brca list released for batterys

[bert digler]

no lipos:confused: is this correct

[bert digler]

no lipos:confused: is this correct

http://www.brca.org/BRCA/elecboard/news/Rechargeable%20Batteries%202009.pdf

[MATTY]

Think Lipo list comes out end of Feb !?!

[jono83]

thats the nimh list i believe still waiting for a lipo list

[bert digler]

thats the nimh list i believe still waiting for a lipo list

thank f@[k for that;)

[losixxx]

http://www.oople.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18842

keep up m8!:lol:

[DaveG28]

Although I'm sure your right guys, does anyone know that for sure? It's the "rechargable batteries" list, not "nimh list"? Plus it says on the list that only those batteries are allowed in 2009, no separate Lipo list is mentioned?

Like I say, I can't believe it really is the only list, but wouldn't mind someone who knows for sure saying so!?

[Darren Boyle]

110% certain there is a seperate list of additional legal LIPO's on the way in the next week or so, I only spoke to Paul Worsley about it two days ago, to check he had recieved our LIPO's in time including stick packs and a saddle pack too for approval....

[DaveG28]

Cheers Darren, nice to hear it, I always worry about "assuming" which is why I asked!

[CharlieF]

110% certain there is a seperate list of additional legal LIPO's on the way in the next week or so, I only spoke to Paul Worsley about it two days ago, to check he had recieved our LIPO's in time including stick packs and a saddle pack too for approval....

Just by way of reassurance, what Darren has said is right. However, PW has received so many Lipo cells (20 separate parcels I understand) he has a lot more work to do to form the Homologation list than he expected.
He is currently working flat out measuring, cycling and photographing Lipo's to get a list published as soon as possible but please be patient it may take a little longer than the next week or so.
Regards.

[David Church]

Just by way of reassurance, what Darren has said is right. However, PW has received so many Lipo cells (20 separate parcels I understand) he has a lot more work to do to form the Homologation list than he expected.
He is currently working flat out measuring, cycling and photographing Lipo's to get a list published as soon as possible but please be patient it may take a little longer than the next week or so.
Regards.


This is good news considering how many people were panic-ing that there would'nt be any legal lipo's!!!!
Another good job done by the BRCA!!!!:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

[DaveG28]

Cheers for the post Charlie!:D

[Lee]

measuring, cycling and photographing


I didn't realise Paul had so many hobbies outside of RC :lol:



I'm sorry :D

[stegger]

I didn't realise Paul had so many hobbies outside of RC :lol:



I'm sorry :D

:lol::lol::lol:

[MATTY]

[quote=Lee;204486]I didn't realise Paul had so many hobbies outside of RC :lol:



:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

[Col]

PW has received so many Lipo cells (20 separate parcels I understand) he has a lot more work to do to form the Homologation list than he expected.


This is good news considering how many people were panic-ing that there would'nt be any legal lipo's!!!!


Just because they are submitted does not mean they will be accecpted. You never know, there may still be no legal lipo's for 09 then your public relations skills will be put to use!!;)

[Mike Hudson]

haha I think most can be sure that lipo will be legal though... the manufacturers who have submitted lipos surely wouldn't be stupid enough to not make them to the brca specs and lose out on the huge rush for lipo when the legal list is it out and almost everyone wants them

[Col]

With ROAR and EFRA running different rules though, you never know. After all, remember last year when it was decided that Intelect cells had crept over the maximum size? And that was a std size across the world...
All I'm saying is there is no guarantee

[CharlieF]

With ROAR and EFRA running different rules though, you never know. After all, remember last year when it was decided that Intelect cells had crept over the maximum size? And that was a std size across the world...
All I'm saying is there is no guarantee

What are all these negative waves ???

Keep the faith :cool::cool:

[ben]

What are all these negative waves ???

Nothing new charlie.... ;)

[terry.sc]

With ROAR and EFRA running different rules though, you never know. After all, remember last year when it was decided that Intelect cells had crept over the maximum size? And that was a std size across the world...
All I'm saying is there is no guaranteeThe difference in that case is that the cells were oversize compared to the standard ISO specification of the cells, but we had a loophole in the regulations that allowed the cells to be an extra 1mm to allow for cell expansion in use. Intellect just built cells that used the loophole to make the cells oversize, so they were legal even though they didn't fit the spirit of the rules. That loophole doesn't exist now as the rules have been changed to the ISO standard and cells aren't allowed to be any bigger. A nice easy way to get rid of the dodgy cells.

Now any manufacturer has a much more detailed specification to follow for lipos, including what tests they will be subjected to. It's pointless 20 companies sending in packs if they know they are going to fail the tests they have built the packs around. There will be plenty of choice for the next season.

[David Church]

Just because they are submitted does not mean they will be accecpted. You never know, there may still be no legal lipo's for 09 then your public relations skills will be put to use!!;)

Col, you are right to wonder how many if any lipo's will be legal. We seem to have gone through this sort of thing the last few years, and everytime ended up with plenty of cells to choose from. The BRCA have a system, some may think it's not right or fair, But I think the BRCA do a great job and have the racers best inerest at heart, and I am sure there will be plenty of lipo's to choose from as Mike has said below, the cell manufacture's will not want to miss out on sales for being 1mm oversize. Not much longer to wait and then this debate will be a distant memory!!!!
DC

haha I think most can be sure that lipo will be legal though... the manufacturers who have submitted lipos surely wouldn't be stupid enough to not make them to the brca specs and lose out on the huge rush for lipo when the legal list is it out and almost everyone wants them

[Col]

Not much longer to wait and then this debate will be a distant memory!!!!
DC

Thank God for that!!

[PaulUpton]

Although this is for the TC section maybe the off road should adopt the same rule! This is for the LiPo list!!

IMPORTANT: The TC section committee has agreed that the 2008 list will be grandfathered into the 2009 rules, allowing all cells on the 2008 list to be used at BRCA sanctioned events so protecting the investment made by those drivers who bought cells in 2008.

from centralbooking.org

[DCM]

strewth, this is dragging on now, come on BRCA... LIPO LIST!!!

[DaveG28]

From the saddle side not how much difference it makes publishing yet, have any new Saddles come in to any shops yet anyway?

[Kecky]

This has dragged on so long now i've forgotten if we are still waiting on confirmation of stick packs aswell :o are we? or is there a list somewhere :confused:

[Bungleaio]

We are still waiting for lists for lipo

[ryan_93]

there is a list posted today :thumbsup: but only 1 battery on it so far

http://www.brca.org/BRCA/elecboard/news/2009%20BRCA%201S%20LiPo%20List%20V1%20pdf.pdf

[Chris Doughty]

there is a list posted today :thumbsup: but only 1 battery on it so far

http://www.brca.org/BRCA/elecboard/news/2009%20BRCA%201S%20LiPo%20List%20V1%20pdf.pdf

1S ? as in 3.7v.... whats the use of that?

[tyreman]

This has dragged on so long now i've forgotten if we are still waiting on confirmation of stick packs aswell :o are we? or is there a list somewhere :confused:

Why has it been dragging on, the cut off date was 31st January:confused:
It hasn't been 3 weeks yet, in previous years it's always been 4-5 weeks after the cut off date before we see a legal list.

There's still at least 6 weeks to go before a BRCA sanctioned off road meeting, and nearly 3 months until the first national.

[Cockerill]

1S ? as in 3.7v.... whats the use of that?

Exactly what I was thinking :confused:

Looks like were still waiting for the 'proper' lipo list, hopefully not long now

[DaveG28]

there is a list posted today :thumbsup: but only 1 battery on it so far

http://www.brca.org/BRCA/elecboard/news/2009%20BRCA%201S%20LiPo%20List%20V1%20pdf.pdf

And it's a 1 cell 3.7 volt one!

[Chequered Flag Racing]

1S ? as in 3.7v.... whats the use of that?

12th scale are using them in the States and I fancy one & 13.5bl for the CARS/AMC Summer Shoot Out III 2009 (http://www.carsrcracing.co.uk/?p=128)

[RogerM]

I have to agree with Brian, where's the fire??? If your that woried about getting used to LiPos then take an educated guess as to which packs might be legal and go for them. I'd be thinking major name, large UK distributor, sealed case, inside the stated sizes .... probalby a better than 90% chance that is all these points are met it'll be on the list!!!

If it's set-up time your concerned about then run cells again this year, simple as that, you won't be the only ones!

Paul and crew give up a huge amount of time purely so that you can have fun at the weekends!!! Have a bit of gratitude for their efforts rather than moaning about how long things take to do, maybe even ask them if you can help in some way!

The links below show they are working on it ....

http://www.brca.org/BRCA/elecboard/news/2009%20EB%20LiPo%20Clarifications%20Feb%2017%20pdf %201.pdf (http://www.brca.org/BRCA/elecboard/news/2009%20EB%20LiPo%20Clarifications%20Feb%2017%20pdf %201.pdf)

http://www.brca.org/BRCA/elecboard/news/2009%20EB%20Price%20Review%20Feb%2013%20pdf%201.pd f

(£100 a pack .... jeepers!)

These work out about £30 a pack and for most people will be fine http://www.vapextech.co.uk/acatalog/info_73.html

[JCJC]

If your that woried about getting used to LiPos then take an educated guess as to which packs might be legal and go for them. I'd be thinking major name, large UK distributor, sealed case, inside the stated sizes .... probalby a better than 90% chance that is all these points are met it'll be on the list!!!

Not to sure re this advice, think the approved packs may be stickered up, and the sticker will be part of the approval. Bet a pile of batteries & a pile of stickers are just waiting to be introduced to each other, roll on the 2s list and lets hope thats an "un frozen" list like the 1s.

[sly]

The links below show they are working on it ....

http://www.brca.org/BRCA/elecboard/news/2009%20EB%20LiPo%20Clarifications%20Feb%2017%20pdf %201.pdf

http://www.brca.org/BRCA/elecboard/news/2009%20EB%20Price%20Review%20Feb%2013%20pdf%201.pd f

(£100 a pack .... jeepers!)

These work out about £30 a pack and for most people will be fine http://www.vapextech.co.uk/acatalog/info_73.html

Good link RogerM.

The first link show me that have bent/moved the rules to suit fitment of the cell within the 12thscale class.

What not to say they will bend/move the rules on the inconsequential extra 1mm on the saddle packs that are over sized for 1year?

[MattW]

sly, i'm thinking the fact that they have gone into print and stated the 1S ruling/modification, but not mentioned anything about a saddle pack ruling might give it away??? Let's remember that there wasn't a spec written down for a 1S "pack" in the first place.

Don't feel comfortable with the size of the price increase i must say.

[RogerM]

The change to the 1S rules seems to be so that they fit into the relevent cars without modifications ..... changing the rules for the 2S saddles would mean that several chassis WOULD need modifications ...... no matter how simple a mod it is somebody will kick up a fuss to a model shop owner because they have sold them packs "not fit for purpose".

[DCM]

I understand the 'cut off' for cell submission, so we all have one list to work from, for one year, but it isn't working well.

If it is a saddle cell, then 1S is correct, as when you got a pair of saddles, you are then at 2S.....

[Kecky]

Great timing releasing the increased cost for racing gear, just what the sport needs in the economic mess the country's in :thumbsup:

[RogerM]

The price increase is due to the country's economy relative to that of other major players (US $, Japan Jen, Euro etc.). If there was no price increase it would mean the distributors (or more likely the shops) would be running on reduced margins, not make any money, not pay their bills and disapear!

Then there would be no racing in this country!

Anyway, those price increases are not in line with the £ - $ exchange rate difference to this time last year .... it's actually well in favour of the UK driver.

You think they are steep increases, should see some of the price increases suppliers to my company have thrown at us ..... especially the Japanese stuff!!!

[burgie]

How many motors/cells of whatever description will now start costing more simply because the price threshold has been raised?

this I feel is potentially very bad news for our hobby, and will only encourage more improting of stuff from Hong Kong to save a bit of money...or to get those cells that are not commercially available in the UK...

[mark christopher]

How many motors/cells of whatever description will now start costing more simply because the price threshold has been raised?

this I feel is potentially very bad news for our hobby, and will only encourage more improting of stuff from Hong Kong to save a bit of money...or to get those cells that are not commercially available in the UK...

but then they would not be on a list and not approved?

[Northy]

but then they would not be on a list and not approved?

Mark, check the BRCA website, to get on the list they do not need to be available in the UK, just submitted. It's because importers will not buy before they know what is legal. :(

G

[Northy]

Another post as I can't save my edit for some reason.....

I can not see why and distributor would try and homologate something they are not going to import, but as we know, stuff can not be imported overnight. :cry:

G

[DaveG28]

Another post as I can't save my edit for some reason.....

I can not see why and distributor would try and homologate something they are not going to import, but as we know, stuff can not be imported overnight. :cry:

G


Let's hope the rules are very clear re stickering etc, I can see people having to try to import in order to get in time for indoor finals, then finding the wrong stickers etc on the cells.

As for £100, it'd be a hell of a price rise to make some cells (trakpower) £100, but of course they don't fit the rules!!

[Darren Boyle]

Guys, any LIPO pack that comes out on "THE" list when it is finalised will have to have a recognised distributor for it - no distributor = not on the list.

The Vampire ones that we are doing were NOT "going" onto the BRCA lists until we stepped in and informed the BRCA (Paul) that we were now the appointed distributor for them (which he in turn still had to confirm with Vampire themselves to verify) Up until this point they were going to become EFRA legal only but now they are BRCA legal too (or will be when the list is published)....:thumbsup:

As far as stock goes most distributors have them on the shelf already or if not they are already on the way from suppliers. Our first shipment of our three different stick LIPO's are just a few days away and our LIPO saddles are being shipped in approx 10/14 days. Should not have a problem for all of the big meetings around the end of March onwards (Players, BRCA Indoor etc) IMHO

As far as price rises go, it is bad timimg (but fully due to the whole economic meltdown) but as has been said already if they stayed at around £80 we simply would not have them here at all.....

Darren

[mark christopher]

Let's hope the rules are very clear re stickering etc, I can see people having to try to import in order to get in time for indoor finals, then finding the wrong stickers etc on the cells.

As for £100, it'd be a hell of a price rise to make some cells (trakpower) £100, but of course they don't fit the rules!!

or do they????

dontforget if the cells were near the old price limit they will go up to the new, the cneaper cells may got up but not to the full £100, the guys who make them cheaper will sell more!!

[mark christopher]

Mark, check the BRCA website, to get on the list they do not need to be available in the UK, just submitted. It's because importers will not buy before they know what is legal. :(

G
i thought as darren says they had to have a uk distributor?

[Northy]

Guys, any LIPO pack that comes out on "THE" list when it is finalised will have to have a recognised distributor for it - no distributor = not on the list.

The Vampire ones that we are doing were NOT "going" onto the BRCA lists until we stepped in and informed the BRCA (Paul) that we were now the appointed distributor for them (which he in turn still had to confirm with Vampire themselves to verify) Up until this point they were going to become EFRA legal only but now they are BRCA legal too (or will be when the list is published)....:thumbsup:

As far as stock goes most distributors have them on the shelf already or if not they are already on the way from suppliers. Our first shipment of our three different stick LIPO's are just a few days away and our LIPO saddles are being shipped in approx 10/14 days. Should not have a problem for all of the big meetings around the end of March onwards (Players, BRCA Indoor etc) IMHO

As far as price rises go, it is bad timimg (but fully due to the whole economic meltdown) but as has been said already if they stayed at around £80 we simply would not have them here at all.....

Darren

Ooohhh, that's a bit naughty Darren, saying stuff like that before the list is out :p:p:p:p:p

I know one person who won't be happy :woot:

G

[DaveG28]

In terms of supply issues, £100 may solve that, I can see more people staying on minh than originally planned.

Personally will probably only buy 1 battery at those prices, which will just mean losing rounds if it fails during a meeting!

[RogerM]

and will only encourage more improting of stuff from Hong Kong to save a bit of money......


You might want to check the current buying power of your trusty pound in Hong Kong ...

I have looked and found that to be fair buying from a decent UK shop (their pricing rather than RRP) you will actually be paying less than from Hong Kong for a lot of stuff ... even before you consider the fact you should be paying VAT and duty on top of the HK prices!!!

[Northy]

i thought as darren says they had to have a uk distributor?

OK, I think we have a misunderstanding of the term 'commercially available' here. :D

They might have a uk distributor, but they might not have stock. They might also be cheaper from Hing Hong via Ting Tong..... :p:p

G

[DaveG28]

You might want to check the current buying power of your trusty pound in Hong Kong ...

I have looked and found that to be fair buying from a decent UK shop (their pricing rather than RRP) you will actually be paying less than from Hong Kong for a lot of stuff ... even before you consider the fact you should be paying VAT and duty on top of the HK prices!!!

Top spec esc's are about $210 from HK plus $20 shipping. That's about £165. Import on that price (including parcelforce handling fee) would normally cost me about £25 ish, so maybe £190 total. So I guess maybe prices end up similar here to abroad!? If that's true across other products will be interesting to see how many people still go abroad!

[Jonathan]

I probably shouldnt fuel the argument but....

You can buy a LiPo saddle that fully complies with EFRA spec made by a big company (Intellect) for £55 delivered from HK, £63 if you include tax.

Lets see what the cheapest on the list is.

[DCM]

they must be commercially available, that means, either the distributor has stock, or has an order in for the minimum stock... thats how I understand it.

[Doomanic]

...£55 delivered from HK, £63 if you include tax...

Your figures don't seem right to me. If you have to pay duty on the parcel the handling fee alone will be between £8 and £13.50.

[DaveG28]

Your figures don't seem right to me. If you have to pay duty on the parcel the handling fee alone will be between £8 and £13.50.

I'm only going on what I end up paying, haven't checked how it calculated, but my last order (of about £150ish) from there was for some reason only £20 for duty/handling. Previously on big kit orders of about £300 I've paid up to £40 on duty/handling fee's. Maybe on the small order it wasn't all assessed for some reason?

And remember, I'm actually paying duty etc, lots of people may well not be from other hk places unless things have tightened up!

[Northy]

they must be commercially available, that means, either the distributor has stock, or has an order in for the minimum stock... thats how I understand it.

Check out the BRCA website ;)
G

[Doomanic]

I'm only going on what I end up paying, haven't checked how it calculated, but my last order (of about £150ish) from there was for some reason only £20 for duty/handling. Previously on big kit orders of about £300 I've paid up to £40 on duty/handling fee's. Maybe on the small order it wasn't all assessed for some reason?

And remember, I'm actually paying duty etc, lots of people may well not be from other hk places unless things have tightened up!

Sorry Dave, my post was aimed at Jonathan, not you. I've edited my post to clear that up.

[Jonathan]

Your figures don't seem right to me. If you have to pay duty on the parcel the handling fee alone will be between £8 and £13.50.

Thats a fair point, forgot about the handling. Aslo I only added vat as you dont pay duty on model parts, I dont actually know if batteries for models are subject to duty ?

[Benh]

http://teamtekin.com/batteries.html

Word is out?

[DaveG28]

Looks like it!

[Chrislong]

If what something costs at the shop seems high, and you import it and spend approx the same once everything totaled up, well its actually costing you more - in that the shops may close due to lack of support and then where are we?

Buy from UK shops!!!

Infact, id like to go one step further and say buy UK products where the choice is there to do so.

[DCM]

http://teamtekin.com/batteries.html

Word is out?

they were cleared for touring cars, I think that is what it refers to

[bretts]

The Tekin battery is only 204grams!!!!

Not that it's relevant....

[_sleigh_]

In case anyone missed it...

http://www.oople.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19739

[DaveG28]

If what something costs at the shop seems high, and you import it and spend approx the same once everything totaled up, well its actually costing you more - in that the shops may close due to lack of support and then where are we?

Buy from UK shops!!!

Infact, id like to go one step further and say buy UK products where the choice is there to do so.

Generally I'd agree with this, but for those guys abroad I have built good relationships with (RC Champ/Stella Models) I'll still be using them too, as I want them to get through the downturn in one piece too!

[Darren Boyle]

Ooohhh, that's a bit naughty Darren, saying stuff like that before the list is out :p:p:p:p:p

I know one person who won't be happy :woot:

G

Not really, since the EFRA homolgation fees have just had to be paid out we knew they were EFRA legal and since the BRCA regs are pretty much the same if they pass for one then they pass for both...... Not rocket science.

[Darren Boyle]

I probably shouldnt fuel the argument but....

You can buy a LiPo saddle that fully complies with EFRA spec made by a big company (Intellect) for £55 delivered from HK, £63 if you include tax.

Lets see what the cheapest on the list is.

Cant say for everyone else but our "proposed" (politically correct way of saying BRCA legal) saddle pack has a RRP of £69.99 before any of our dealers offer any discounts on them to theri customers. These are 4400mah/30C so a decent spec too. So no cheaper really, if anything a little dearer from HK with handling inc....

[Jonathan]

Cant say for everyone else but our "proposed" (politically correct way of saying BRCA legal) saddle has a RRP of £69.99 before any of our delaers offer any discounts on them. These are 4400mah/30C so a decent spec too. So no cheaper really if anything a little dearer from HK with handling inc....

That sounds great, I guess everyone is getting impatient (which Im not saying is justified) and seeing a £100 limit got everyone feeling even more twitchy !

As we get closer it looks like there will be a lot more choice than expected and with your info above, more reasonably priced. :thumbsup:

[Darren Boyle]

I think people will be AMAZED at the choice of cells they have, there are FAR more than anyone ever thought there would be and several will be at reasonable pricing too not pushed striaght to the price limit (by that I am not knocking ANY cell (or motor) that is right at the price limit since these products often offer the VERY highest spec and quality and are supported by LARGE distributors whose support is second to none, but at a cost. Several top price products will still be the choice for MANY racers, but there will be some cost effective ones too)