks matt
Would that not happen on the screws into plastic also though ? There was no problem at all there - but maybe those parts are just not quite as tightly installed? I tightened all the parts the same, but most of the ones into alloy were quite hard (or virtually impossible) to remove :eh?:

[DCM]

the plastic has some 'lubricating' qualities, where as the Carbon Fibre will grip the screw head, as the name suggest, fibres are aligned and will resist being turned the other way.

[jimmy]

These are all in the countersunk chassis I mean dcm, it is just things like the servo mounts (plastic), versus things like the alloy bulkheads. but all butted up against the carbon fibre

Anyway, drove it in the kitchen for the first time tonight! yay!
I am impressed with the bluebird servo I have to say, its rock steady and very quick - not as quick as my 2123 but quick enough.

[KingBob]

Have been in touch with Rainbowten in japan, and they've provided these prices for 501x parts which aren't in their stock list. They get them direct from Tamiya basically.

Wing, part#: 1834018 = 1320yen
Sticker, Part#: 9494096 = 800yen
Universal shaft bag, Part#: 9404707 = 4800yen
Shaft bag, part#: 9404708 = 1160yen
ball bearing bag, part#:9404706 = 4800yen
Front shock shaft, part#: 9804292 = 330yen
Front Damper stay, part# 4304075 = 1200yen
Rear Damper stay, part#: 4304076 = 1560yen
Body, part#: 1824090 = 3100yen
Bottom-cover, part# = 1834019: 1740yen

[bender]

"galling" as you call it only happens when both materials are the same, which isn't the case here. And if you use a decent driver, there isn't any problem with the steel screws. I've been running TRF cars for 6 years now and stopped stripping them screws when I got a Hudy driver.

Between my Evo 5, MSX and now the 501X I've stripped 2 HUDY drivers - I've never even worn out any other tools previously in my 22 years of rc racing - so don't tell me there isn't anything wrong with the screws :mad:

I replaced them with some better ones (with a deeper hex) and now have NO problems - I can even take them out with one of those crappy allen-keys;)

[stegger]

These are all in the countersunk chassis I mean dcm, it is just things like the servo mounts (plastic), versus things like the alloy bulkheads. but all butted up against the carbon fibre

Anyway, drove it in the kitchen for the first time tonight! yay!
I am impressed with the bluebird servo I have to say, its rock steady and very quick - not as quick as my 2123 but quick enough.

I might be wrong here but i think it is called COLD WELDING and its an effect were by the steel and the alloy heat up and cool down at different temps:yawn:

[stegger]

Thinking about it a bit more jimmy you say its happening only on the chassis screws it could also be the carbon absorbing moisture:o I know some of us touring drivers used to boil some of the more brittle parts that had a higher carbon content in the plastics to make it less brittle;)

[TRF_Tastic]

Galling is not locaized to a single metal combination. Thread galling seems to be the most prevalent with fasteners made of stainless steel, aluminum, titanium, and other alloys which self-generate an oxide surface film for corrosion protection. During fastener tightening, as pressure builds between the contacting and sliding thread surfaces, protective oxides are broken, possibly wiped off, and interface metal high points shear or lock together. This cumulative clogging-shearing-locking action causes increasing adhesion. In the extreme, galling leads to seizing - the actual freezing together of the threads. If tightening is continued, the fastener can be twisted off or its threads ripped out.

I have been an aerospace engineer for over 15yrs and I have seen this happen many times, it is more apparent in single metal combinations but by no means localised to this, as I have seen it in disimilar metal combinations as well.

I do agree that a good driver is essential, however a good driver very rarely makes up for a poorly formed fastner.

[TRF_Tastic]

I suspect the "problem" might actually be that they have matched the screw head angle to the countersink angle on the chassis.

Now obviously this is what you should do - but it does mean that the screw will grip the carbon very tightly - which is why you struggle to get them out!!

Matt, I have never seen this happen on its own, however it could be a contributing factor to the problem, poorly formed fastner + galling effect + resistive surface friction from the fastner head.

Jimmy, the best way to remove the errant fastner is to drill the head off with a 3.1-3.2mm drill, (be carefull to just remove the head as you dont want to remove any of the shank, as this is what will provide you with the gripping surface) then remove all the other fastners, remove the bulkhead and then apply a liberal dose of WD40 or another penetrating lubricant and unscrew with a set of mole grips.

[KingBob]

Tamiya themselves say that you don't need threadlock on the metal into metal screws, perhaps there is a design feature of the thread that is designed to grip screws, to stop them vibrating out.

[Chaz]

Put some copper slip onto the threads, seemed to help me when i had this problem on my xray

Chaz

[telboy]

stripped one screw .... with a new Hudy driver

Mine were stripped using a hudy driver too. people said how good they were so i bought one.....and stripped screws with it straight away.:(

I managed to get 1 screw out using an old set i got from cml, propper steel ones. I now use these all the time and haven't had a problem with them.:)

[stefke]

You guys are all complaining, but the screws on my ZX5 were A LOT worse.

But I think I'm f***'ed because I used Loctite on all my metal in metal screws. :wtf:

[HairySteve]

I'm worried now! :( I always threadlock screws into metal and I Z42'd all the screws into my TFR501 as I was building it. I had to get the top apart (to re-tension the belts, they were a bit tight) and it came apart fine but I haven't dared tackle the underneath yet. I've heard that heat is good when trying to undo stubborn screws, so I'll have a hairdryer on standby when I replace my screws woith some decent ones :rolleyes: As for the body being too low at the back, I thought this too, but once I fitted the undertray and the velcro strips they supply to hold the body on, the body was pulled out slightly at the back which brought the rear body down onto the rear mount. I was thinking I'd have to cut the body down at the rear too, but it all turns out good in the end. ;) I'm going to order some of those ti-ni shock shafts tomorrow (the Yok ones), I didn't make a very good job of building my shocks anyway so they'll come apart and get rebuilt properly with ti-ni shafts. I feel a set of B4 springs coming on as well. :cool:
-Steve

[Fabs]

Well, received my 501X yesterday and it was mostly built in 3 hours (BAR the electronics, but they're not going in before next week anyway). What took me longest was to get all the air bubbles out of the shocks, lol.

As for the screws, I tried tightening the first screw like normal and unscrewing it, and i stripped it :wtf:. However the fault isn't the screw's but the C/F of the chassis. I noticed that the chassis squeals when you tighten a screw. So what I did is do it by steps, tighten reasonably gently, unscrew, and so on until the screw isn't as hard to unscrew and it works. You'll notice that at every step you'll be able to screw the screw a tad more, like 1/8th of a turn more. I think this is due to the C/F compressing a bit. I have to say it has never happened to me with Tamiya, and it could simply be that batch of c/f that is like that.

Now I have to get the fooked screw out but all the others are easy to get off :cool:.

Another point, I've never seen a kit with so many screws. It might be worth getting a complete set of Ti / Aluminium screws and save a fair amount of weight.

[jimmy]

I applied some grease to the cs holes like you suggest - of course my holes (ooerr) are already "used" so the friction is already less, but I appreciate what you say, and they felt easier to remove, less sticking.
I am sure it will help, but I don't think the chassis is really to blame, perhaps it is the cause of the really tight screws, but also the screws are simply not deep enough - deeper, better screws would not strip so easily, so it's a bad coincidence that these two factors are together. Shallow screws and very hard to remove! Nightmare!

I will advise people to apply a tiny ammount of grease to the CS chassis holes to help this problem, but also suggest replacing the screws if possible with deeper ones.

[Fabs]

well since then i changed most of my screws to titanium ones i had lying about and noticed something rather unusual on the steel screws: the heads are badly marked where it was in contact with the chassis. I just checked on my "old" TRF415 that has steel screws underneath, and the screws are hardly marked at all even after a lot of use.

Looking at a never used hole on both the 415 and the 501, I can see the countersinking is a lot neater on the 415, you can see the layers sticking out on the 501 chassis, so it could just be that the tool was in need of sharpening...

[Fabs]

On another note, anyone who knows the track at York can point me to a ballpark gearing for a 9T ?

Cheers

[jimmy]

Bah, winter is naff! luckily we almost had a bit of sun for 3 minutes today so we raced out and got some photos for the 501X review, nothing spectacular - hey, it was a manky carpark in huddersfield - but I can always add some more later I guess.
http://www.oople.com/rc/photos/misc/501xpromo01.jpg

Vicky found it really hard to drive without spinning out, but it's just because shes mad! I thought it was good, green springs probably too soft though.

[FifteenthNeo]

Flippin eck, gotta love the colour scheme :o its beautifull:cool:

Cracking pic Jimmy.

[telboy]

.......:( wish I could paint that good...........
;)

looking reeeeeeeaaaallly nice there jimmy.

[DCM]

Jimmy broke out the Chrome!!! nice job again Jimmy?

[Elliott Hopkins]

*hummenah*

[k£v!n]

great shell there jimmy :) how does it compare with other 4wd handerling wise?

kev

[cabbynate]

Flippin eck, gotta love the colour scheme :o its beautifull:cool:

Cracking pic Jimmy.

Yes that buggy looks the business!!!!!!!:p ;)
Nice work Jimmy. Can't wight to read the review!!!!!!!:)

[jimmy]

Raced it today - it was good! the setup I put on it when building was too soft, especially at the rear. I ended up on silver Associated rear springs and 30wt with biggest hole pistons and it was a lot better, nicely balanced. I am not used to a fixed 4wd but ran it like that all day. I will use the one-way diff next weekend at york.

The car was strong, didn't break anything apart from the spur gear - that was because one of my packs of cells had a lead that was too long (link wire) and it got positioned wrong under the shell.. took 3 teeth off I think. Luckily richard isherwood was there and had an 87t B4 spur which is apparently what some of the team drivers are running, and this also felt a lot better gear ratio.

[dtech]

Yes, Ive been slacking on the posts since signing up. Sorry. However i feel Ive got something worth while to add now. Havent seen this posted here yet ( a setup for the 501 by Satoshi Maezumi, found at
http://kentech.blogs.se/). Thanks for all the great info everyone.

[Dunc]

Pretty much finished the buggy now, just the lexan bits left to trim and fit. First race this weekend....!

I was able to get hold of some TA05 alloy diffs; they fit fine and are hugely lighter than the standard units (although I've got the one-way installed at the front for the time being). Only thing to note is they have a slightly reduced length over the steel (approx. 18mm vs 15.5mm from the inner bearing face) and so I would suggest checking where the drive-shafts rest at full droop (the way I have my car set at the mo there's no chance of them falling out, just making sure people are aware).

Couldn't resist attaching a piccy :) :

485

[jimmy]

What weight are peoples cars when fully ready to run ? Mine was 1780g - brick !!!!!
:D
I guess it could be lightened with some Titanium screws, hingepins & turnbuckles.
I'm not sure about the outdrives in alloy, let us know how they hold up.

[Fabs]

Mine's at 1650g but without bodyshell or wing since DCM has them :) That's with IB 4200s in though which are heavy... Still already waaaaayyyyy over the minimum weight ooops.

[jimmy]

What components are those ? I don't have anything super small or light weight but yours sounds a tad lighter
I havent measured it with the wing off, but my shell adds about 50g (thick paint! lol)

nothing wrong with a bit of weight tho, makes it stick! :)

[Fabs]

I did put some titanium screws, as many as I had from my TCs (still not fully Titanium'd though that's how many screws there are, lol). Speedo is a G10 and servo a 9550, and that's without PT since it's in my TC...

[jimmy]

The Ti screws make a surprising difference - I wouldn't mind some, not really for the weight saving but because I want to replace the CS screws anyway. plus if water gets between the undertray and chassis the screws will rust down there.

[Fabs]

It's not surprising seen how many screws there are on this car !!!

[Dunc]

I'm not sure about the outdrives in alloy, let us know how they hold up.

Jimmy, I don't think wear should be a problem as you need to use plastic blades on the dog bone end of the drive-shaft. These can obviously be replaced as and when needed.

Whether the alloy outdrives are up to the job structurally is less clear, so you may well have a point here. I'll post if I have any problems in this regard.

[TRF_Tastic]

Jimmy, can you give any pointers for the 501's first run out on the green stuff, Ive got it set for carpet, but just want to get it based for the green before its run.

The track is smallish with some big air and a few bumps and tight turns, dont know if the one way will be a good idea but open to suggestions.

[jimmy]

I ended up on

front:
35wt
#3 piston (ae numbers - smallest holes in other words)
blue springs (AE)
shocks inside at top, and middle on wishbone

rear:
30wt
#1 piston (again, going by AE numbers, so largest hole piston)
silver springs (AE again)
shocks 2nd from inside at the top, and outside at the bottom


This was loads better than when I started the day - the rear end was way too soft. This felt pretty good.
If you don't have the AE springs, then the tamiya ones are a similar balance but one step softer from what I can tell - and richard isherwood was running them with good results.

I would be tempted to say go for the oneway - I didn't really have time to fit it and take photos of it (for the review) so i left it as standard. It felt a little weird to drive a fixed 4wd, but it was good. I will probably start this weekend on the one-way

People say you can use the brakes when you have a fixed drive, but I just found I had to be more aggressive with the car, and putting the brakes on made it push wide. A centre one way would be a nice option and one should be out soon I think.

[TRF_Tastic]

Thanks Jimmy for the tips, will give that setup a go, and see where I come out.

[ramdrive]

Has anyone else had any problems with leaking shocks?

I have one shock that no matter how many times I rebuild it I get a leak :(

Never had this problem with any other shocks I have built.

[TRF_Tastic]

No shocks are leak free and work great.

[jimmy]

Wheres it leaking mate?
The shocks are superb so somethings wrong, if its leaking at the bottom, have to examined the seals ?
Do you have all the spacers in the cartridges ? The top one which installs into the body prior to the cartridge would be very important and hard to notice if its not there when you take it apart.

There could be a split in your Oring (ooerr) would be hard to spot I guess.

If its none of the above then I can't really suggest much, unless there is a malformed part due to a moulding error or something

[ramdrive]

The shocks are leaking at the bottom.

I am trying to get hold of a set of TRF501x o-rings but cannot find them anywhere.

All the white spacers are in place and look fine, it must be an O-ring, I will just have to wait until spares become available:(

[jimmy]

Providing you are referring to the shaft o-rings, then there should be no need to wait - they should be 3mm - and used in many shocks, available in any model shop.. If you end up getting different ones, like racers edge, or kyosho etc, then probably best to change the orings in all the shocks for the most consistent performance - but only if youre fussy :)

[ramdrive]

I think the problem is the BJ9 O-ring...

Have mailed a couple of people in HK for help, thought about mailing the UK importers but they are next to useless.

Cheers for the help Jimmy.

[jimmy]

ahhh.. There should still be ones you can use in its place I would have thought - it would probably involve a trip to the model shop shop for a look though. A lot of shocks use similar Orings.

Is that definately where it is leaking then ? if so, have a look at the metal / threads in the shock body where the cartridge goes in. See if where the large oring butts up against the inside lip of the shock body has any grooves or burrs that might cause a leak or cause a damaged oring..

Sorry for chuntering on, you probably have checked a lot of stuff already.. Still, for the oring have a look at Kyosho and Yokomo shock parts if you have a local hobby shop stocking these, as there are similar seals used on those.

[B4james]

Had the body finally finished, it was done by a guy going by the name Wolf on rcracer.com.au, I am extremely happy with the end result

[TRF_Tastic]

Ok ran the car for the first time on the green stuff today and it went like a dream, once I had switched my pred driving style off!!! Few pointers ran the setup that Jimmy prescribed, and this is on a bumpy grass mud track, the front seemd to dig in so tougher springs on the front other than AE blues, jacked the ride height right up, and used some Losi wheels, which worked a treat. Other than that follow Jimmy's setup and just tweek from there.

Oh and the new paint arrived yesterday from Mr Dragon Paint and it looks sweet!!!

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d32/Fast_as_a/501X.jpg

[jimmy]

I raced mine again today -
Standard car apart from springs and oil in practice and it was "good" like last weekend. Put in the one-way for the first round and it was unbelievably better - the car was just dialled. I got 13th in round I think.
I had a mare in round 2, but another good run in rd 3 - again a nightmare in round 4. Qualified 6th in the B final - out of 60 drivers in 4WD, so very happy with that. Finished 5th in the B.

The shocks were left unchanged from Batley setup, but moved to the next to outside hole on the towers. That and the one way were all I changed. I've never driven a car that was so dialled to the track. Stripped another screw though.. hehe

[dtech]

Now that we've all got them built, BRING ON THE HOP UPS....

Nuremburg Toy Fair 2007 New Releases:
53961 TRF501X Aluminum Caster Block
53962 TRF501X Aluminum Rear Upright
53963 TRF501X Stabilizer Set
53964 48P Pinion Gear (16T, 17T)
53965 48P Pinion Gear (18T, 19T)
53966 48P Pinion Gear (20T, 21T)
53967 TRF501X Eccentric Belt Tensioner
53968 5x5mm Hex Head Ball Connector
53969 5x8mm Hex Head Ball Connector
53970 Dust Protector Seal for Differential Gear
53971 TRF501X Aluminum Steering Arm
53972 TRF501X Aluminum Steering Bridge
53973 TRF501X Aluminum Steering Base
53974 TRF501X Front Spring Set
53975 TRF501X Rear Spring Set
53976 TRF501X Low Friction Piston (1.2cm dia.)
53977 TRF501X Low Friction Piston (1.3cm dia.)
53978 TRF501X Low Friciton Piston (1.4cm dia.)
53979 TRF501X Low Friction Rod Guide
53980 Dust Cover for Adjuster

[TRF_Tastic]

Just enquired with RC-Champ as to release dates and prices, as and when I get an answer I will let you all know.

[Dunc]

That would be good TRF_Tastic; I'm always partial to a few hop-ups. :)

I'm particularly interested in the sway bar, spring sets and hex head ball connectors. The rest seem to be more 'bling' orientated, but when has that ever stopped me! :D

Car was good first time out, I have a few tweaks to try for this weekend. Promising so far, certainly not regretting the purchase.

[TRF_Tastic]

Bling it on baby!!!!!

[HairySteve]

I'll be getting all the dust seals, springs and the aluminium steering parts - those plastic parts just have a little bit too much play in them for my liking ;) By the way chaps, I tried a Corally long boss pinion gear on my 501 on wednesday, bad news, the collar at the inboard end of the pinion which the grub screw winds into rubs on the belt and the edge of the grub screw also sticks out slightly and has taken out the top of all my belt's teeth. I'll try dremelling the grubs down a bit and see if it makes any difference, luckily I have plenty of spare belts :rolleyes:
-Steve

[TRF_Tastic]

Spoken to RC CHamp in Japan and they reckon on availablity early Aprilish for the new hopups

[Dunc]

Spoken to RC CHamp in Japan and they reckon on availablity early Aprilish for the new hopups

Oooh, so long?! :( :D

I was wondering whether the aluminium front castor blocks and rear uprights will have provision for vertical ball studs or whether they'll just be direct copies? There seems to be a trend these days for vertical over horizontal, maybe it's just me...... Neither am I sure why one would be preferable over the other.

Either way, bring on the bling!!

[TRF_Tastic]

I will be trying to get hold of someone from Tamiya USA to verify the release dates for the parts.

Hope that this helps

[cabbynate]

Oooh, so long?! :( :D

I was wondering whether the aluminium front castor blocks and rear uprights will have provision for vertical ball studs or whether they'll just be direct copies? There seems to be a trend these days for vertical over horizontal, maybe it's just me...... Neither am I sure why one would be preferable over the other.

Either way, bring on the bling!!

With vertical ball stud mounts you can alter the roll center by adding washers under the ball stud. It's a nice tuning option....

[jimmy]

you can already get alloy caster blocks with vertical ball studs - they are from the BJ4 and are a (almost) direct fit. You'll have to drill the wishbones for the larger imperial hinge pin and use a associated / losi rod end with the imperial ball stud for the hub. I fitted them just to see if it was possible and its a good fit.

[Dunc]

With vertical ball stud mounts you can alter the roll center by adding washers under the ball stud. It's a nice tuning option....

Thanks, this did dawn on me when thinking about it afterwards :rolleyes: :)

you can already get alloy caster blocks with vertical ball studs - they are from the BJ4 and are a (almost) direct fit. You'll have to drill the wishbones for the larger imperial hinge pin and use a associated / losi rod end with the imperial ball stud for the hub. I fitted them just to see if it was possible and its a good fit.

Have you had a chance to try these in a race, Jimmy? If so, what are your thoughts?


I've just come back from my second meeting with the car and I'm happier still! I'm not knocking the Predator (horses for courses and all that), but I never really got on with mine and, for me at least, the Tamiya is a huge improvement: it's more forgiving, consistent, just downright quicker! :)

Hopefully a matching 2wd will follow soon.......

[jimmy]

NAh, I fitted it to one side - even drilling the wishbone (I have a few spare, so its ok!) and it worked a treat. I didn't run it though since I had no real reason to after reading that alloy blocks will be coming (possibly with vertical studs?). I know it is possible at least, but wanted to keep my BJ4we in one piece.

[Chris]

What's 53967 TRF501X Eccentric Belt Tensioner?:confused:

[TRF_Tastic]

Sorry Guys bad news about the hopups, reply from Tamiya USA

Dear Tamiya Customer,
The front one-way diff is available now:
http://www.tamiyausa.com/product/item.php?product-id=53951 (http://www.tamiyausa.com/product/item.php?product-id=53951) We're expecting the rest to be available around April.
Tamiya America
Customer Service

[Dunc]

April's not so bad, is it? Especially considering how well the car goes straight from the box.

[xxx]

Here you see the new alloy caster blocks and the new steering

http://www13.ocn.ne.jp/%7Emirage-j/gallery/07extreme2/07extL01.jpg

[TRF_Tastic]

Looking good cant wait for the April, early birthday present!!!

[Fabs]

Raced the car today at last at Worksop. First time out with the car, first buggy race in years, straight into 1st round without practice. Nearly out of the box setup, only 30W/25W oils F/R and the car was great, handled fine on the lippy bit, but mostly cleared the bumps and jumps like they weren't there.

As I didn't have any thicker oil in my box, I decided to change pistons and went for the smaller holes all round, and that was I think a mistake, I should have done it only at the front as now the rear end would want to go over the front over the table top that i'd cleared so easily in rd 1. Drove like a numpty in that round and ended up bending the rear turnbuckle mount. :o

Didn't change anything for rd 3, only didn't try clearing the table top and even with a bent car, I qualified 3rd, only 3 of us did 16 laps... Two strong finals ending up 3rd in each and 3rd overall.

Very happy with the car, I'm gonna see if champ can sort me out with a new part b4 Batley, and will try and find some 35W and AE springs to put Jimmy's setup.

[KingBob]

I hope the "hex head ball connectors" are Ti not steel. Have already snapped one of the ball studs, leaving the thread stuck in the rear upper arm mount :(

Thats after snapping a front shock shaft. The steel parts certainly do seem to be a bit brittle :(

[Fabs]

How did you manage to break a steel ball stud ????? If it doesn't say Ti then it's not gonna be Ti, besides Titanium isn't necessarily stronger than steel.

[KingBob]

Dunno, didn't have a bad stack at all. Just landed from a small jump, went around a corner and noticed the rear end all out. Snapped the ballstud under the hex part right where the thread starts.

Am looking at getting a screwset from RCchamp, allegedly better than the stock screws. Would hope so, the damn car tries to shake itself apart!

[jimmy]

Hmm, sounds like the car might of got a sidways hit at some point to weaken it maybe?

[Fabs]

Maybe you just had a faulty part, like with a bubble trapped inside ? I mean I bent the actual part where the ball joint screws into (yes the big aluminium bridge !!!) but the ball joint has got nothing :wtf: I'd rather have snapped it tbh...

[B4IFLY]

hey in the kit is there both pulleys black and white and if it dont have any cell holders could you use mayb yokomo ones or samething

cheers

[jimmy]

In the kit there is just one black and one white pulley, 35 and 36t respectively.
The Yokomo cell holders won't fit I'm afraid - I tested it and it was a long way off (I think the holes would have to be a lot bigger, but my memory is poor! :)

[TRF_Tastic]

Jimmy your right the yoke cell holders are way too big, shame really, and the associated ones dont fit either, so it is file and chamfer the carbon Im afraid!!

[B4IFLY]

as the 510x has an under tray wood it still be a think with maybe damageing the cells just that jimmy said that in the review. and is the best thing to have ae shock one it

[TRF_Tastic]

Not damaged any cells when Ive been racing with an undertray. Defo on the associated springs though.

[jimmy]

Not sure I understand mate - The damaged cells thing is because of the carbon chassis - if you don't prepare it then you certainly risk it cutting into the shrink. As long as it's prepared properly it should be fine. There is no substitute for plastic trays tho - they hold the cells much better.

[B4IFLY]

is it best to have b4 shocks on it or just the springs sorry abit of a spelling was wrong in the last one

[TRF_Tastic]

Springs, there is no need for the b4 shocks as the standard Tamiya shocks are well up to the job. The only thing I would consider on the tamiya shocks is replacing the front shock shafts with Yokomo MR4BX front items.

[jimmy]

The shocks are the same proportions as the B4 shocks, so it's just the springs that you'd be changing..

[B4IFLY]

now all i have to do is save abit more and then i well get it

[Fabs]

Hi guys,

Thought i's show you the repair job I've done to my car. Any of you bend the same part and need one let me know.

Fab

[TRF_Tastic]

Sweet looking fix there Fab, but how does that effect the roll centre and the cars handling?

[Fabs]

Not at all, RC are the same and still adjustable. I'd say in either case, not as much as a bent part. The part isn't actually available at Tamiya at all...

We'll see tomorrow how it handles but I expect still the same really.

[cabbynate]

Sweet looking fix there Fab, but how does that effect the roll centre and the cars handling?

From looking at it it looks a little thinner so you may want to add some spacers to the ballstud and it is less one hole but it looks ace and should be stronger!!!!:)

[DCM]

Hi guys,

Thought i's show you the repair job I've done to my car. Any of you bend the same part and need one let me know.

Fab


glad that mod worked out Fab, and you didn't have to use that many spacers in the end either, that Tamiya part is just daft....

[smokes]

FAB send me a SW copy of the original part and I'll what the cost is to machine it from ali, depending on what spec of ali you want. 6064 etc

[usagi]

Might be worth quoting for a small batch run.....I could do with a spare one just in case.
I'm sure others will too. ;)

[Fabs]

From looking at it it looks a little thinner so you may want to add some spacers to the ballstud and it is less one hole but it looks ace and should be stronger!!!!:)

As I said the setting I have is the same as the standard setup. Don't forget it has 2mm spacers to raise the ball studs on the std setup. Didn't do the outer hole as it'd get in the way if using the inner hole, and from what i've been told i'll be using either the outer or middle hole.

[Fabs]

FAB send me a SW copy of the original part and I'll what the cost is to machine it from ali, depending on what spec of ali you want. 6064 etc

TBH it'll be cheaper to get it from tamiya when they have it in stock.

[Fabs]

Second meeting with the car at batley supercup today. Got put car 10 in bottom heat (ah the joys of racing buggys for the first time in this country...).

Anyway lots of problems with traffic, not had a single run without a 30s lap due to back markers (and yes i do try not to hit them, at some point i still had to stop in the middle of the track since i had no where to go due to a pile of cars...). Ended up qualifying 2nd in C final, had I been in a better heat, it'd have been mid B final, so not very happy with that.

However the car handled great, I put Jimmy's shock setup from the review and it worked well all day, and I won my final by 8s... Obviously the fix worked a treat...

[TRF_Tastic]

Had a mixed bag yesterday, was having some trouble with glitching and gearing, swapped from a 12x2 to a 10x2 and the car changed from a nice ballanced machine into a rightold rocket, won a good race with it and then had a few problems in my 3rd round, getting taken out in the first ten yards didnt help, also the flu might of had something to do with the concentration levels. All in all a pretty good days racing.

[B4james]

Had my first run with the 501X today and it went really well other than breaking the front upper shock bolt twice. It appears to be a bit vunerable in rollovers.

The back end is definately way to soft and I ended up going to 40wt front and 35 wt rear oil and stiffer springs on the rear. After these changes it jumped heaps better and was very predictable.

I know look forward to trying the one way to hopefully get some more steering.

[TRF_Tastic]

How the hell are all you guys breaking stuff on your 501's, I have raced mine every opportunity that Ive had and not broken a single thing, and Ive had some big tumbles with mine and no troubles!!! Altough I did have a duff steering servo today which compromised the running. However the 501 came out a B final winner today, so not a bad days work.

[bender]

Has anyone tried Losi springs on their car?

I'm not too keen on using AE springs, as they can rub slightly against the shocks (same as the kit rear springs).

Using a slighter bigger diameter spring would fix this (ie: Losi) but I'm not sure how well the Losi springs would fit on the spring retainers and threaded adjusters.

Can anyone test this?

[B4james]

I have been using the optional spring set from the DFO3 std shocks which seem to be ok

[jimmy]

Mad, I thought I had replied to this..

hmm..

My 501X springs rub on the bodies also. My b4 springs (same diameter) don't.

Hope that helps.
But I will see if I can dig out some losi springs to try out.

[Alan1467]

Just fitted the new alloy front caster blocks and the car now appears to have a lot of bump steer!! Anyone else found this?
Alan

[grindog]

Anyone know where any of the Tamiya 501X wheels are in stock?

[jimmy]

Not off hand, but you can always get proline B4 rear and losi XX4/XXX4 front wheels - which look exactly the same as the tamiya wheels and no one will ever know (maybe) :)

[grindog]

yeah but i was thinking tha tams may be cheap as chips

[GRIFF55]

I got all my spares from champ rc(hong kong), lots of stock and really good people to deal with, delivery was quick too!

[jimmy]

Champ is in Japan! :eh?:

[mobilow]

Hi
I also build my TRF and I also stripped two screws, So I decide to use stainless steel screws with Torx drive these are the best, I think and I take them over years also driving my losi without chassis cover and it works really good. The problem is that there is no alu or titanium screws available and weight reducing doesnt work.
Greetings from Germany

[GRIFF55]

Sorry Jimmy, Japan it is!! Never was any good at geography. ha ha
Still very impressed with their service.

[mobilow]

is there also a center one way pulley available ? I just ordered the front hop up but a center will be smarter.

[jimmy]

centre one way is on the way but not available yet afaik

[mobilow]

what a good forum for the new TRF 501X, the latest infos in german forums nothing like this. Thanx

[jimmy]

Thanks!:)

Well, the oOple review 501X won at Bury Metro today in the hands of an unnamed test pilot.

One thing that did get damaged in a roll was the rear camber brace! Someone already bent one of these and I assumed they were some sort of maniac- but my unnamed test driver just grip rolled the car and it must have hit the wheel at an angle which bent the brace badly - it was hammered back into shape but it will need replacing.

[bigred5765]

jimmy you picked your self up a stig

[DCM]

pm Fab (fabien Simoni) he has a carbon fibre one that he CNC'd, although your ball studs are now updise down vertical rather than facing forward.

[GRIFF55]

:) Nice one Jimmy!!!!
Do you know the no. of the ko servo in that really tidy electric install?(french car)

[Alan1467]

Anyone wanting a spare undertray for the 501 I have a spare (ordered from 2 places by mistake:o )

[mobilow]

For everyone searching for new springs. I use Losi springs, when you use the original losi damper disks ( I dont know the english word ) The one thats below the spring. just grind it a few and you have a perfect damper without damaging the damper bodys.

[stefke]

question : I'm not very happy with the kit supplied servo saver. IMHO, it's a bit too soft and Ik makes the car feel jitterish on astro tracks. Does anyone know of a servo saver that would be a good fit ? A long time back, there where the Kimbrough savers that were pretty good, but I can't seem to find them anymore.

[jimmy]

woody has a plastic zip tie around the saver.. I think he changed it for a solid servo arm (much better all round - if you have a GOOD servo) but that broke so he had to use the kit item. The zip tie seems to have taken the slop out of it anyway

[stefke]

woody has a plastic zip tie around the saver.. I think he changed it for a solid servo arm (much better all round - if you have a GOOD servo) but that broke so he had to use the kit item. The zip tie seems to have taken the slop out of it anyway

I was thinking in the direction of a solid arm, but the zip tie should be a better idea. At least it offers some form of protection.

[jimmy]

On the BJ4 (original) I went from a heavy duty servo saver like this tamiya one - to a solid arm. The difference was definately noticable on our high traction surfaces.. the steering felt a lot more predictable and solid.. It just turned like you wanted..
The zip tie is probably almost as good though and like you say, it protect stuff better. The forces were enough to break the solid arm, so you can imagine the forces on the servo. maybe better to have slightly sloppy steering than none !

[GRIFF55]

Drove the car for the first time offroad yesterday at Oswestry, WOOOOO HOOOOO, i love it!!!!
Snapped the rear suspension arm off in practice and bent a hinge pin:eh?:.
(first time i've drove in ten years!)
Anybody know where i can get ti ones???
I used the review set up, andt it was great. Thanks Jimmy.

[jimmy]

Woody did the same at the weekend - the rear of the arm broke - so the front (on the inner hinge pin) put a lot of force on the pin, bending it badly.

Woody took a hammer to it and even though it wasn't 100% perfect it still pivots very freely because of the way it mounts..
I've not seen Ti pins yet, but I am not sure they'd be any stronger.

[Northy]

Titanium is not stronger than steel, only lighter. The reason we use Ti turnbuckles for strength is because you can make them a bigger diameter to get the strength, but they are still light as they are made from titanium.

G

[HairySteve]

I did the same thing, I was showing off with the 5.5 brushless cranked up to full power, screaming around the car park at work on some old knackered tyres, and I got a turn wrong and clipped a van wheel at about 30 miles/hour. :mad: It did exactly what you describe, the front of the arm broke off but the rear stayed in one piece and bent the hinge pin. Ah well. I'll have a ruhmmage through my spares box and see if anything else fits. I have a feeling they'll be the same size as outer hinge pins off a HPI Hellfire, in which case I might get the titanium nitride ones that HPI do... :cool:
-Steve

[jimmy]

Anyone know what alternative diff plates might fit and be better than the kit items? Either the balls or the plates are slipping on woodys car, just can't seem to stop them slipping and it grinds up the plates making them rather nasty and gritty.
Got some KANZEN ceramic balls on the way but harder plates would be nice.

[GRIFF55]

No Sorry, but my diff could do with some help after just one meeting:wtf: .
Car was amazing to drive though

[Dunc]

Titanium is not stronger than steel, only lighter. The reason we use Ti turnbuckles for strength is because you can make them a bigger diameter to get the strength, but they are still light as they are made from titanium.

G

Not true; generally speaking titanium and steel alloys are of comparable strength, but as you correctly pointed out titanium is less dense (by around 45%).

You can't say "titanium is not stronger than steel" without knowing the grade, i.e. quality, in question. There are sufficient varieties of both alloy to 'prove' such a statement either way.

[stefke]

I've read somewhere that Yokomo plates should fit. Haven't tried it myself though.

I use the Kanzen ceramic 3mm balls and WOW : what a difference. I also made diff shields from self adhesive vinyl.

Haven't had a problem with diffs coming loose, but I always put some extra locktite on the diff lock nut. I also compressed the diff spring several times before mounting.

[jimmy]

I just got the photos from lee martin at the cactus event. there are 2500 photos so it's hard to find a Tamiya one on there, but I saw one of Hupos car clearly showing the new camber mounts which look a lot stronger.

[grindog]

Has anyone had any problems with the wheel nuts coming undone? It happened twice with my front wheels coming off under braking:( I notice on one of the setups it lists the use of a losi 8/32 locknut but i cant find these. What car are they from?

[jimmy]

Yeah we have had that problem.. just loosening off a little during a run. Not sure what can be done about it though. The kit nuts are metric aren't they? so not sure what this losi nut thing can be about unless they were using some BJ4 parts on the car?

[stefke]

Had the same problem too. And yes, the nuts are metric, so I can't see a Losi nut fit.

Solved it at first by putting some Locktite 222 on the threads. As a more practical sollution, I used some plain ordinary Tamiya steel locknuts from an old touring car I had and they didn't came loose since.

[Lee]

i had this years ago when driving a tc3, i ended up putting the nuts on backwards so the nylock goes on first, suck it and see:yawn:

[jimmy]

the loctite might be worth a try.. Are there any metric nuts with serrations on the back ? you know, so they lock onto plastic wheel and can't move without some proper force.

[stefke]

the loctite might be worth a try.. Are there any metric nuts with serrations on the back ? you know, so they lock onto plastic wheel and can't move without some proper force.


I used to have them. I think even from Tamiya (Monster Beetle ? ), but they were bloody hard to get off sometimes (Had to spray WD40 on them). I remember they had a goldish colour.