leagality, lipo and insurance

[mark christopher]

Jim Spencer of the BRCA has posted this, insurance does cover thier use and there ok to use if clubs allow them, confirmed below

he was asked "are lipo legal"

Today, 06:31 PM #2 (http://www.rcracechat.com/vb/showpost.php?p=253381&postcount=2) Jim Spencer (http://www.rcracechat.com/vb/member.php?u=222) vbmenu_register("postmenu_253381", true);
Full Member
http://www.rcracechat.com/vb/images/fullmember.jpg

Real Name: Jim Spencer
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Hough, Cheshire
Posts: 814
BRCA #: 270
Club: Crewe Model Car Club


Basically Yes..
But...

It depends what for..

You can run your car on any power source you like as long as its under 30cc. you could put a steam engine in it if you want and the BRCA General Rules* will cover it no problem & the insurance company would be quite happy.

However as for racing it..

That depends on the racing rules for the class you want to run in, and then where you want to run it.

The section rules in the BRCA handbook anly apply to nationals, sanctioned events and other events that want to run to them.
So some clubs and regional series run to strict BRCA rules, and some don't, you need to check with your likely racing location / class to see if they allow LiPo's or not.

This probably hasn't helped you instantly, so what are you planning to do and where and one of us can then answer specifically http://www.rcracechat.com/vb/images/smilies/biggrin.gif


NOTE
*The BRCA General Rules (pages 12/13 2006 handbook) are the only rules that apply to all members & clubs for all events we do, the rest of the sectional rules in the handbook are for National meetings or other events that choose to adopt them.
__________________
Jim Spencer

[jimmy]

Thanks for posting that Mark, puts some questions to rest.

[bert digler]

thats the future

[mark christopher]

been told today trakpower are looking into saddle packs seriously

[xx4-nutter]

would york off road car club allow lipo packs in 2wd modified ?

im thinking of getting a lipo pack

[big si]

that will be the question i asked on racechat then :lol:

i have had a reply from the brca regarding this it reads

Dear Simon,

LiPo cells are not allowed to be used at any BRCA sanctioned events during 2007.

Obviously they do not comply with any of the current battery rules, and none of the Electric Sections (within the Electric Board) have asked for them to be included in the rules.

The latest list of approved NiCd and NiMH cells for 2007 can be viewed on the BRCA website.
Go to the Electric Board Section and 'click' on the battery homologation list.

Best regards,

Paul Worsley. (Secretary, BRCA Electric Board)


from what i can gather they are legalish but not in brca events but you are covered by the brca for insurance purposes

[mark christopher]

yup thread here
http://www.rcracechat.com/vb/showthread.php?p=253566#post253566

but they can be used at regionals should that region decide to allow them, paul is also incorrect though as the bike section do in fct allow lipo at thier nationals, so they are used and ok to at nationals

Exactly
Hi

Yup you've got that spot on, Paul's answer covers the racing rules, mine covers the Insurance aspect and hence their use at clubs and other regional series.

For example the HPI winter series allows LiPo's as do quite a lot of clubs, the BRCA national series do not, its down to each section within the National structure and then each event organiser/club commitee after that.

So for club use its; Ask the club.

It's a bit like you building a 6 wheeled wind powered buggy, the main rules of the association would be quite happy for you to bash that around the local park, but you would probably need to do a lot of explaining at your local club before they would let you race it..
If you did and then a few others joined in and they were ace fun and even more folks joined in, then you would probably find yourself in a room at the AGM a few years down the line sorting out the National rules for them, that's how the process works.

You'll find there are loads of classes raced at club level that arn't covered in the BRCA rule book as they're not a 'National' class (Electric F1's and the 1/18th classes immediatly come to mind) and this isn't a problem, in fact its exactly what's required as its where the new classes come from.
__________________
Jim Spencer

[mark christopher]

bit more on insurance cover

Hi Mark
The use of LiPo's in RC Cars / motorbikes is fully covered by our Public Liability Insurance.
I Have covered this numerous times on here / the brca website / the other media.
For Nationals the sections choose to allow their use, or not, none of the sections who make up the EB have choosen to use LiPo's for 2007, the Bike section haven't adopted the EB yet.
Jim

[losixxx]

mark you can't use them at any regional's as regional are run to brca rules thus there not brca legal or on the homl list thus you can't legally use them.

[mark christopher]

mark you can't use them at any regional's as regional are run to brca rules thus there not brca legal or on the homl list thus you can't legally use them.
please read the quotes from Jim. where he clearly states they can be used at regionals should that region decide to allow them
regionals are not run to brca rules re tyres as they are open!

[losixxx]

i have mark,
also read the paul worsley (1-10th off-road charimans,ec board chairman) post. saying they are not brca legal for 1/10th off-road (at least) and seeing as all 1/10th off-road regional's are brca sanctioned events then you can't use them and score any points or gain a license grade.

each regional can choose to certain extent there own rules on tyres/cells/motors etc as long as there on the homl list. which lipo's arnt!

[jimmy]

I think that was the same for brushless in the north east regionals - which were allowed before they were "legal" - you just had to take them out for the indoor finals.

[PaulRotheram]

It does actually depend on the region, any region can specify a specific tyre of use, specific motor etc.. it's up to the region to decide what rulings they undertake.

to proove my point, and marks.. brushless was allowed at regionals and EOY finals last year, but not nationals. (from my reading and understanding of all of this) Lipos can be ran at regionals if allowed to do so by that sector.

[PaulRotheram]

scary is that jimmy :yawn:

[losixxx]

brushless were allowed at regionals and eoy but only brushless units on the homl list. lipos' arnt on it so they can't be used, doesnt matter what the regions decide or not only motors/cells on the brca electric board list can be used at a brca sanctioned events ie national/regional.
it was also sancitioned at the 2005 agm that regions could choose to run brushless if the wanted to in the 2006 season, again this came from the 1-10th off-road agm, nothing was said about lipo's for the 2007 season at last year agm!

[jimmy]

I was talking about the 2005/6 INDOOR regionals - and I am not sure there was a list at that time?? I could be wrong on that, but I don't remember any rules?

You had to take them out for the indoor finals.

They were of course allowed all last year also, where the homologation stuff was generally stuck to. And I used it at the f345...


But anyway - I was talking about back in 2005.

[mark christopher]

brushless were allowed at regionals and eoy but only brushless units on the homl list. lipos' arnt on it so they can't be used, doesnt matter what the regions decide or not only motors/cells on the brca electric board list can be used at a brca sanctioned events ie national/regional.
it was also sancitioned at the 2005 agm that regions could choose to run brushless if the wanted to in the 2006 season, again this came from the 1-10th off-road agm, nothing was said about lipo's for the 2007 season at last year agm!
so how come bikes run nationals under the brca and allow lipo?

[Cockerill]

As you posted quoting Jim Spencer

'the Bike section haven't adopted the EB yet' Hence the don't run to EB rules. However, 1/10th Off-Road do, and as the regionals are BRCA sanctioned events they are run to BRCA/EB homl lists. Therefore as Lipo do not appear on any list they are not approved. Same way Reedy brushless motors are not allowed.

[losixxx]

looks like you didnt read jims post mark not me :D

[Northy]

Tom and Losixxx are right here I'm affraid.

G

[super__dan]

I agree with Chris and Tom,

Jimmy I'm sure you are wrong, when we started running brushless you had to run ones that were on the list, I remember Derek Brady explaining the point at every regional at drivers briefing (who wasn't listening ;) ).

At scruitineering for any regional we should by rights have the homologation cells and motors list and check all cars. We don't as a rule but that's on the basis people aren't deliberatly running non legal kit.

Remember rules help control the fun!

[mark christopher]

As you posted quoting Jim Spencer

'the Bike section haven't adopted the EB yet' Hence the don't run to EB rules. However, 1/10th Off-Road do, and as the regionals are BRCA sanctioned events they are run to BRCA/EB homl lists. Therefore as Lipo do not appear on any list they are not approved. Same way Reedy brushless motors are not allowed.

looks like you didnt read jims post mark not me :D

yeh but no but yeh:mad: ...............................i did read it and i also read the one from paul (head of EB) saying "LiPo cells are not allowed to be used at any BRCA sanctioned events during 2007"
yet the bikes do so at thier brca sanctioned nationals! that leaves little confidence in his thoughts on the matter

as i understood it yes they (off road) use the EB rules but they can opt to alter or allow somin at regionals

[mark christopher]

I agree with Chris and Tom,

Jimmy I'm sure you are wrong, when we started running brushless you had to run ones that were on the list, I remember Derek Brady explaining the point at every regional at drivers briefing (who wasn't listening ;) ).

At scruitineering for any regional we should by rights have the homologation cells and motors list and check all cars. We don't as a rule but that's on the basis people aren't deliberatly running non legal kit.

Remember rules help control the fun!
so if some one turned up at a regional with a silver can motor or an old corally modified motor and stick pack cells from tamiya etc, you would disqaulify them or not let them race?

[DCM]

Although valid, that is a rather daft argument, it isn't that they are non-homolgated, but a known quantity and general construction, plus, if someone is running that gear, they are obviously new.

If a region decides to allow you to run brushless and LiPo, then I hope then enforce the minimum weight limit.

[mark christopher]

Although valid, that is a rather daft argument, it isn't that they are non-homolgated, but a known quantity and general construction, plus, if someone is running that gear, they are obviously new.

If a region decides to allow you to run brushless and LiPo, then I hope then enforce the minimum weight limit.
or old and making a return!
perfectly aceptable:)

just as a side note, lipo sadle packs are not far away, so all can play

[Cockerill]

so if some one turned up at a regional with a silver can motor or an old corally modified motor and stick pack cells from tamiya etc, you would disqaulify them or not let them race?

That type or range will then be deleted enabling the current lists to be maintained at a manageable size. .

Can we please start reading the rule books, they normally contain the answers ;)

While we are reading the rules.

1/10th Off-Road handbook states:

25. BATTERIES
25.1 Cars will be driven by a maximum of six rechargeable cells, which cannot be replaced after a race has started.
25.2 The description, specification and types of rechargeable batteries approved for use in Off-Road Sanctioned events can be found in the section entitled ‘BRCA Electric Board’ (EB).

Lipo breaks both them rules, hence cannot be used at sanctioned events, hence cannot be used at regionals, as looking at this rule:

4.1 Off-Road Sanctioned events include the National Championship Series, [I]Regional Championship Series, Indoor Finals, Junior & Veterans’ Championship, British Regional Championship (BRC) and the Inter-Regional F3/F4/F5 Championship. It is possible that further specific events could be sanctioned by the committee.

Regionals are a sanctioned event.

[mark christopher]

you do dont you, you race tc too ;-)

[mark christopher]

Same way Reedy brushless motors are not allowed.
ok another question, if the reedy decal was removed and a lrp/nosram was put on what then? same motor, same markings (vetec) now with a holmlogated decal/name

[Cockerill]

I'm not in a position to give an official answer but I would assume it becomes a legal motor. Although where you would get a LRP/Nosram sticker from I don't know, because as far as I know no-one imports or sells them. Therefore you would have to have a LRP/Nosram motor to begin with.

[PaulRotheram]

Alreet, think the questionings are getting abit silly now, this could go on, and on, and on. Offroad is a civilised place, relaxed as it were.

The questions have been answered, so please don't let the thread drag out with petty questions which we all know the answers to already with abit of common sence.

[Cockerill]

you do dont you, you race tc too ;-)

And again, Nope.

[mark christopher]

Alreet, think the questionings are getting abit silly now, this could go on, and on, and on. Offroad is a civilised place, relaxed as it were.

The questions have been answered, so please don't let the thread drag out with petty questions which we all know the answers to already with abit of common sence.
ok more important did you sort ur car out?

[Chrislong]

Hi Guys,
I missed all the fun!!!

But one point missed by all:
6x Sub-C cells = 7.2v
Lipo pack = 7.4v

Therefore I doubt Lipo will be homoligated for use in the foreseeable future.

[Cockerill]

If only you had told us that yesterday :rolleyes: :D

[DCM]

ok another question, if the reedy decal was removed and a lrp/nosram was put on what then? same motor, same markings (vetec) now with a holmlogated decal/name

Mark, you well know that, even if you bring another stock/19t/mod motor in, that is already done by someone else, albeit another label, you have to have the motor homologated, careless if it is 'identical' to someone elses brand motor.

[PaulRotheram]

ok more important did you sort ur car out?

Still in the process of fixings,

back on topic - lipo

:p

[losixxx]

yeh but no but yeh:mad: ...............................i did read it and i also read the one from paul (head of EB) saying "LiPo cells are not allowed to be used at any BRCA sanctioned events during 2007"
yet the bikes do so at thier brca sanctioned nationals! that leaves little confidence in his thoughts on the matter

as i understood it yes they (off road) use the EB rules but they can opt to alter or allow somin at regionals

NO THEY CAN'T MARK

[mark christopher]

NO THEY CAN'T MARK
Losi

You sure??? ;)

[Chrislong]

NO THEY CAN'T MARK

Wow, don't shout so loud, my eyes are ringing!

[big si]

Hi Guys,
I missed all the fun!!!

But one point missed by all:
6x Sub-C cells = 7.2v
Lipo pack = 7.4v

Therefore I doubt Lipo will be homoligated for use in the foreseeable future.

this isnt realy an arguement if you look at new style cells like 4200mah

there voltage on a pack of good cells is what 1.22-1.23v per cell x6=7.32-7.38volts per pack so your already at the 7.4v marker so where is the difference?

cells today have passed there own voltage limit because our cells are worked so much harder to get the most from them lipo is a serious contender. if people want to run them why stop them as there is no advantage in voltage

[big si]

NO THEY CAN'T MARK

from the keyboard of jim spencer

The section rules in the BRCA handbook anly apply to nationals, sanctioned events and other events that want to run to them.
So some clubs and regional series run to strict BRCA rules, and some don't, you need to check with your likely racing location / class to see if they allow LiPo's or not.


the way this reads leads you to the answer if a host club allows lipo you can use them unless you are running to strict brca rules followed to the letter.

[Chrislong]

this isnt realy an arguement if you look at new style cells like 4200mah

there voltage on a pack of good cells is what 1.22-1.23v per cell x6=7.32-7.38volts per pack so your already at the 7.4v marker so where is the difference?

cells today have passed there own voltage limit because our cells are worked so much harder to get the most from them lipo is a serious contender. if people want to run them why stop them as there is no advantage in voltage

Regardless of what the matcher manages to print on the label. the cells are 1.2v cells, regardless of capacity too.

6x 1.2v = 7.2v.

I mean, this 1kg bag of sugar i bought from Tesco actually weighs 1.07kg on the scales in my kitchen, but it is still a 1kg bag of sugar.

[bigred5765]

how many volts and milliamp are the bags of sugar Chris and are they race legal lol

O can i buy a x6 shell of you or Dan if u have one for sale please

paint job not for us cheers i presume your coming to bury Sunday?

[Chrislong]

how many volts and milliamp are the bags of sugar Chris and are they race legal lol

O can i buy a x6 shell of you or Dan if u have one for sale please

paint job not for us cheers i presume your coming to bury Sunday?

Oooh, you should see it when I try to charge it at 7amp *BANG* :D

I don't have any clear shells, you'll have to get that of esro or X-Factory, but if you want to borrow one while you get fixed up, I have the Red shell I used at the Euro's spare. It has a hole in the windscreen.

Can't do Bury tomorrow mate, sorry, got a family meal to go to, so i am off to Teesside tonight to get my 'weekly fix' of racing.

Chris

[bigred5765]

thanks for the offer Chris, its for someone else thats bought a x6 and wants it painting in his own colours, ill contact Daryl direct, thanks for the offer though , and enjoy your meal.

[Slowcoach]

this isnt realy an arguement if you look at new style cells like 4200mah

there voltage on a pack of good cells is what 1.22-1.23v per cell x6=7.32-7.38volts per pack so your already at the 7.4v marker so where is the difference?

cells today have passed there own voltage limit because our cells are worked so much harder to get the most from them lipo is a serious contender. if people want to run them why stop them as there is no advantage in voltage

No Advantage in Voltage?!
1.2 is the nominal voltage (=7.2) and 7.4 is the nominal voltage of a Lipo.
They both produce more than their nominal voltage.
If you look at Trakpowers own info you will see that for yourself.

[Slowcoach]

from the keyboard of jim spencer

The section rules in the BRCA handbook anly apply to nationals, sanctioned events and other events that want to run to them.
So some clubs and regional series run to strict BRCA rules, and some don't, you need to check with your likely racing location / class to see if they allow LiPo's or not.


the way this reads leads you to the answer if a host club allows lipo you can use them unless you are running to strict brca rules followed to the letter.

But if a host club is running a regional event then Lipos cannot be used as it is a sanctioned event. Off-road is the only section that has regional series. 1/12th doesn't, Tc doesn't but has a bunch of other series - some of which are sort of regionalised but aren't sanctioned.

[Slowcoach]

so how come bikes run nationals under the brca and allow lipo?

You already have had the answer.
That is the same question you put on RaceChat over aweek ago.
You have had the answer.

So all you are doing is stirring.

[mark christopher]

You already have had the answer.
That is the same question you put on RaceChat over aweek ago.
You have had the answer.

So all you are doing is stirring.

wrong im asking a valid question to a post!

[DCM]

not read them, but as someone has already posted, they haven't adopted the EB as yet and will probably not have narrowed down the power source.

[Slowcoach]

wrong im asking a valid question to a post!

Really?
You should read your own cut-and-pastes!
(Try post #6 for starters).

[mark christopher]

that will be the question i asked on racechat then :lol:

i have had a reply from the brca regarding this it reads

Dear Simon,

LiPo cells are not allowed to be used at any BRCA sanctioned events during 2007.

Obviously they do not comply with any of the current battery rules, and none of the Electric Sections (within the Electric Board) have asked for them to be included in the rules.

The latest list of approved NiCd and NiMH cells for 2007 can be viewed on the BRCA website.
Go to the Electric Board Section and 'click' on the battery homologation list.

Best regards,

Paul Worsley. (Secretary, BRCA Electric Board)


from what i can gather they are legalish but not in brca events but you are covered by the brca for insurance purposes

Really?
You should read your own cut-and-pastes!
(Try post #6 for starters).

and?

it shows sections dont have to use what the eb say, this forum is more off road and allot on here dont do rcracechat,so i wanted thier views, do you have a problem with that? if so see me on rcracechat ;-)

[Chrislong]

Come on guys, stop swinging handbags and play nicely. :D

The way I see it, this is a new question for this forum so the valid answers here add value to the forum. Doesn't matter who asked what where, the resource for anybody else searching is here too now.

[Slowcoach]

and?

it shows sections dont have to use what the eb say, this forum is more off road and allot on here dont do rcracechat,so i wanted thier views, do you have a problem with that? if so see me on rcracechat ;-)

and ? it shows that your reading is as suspect as your typing:rolleyes:

Simple Facts: -

Lipos are Not allowed In British Radio Car Association sanctioned meetings and this includes Off-Road Regionals.
Bikes do allow them, as they do not run to EB rules (don’t have four wheels either).
All other Sections run to EB rules and can decline to run items on the approved list but can not allow the use of items not on the list.You can run them at club level if the club allows them.

[mark christopher]

bikes are under the brca as a class !! irespective of amout of wheels
12th scale allow lipo as reciever packs, should they?
Jason for some reason you seem keen on having a dig at me take the pi55 all you want on my typing im used to my dislexia being ridiculed, im sure there is not need to get personal.
do you actually race off road?

[Slowcoach]

bikes are under the brca as a class !! irespective of amout of wheels
12th scale allow lipo as reciever packs, should they?
Jason for some reason you seem keen on having a dig at me take the pi55 all you want on my typing im used to my dislexia being ridiculed, im sure there is not need to get personal.
do you actually race off road?

Since when have receiver packs been regulated?:confused:
Roar have banned the use of all Lipo packs, including receiver packs.
1. I'm not Jason.:wtf:
2. Well, as you know that you have a problem with your typing then use a spelling/grammar checker!
3. Selective cut-and-pasting is something that just mis-informs people.

[mark christopher]

Since when have receiver packs been regulated?:confused:
Roar have banned the use of all Lipo packs, including receiver packs.
1. I'm not Jason.:wtf:
2. Well, as you know that you have a problem with your typing then use a spelling/grammar checker!
3. Selective cut-and-pasting is something that just mis-informs people.
oh dear lack of knowledge! you simply buy a reciever pack regulater, lrp and lots of others sell them
who gives a flying frig about Roar, ill never race to those rules and who on here will this is a uk forum and UK runs under BRCA
1/ ur not slowcoach on rcracechat then?
2/ nope ill do as i do not as you say, if you dont like it simple solution is X on top right!
3/so is lack of knowledge ( see top sentance)

[Chrislong]

I'll start the scoring.

1-0 to Mark so far. But can Slowcoach equalise? :confused:

[mark christopher]

im not wanting to score points or argue but for some reason he seems hell bent on having a go at me?

[losixxx]

you seen to have that effect on people mark:D

[Chrislong]

Hi Mark,
I know, and its ridiculous. Your points sound valid and his defense/attack won't stand up to it so he goes to personal attack. His every post devalues the usefulness of this thread to any newcomer looking for informed advice.

Have you upset this guy on another forum?

[jimmy]

Can't we all just love each other? :)

[DCM]

In the end, this is an emotive as well as a motive subject. there are pro's to running LiPo and there are VERy BIG cons right at the moment with LiPo.

Until some form of regulation comes into place from the BRCA or EFRA or IFMAR, whats the point in arguing the toss. They have till the end of this year to devise a construction ruling for LiPo, as cells HAVE to be homologated once a year.

Before LiPo is allowed, then stuff that is for sale over the counter, should have a balancer and a voltage cut-off built in. Solid case design for impact protection, and a minimum current rating on the gel cell inside.

Till then, if a club allows LiPo, I could legitimately go and buy a 10C lipo gel pack, in a silver packet, use it without any voltage protection and blow it up on the track, let alone the fact that a lot of people who WILL buy these, won't have the correct charger either (and Mark, it does and has happened quite a few times). I know the BMFA has instigated some safety rulings for clubs now, they have to have a bucket of saline solution (salty water) to diffuse packs.

In the end, you two can argue the toss and swing handbags, but until construction rules are made, clubs shouldn't touch them, they have a responsibility to their members and members safety (and yes, I do know that Sub C's can go pop). And your BRCA insurance won't cover you for a pack fizzing on to you in the pits, only inside the track.

[mark christopher]

you seen to have that effect on people mark:D
dont you start LOL
Hi Mark,
I know, and its ridiculous. Your points sound valid and his defense/attack won't stand up to it so he goes to personal attack. His every post devalues the usefulness of this thread to any newcomer looking for informed advice.

Have you upset this guy on another forum?
probably

Can't we all just love each other? :)

yes group hug! :D ;)

[Oscar]

Ok, before this turns into a full handbags at 50 paces thread...............,

Whilst doing some background work for the recent oOple lipo review, I produced some discharge graphs. For interest I did an overlay of the ib4200 shv pack (blue line) against the lipo (red line). Both packs had had a similar number of charges from new, and this is at 20 A discharge.
Results are not what I expected, although what you cant see from this graph is the available "punch", which I suspect will be quite different owing to the internal resistance differences between each type of cell composition.

[mark christopher]

In the end, this is an emotive as well as a motive subject. there are pro's to running LiPo and there are VERy BIG cons right at the moment with LiPo.

Until some form of regulation comes into place from the BRCA or EFRA or IFMAR, whats the point in arguing the toss. They have till the end of this year to devise a construction ruling for LiPo, as cells HAVE to be homologated once a year.

Before LiPo is allowed, then stuff that is for sale over the counter, should have a balancer and a voltage cut-off built in. Solid case design for impact protection, and a minimum current rating on the gel cell inside.

Till then, if a club allows LiPo, I could legitimately go and buy a 10C lipo gel pack, in a silver packet, use it without any voltage protection and blow it up on the track, let alone the fact that a lot of people who WILL buy these, won't have the correct charger either (and Mark, it does and has happened quite a few times). I know the BMFA has instigated some safety rulings for clubs now, they have to have a bucket of saline solution (salty water) to diffuse packs.

In the end, you two can argue the toss and swing handbags, but until construction rules are made, clubs shouldn't touch them, they have a responsibility to their members and members safety (and yes, I do know that Sub C's can go pop). And your BRCA insurance won't cover you for a pack fizzing on to you in the pits, only inside the track.
personally dont agree with balancer or cut off as
1/ many speedos now have it
2/ one balancer for £25 will do all your cells so whay have one for every pack individually, plus how would you make it work? a charge plug and a dis charge plug? thats asking for more trouble,
the main thing here as with anything is educating the end user!

[DCM]

Mark, I have countless ESC's, onlt one, at the moment, is LiPo ready, and then it don't autodetec the cell count, so you still have a fundamental issue in that you MUST select the cut-off point, I don't know anyone localy who has a LiPo cell enabled ESC, the newest of the new are LiPo enabled. But those who want the cells (club racers) tend to be at the bottom of the ESC pool, usualy running second hand ESC's.

As much as education is the correct phrase, you have to look at it from another point of veiw, there are a lot of people out there who turn up at meetings, and no matter how much you educate them, they still do it wrong. You then throw in a LiPo cell, which HAS to have a LiPo profiled charger and either a voltage cut-off or lipo enabled ESC that HAS to be set correctly, your just asking for trouble.

Not trying to aruge the toss or create ill feeling and do see where you are coming from. But I am a great beleiver in Murphys first law of idiocy, if it can be done wrong, you will always find someone who CAN do it wrong.

[jimmy]

Those same people probably drove to the meeting - a far more dangerous activity. You can't stop me from driving to work because some numpty crashed once. If you are going to use things improperly in any respect then you're asking for trouble.

You really need the proper equipment yep. I used three ESC's with the LiPo and none had protection, but I knew not to run the cells flat. Everyone who buys a LiPo would know that since it tells you clearly. Whether they act on that adivce or not is up to them. :eh?:

[DCM]

I agree, but then it is also up to the clubs/series organisers/governing body to sort out regulations. I am not against them, it is just, at the moment, way to many possibilities that do make me a little nervous about them.

When a correct charger/ESC/LiPo are used, fine, but unlike any other change in RC Carsover the last 15-20 years, none has needed you to run out and NEED to get new stuff to use it safely.

[mark christopher]

dcm if you cover postage each way ill send you a trakpower pack and charger to use for a month!

[Cockerill]

What is the purpose of this thread?

Looking at the title it is about the legality of Lipo and insurance.

We know that using Lipo has no effect on BRCA insurance.

We know that Lipo is NOT legal at BRCA Sanctioned events (In sections that have adopted EB rules), this means Regionals, Nationals and EoE Finals for 1/10th Off-Road.

Is it time to close this thread so the facts don't get clouded again. Open a new thread for the benefits of Lipo, how to use them, etc

[bigred5765]

once again tom seems to be the voice of reason and sense, why is it that a teenager seems to bring a valid point, and you guys cant,without fisty cuffs
come on guys take a chill pill
group hug
next thread

[DCM]

I only offer the 'other side' of the argument, but not in a LiPo is evil sort of way.

I have three LiPo enabled chargers but only one ESC (18th scale) so will decline the kind offer (again) Mark.

[mark christopher]

can send a voltage cut off too, but use yoor common sense and dont run them flat!

[mark christopher]

What is the purpose of this thread?

Looking at the title it is about the legality of Lipo and insurance.

We know that using Lipo has no effect on BRCA insurance.

We know that Lipo is NOT legal at BRCA Sanctioned events (In sections that have adopted EB rules), this means Regionals, Nationals and EoE Finals for 1/10th Off-Road.

Is it time to close this thread so the facts don't get clouded again. Open a new thread for the benefits of Lipo, how to use them, etc
that was why i started the thread!

[Cockerill]

So let this thread die its death as its purpose has been served, and not post incorrect information as facts.

If you want to discuss the advantages and disadvantages of Lipo see here:

http://www.oople.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2231