D4 Setup Discussion

[jimmy]

Sticky thread for discussing setups - try to keep the other thread just for posting setups if you can :)

[PTRU]

Hi Griff55

well done on TQ and win.:)
Glad you like the car. Nise car to build one of the best I have built.
What set up did you use

Phill T

[dan_kitty]

is there a spring set out out for the d4 yet?

if not what suspention setup from the box is best for uk outdoor tracks?

ta
dan

[mark christopher]

hotbodies do some (part numbers in the manual) but no stock at mirage yet

[GRIFF55]

I have been using the kit springs, they seem ok on most types of track, but could do with some stiffer ones in some conditions

[gramey]

hotbodies do some (part numbers in the manual) but no stock at mirage yet

:) Mark, I had two sets of optional springs arrive last week, pink & white (actually they are still black but with a dob of paint on one end) and I shall be trying the pink ones this weekend.
At our last meeting, my first with the D4, I found the kit springs were fine on our track which is outdoors. I'm going to try the pink springs first as this is what was suggested by Mr Trueman Snr. I believe? in another thread.
I also got the optional rear uprights and toe in blocks so I'll have a fiddle with those as well. I've fitted the 0.5 uprights to start with and the 2.5 mm toe block to keep an overall 3 deg. rear toe.:)

[mark christopher]

:) Mark, I had two sets of optional springs arrive with my rear uprights and toe blocks last week, white & pink (actually they're still black but with a dob of paint on one end).
I found the kit springs worked pretty well on our track, which is outdoors, using 30 wt oil all round. I started with fairly light oil as I didn't want to over damp the springs.
You may be able to get more out of the car with different springs, I'm going to try the pink ones this Sunday weather permitting, and oil etc. but as a starting point I found this set up worked well outdoors.:)
yup out of stock for hubs and springs :(

[joffacn]

Hi

Where can you download the new Blank setup sheet?
There are several setups on the new sheet - but I cannot find a Blank.
These new sheets look "cleaner" being in English only.

Thanks Jeff

[GRIFF55]

Anyone got a good base setup for grass tracks yet??

[dan_kitty]

I need to calm down the rear end a bit, its kicking out a bit too much. Too much steering making it twitchy. From a out the box setting (apart from removing roll bar) , which should i adjust first, front or rear? Dont have much time for messing with it to much so thought id try and get some advice beforehand. Im guessing lenghing the rear camber links as a start, or should i be messing with suspention links on the tower/wishbone?

this is for outdoor grass tracks

any advice appreciated
ta

[gramey]

:) I run mine with 0 camber/ 1 deg. toe out at the front, 2.5 deg. toe in and -2 deg. camber at the back, HB Pink springs and 40 (F) / 35 (R) oil. Rear shocks 2nd hole in (working form the outside of the car) top & bottom, 2nd hole in top and outer hole on wishbone at the front.
To a good driver this probably sounds complete pants but it works o.k. for me running on an outdoor grass track. Ballistic Buggy green mini spikes or yellows if completely dry.:)

[dan_kitty]

ok ta, some things to try there, although i aint got my option springs yet

cheers

[dan_kitty]

hi, so any addvice for a starting point for the coventry f3's this weekend?
havnt a clue what the track is like.
any advice appreciated

ta:)

[Ryantothec]

I built mine this week and raced last night... I had nothing but problems with mine... This kit overall to build was somewhat of a pain... I've been racing over eight years and im a sponssored driver (not by hot bodies)....
What is everyone doing about the constant drive shaft pins backing out and falling off?

and

I don't know where to go as far as setup, it needs alot more steering in general, and feels nowhere as good as a B44... I'm running on a high traction tight indoor 40wt in front and 30wt in rear...

[Northy]

I built mine this week and raced last night... I had nothing but problems with mine... This kit overall to build was somewhat of a pain... I've been racing over eight years and im a sponssored driver (not by hot bodies)....
What is everyone doing about the constant drive shaft pins backing out and falling off?

and

I don't know where to go as far as setup, it needs alot more steering in general, and feels nowhere as good as a B44... I'm running on a high traction tight indoor 40wt in front and 30wt in rear...

My opinion is the toatl opposite :eh?:

The kit was a joy to build, no problems at all.

I did grind flats onto the driveshaft pins for the grub scews to tighten onto, but I do that on any car. I also put heat shrink round the joint once done.

Set-up wise, IMHO the car has heaps of steering.

What surface are you running on, and what is your full set-up? Maybe we can help. :thumbsup:

G

[telboy]

All I can do is echo northy's points on this one.

ok I'm sponsored by mirage BUT...I built the car last year before my sponsorship. It was easy to build, no problems at all.
I didn't file a flat onto the pins but I've threadlocked the grubs and not covered the driveshafts, and have had no problems at all with the pins falling out? and since they've not come out I've not touched them since so as not to alter anything and risk them coming out due to changing something.

Hanlding wise, Mines allways seemed to have plenty of steering on grp's and schumi yellows, 30wt rear and 35wt front. and that was with the kit springs.
Could try a one-way?

[mark christopher]

I built mine this week and raced last night... I had nothing but problems with mine... This kit overall to build was somewhat of a pain... I've been racing over eight years and im a sponssored driver (not by hot bodies)....
What is everyone doing about the constant drive shaft pins backing out and falling off?

and

I don't know where to go as far as setup, it needs alot more steering in general, and feels nowhere as good as a B44... I'm running on a high traction tight indoor 40wt in front and 30wt in rear...

never!!;)

mine was spot on try silver losi front and red rear springs

i did not grind flats in pins but did heat shrink the CVD, built spot on!
where did u struggle?

[Ryantothec]

Alot of the holes did not line upon a few of the main chassis parts...
i think i'll try 35 in the front... I'm considering going over to B44 shocks and axles all around......

Tight indoor, high traction, moist is what im running on... with losi pink tapers all round... with kit springs...
The time that it was running it struggled steering comparing it to a basic setup B44... and the rear seemed to want to come out when on power steering ... either no steering or too much it seemed... however i had the rear sway off. how much is the front one-way doing for everyone?

[Adam Skelding]

Alot of the holes did not line upon a few of the main chassis parts...
i think i'll try 35 in the front... I'm considering going over to B44 shocks and axles all around......

Tight indoor, high traction, moist is what im running on... with losi pink tapers all round... with kit springs...
The time that it was running it struggled steering comparing it to a basic setup B44... and the rear seemed to want to come out when on power steering ... either no steering or too much it seemed... however i had the rear sway off. how much is the front one-way doing for everyone?

If you could send pics of these holes that don't line up that would be good. We've had zero complaints about the kit build up in the area you are suggesting.

As for drive pins, I've never had a problem with them and I don't file a slot.. Good threadlock is the key here. Loctite 242 is my favorite flavour... It holds, but you can still get them out if need be.

If your on Taper Pins, try my set up from Hot Rod Hobbies. It's on the HB website under D4 > setups.

:thumbsup:

[Ryantothec]

Thanks Adam,

I exadgerated the building a tad bit but the upper deck did not line up with the slipper mount. this costed me to bend a few wrenches and strip a few screwz, and a few other minor things that i cannot come up with on the top of my head... I have great expectations for this car and excited but i hope that i can work out the bugs and get it to and pass it's potential.

[Adam Skelding]

The only way the upper deck doesn;t line up is if after you glue the edges, you then don't sand or remove the glue from the fore and aftmost edges where it slots into the slipper mount and gearbox locations.

Having built 3 in 2 days recently, I can honestly say. Not one bit didn't fall into place...
The dremel file or 'force' were never used....

[Ryantothec]

I did'nt even put glue on...

I used Z-42 Thread Lock and they were backing out... I'm just gonna go to A Red Permanent... (I get free parts) if i ever need to replace it...


Also, I was using losi wheels all around and all the wheel nuts were backing off after a minute or two of running...I brought it back to the pits and one of the wheels fell off. Two times the wheel pins in the rear just flew off when i was running... This sucks because most of my wheel stock is losi.

[dan_kitty]

ive never found the driveshaft pins to come off mine, but i did find that my good hex driver couldn't get to the grub screw properly and tighten, it was too thick and rigid (urgh). using a smaller allen type one worked a treat.

hope that helps someone:)

[Ryantothec]

I'm gettin way better with the car, everytime I drive it and work on It!

[dan_kitty]

Hi, im after more steering (indoors), but still want the car to have a responsive feel so i dont want to soften the front too much

im guessing going to the lower castor setting?

or should i be leaving it on 10 degrees and adjusting other things?

thanks

[Adam Skelding]

Depending on where you are wanting the steering.

Going in to the corner
- Reduce Castor to 7 Degrees
- Lower the inner Ballstud
- Raise the Outer Ballstud
- Add a touch of Toe-out.

Coming out of the Corner
- Increase Castor
- Tighter front diff
- Reduce front droop

You don't have to soften the car off. Softening it off can make the car roll more and transfer less weight to the outside wheel.

It's a balancing act...

[mark christopher]

Depending on where you are wanting the steering.

Going in to the corner
- Reduce Castor to 7 Degrees
- Lower the inner Ballstud
- Raise the Outer Ballstud
- Add a touch of Toe-out.

Coming out of the Corner
- Increase Castor
- Tighter front diff
- Reduce front droop

You don't have to soften the car off. Softening it off can make the car roll more and transfer less weight to the outside wheel.

It's a balancing act...
i wanted more going in and raised the out ball stud and added toe out (was slight in) and got the steering i was after,
as adam said i left the springs and damping, but my teacher is the above poster;)

[dan_kitty]

cheers for the advice,

mid to exit steering is what im after, i think anyway...so ill leave caster at 10
it seems like the car is going a little wide on power through the corner,

by reducing the droop, would that be adding some limiters inside the front shocks, if so should I balance the rear with the same amount?

ta:)

[PTRU]

you need a washer under the wheel nut if you are using losi wheels.

The losi wheel is thiner in the boss area so the nut bottoms out on the sholder and does not tighten the wheel enough.

You will also strip the hex if you do not use a washer under the nut.

Phill Truman

[Adam Skelding]

cheers for the advice,

mid to exit steering is what im after, i think anyway...so ill leave caster at 10
it seems like the car is going a little wide on power through the corner,

by reducing the droop, would that be adding some limiters inside the front shocks, if so should I balance the rear with the same amount?

ta:)

Reducing droop can be done either by screwing in the ball end on the shock or by adding some limiters inside the shocks. Always measure between the top of the ball cup and the bottom of the shock to gauge your shock length. It's easiest and most consistent.

As for the rear. No need to alter the rear droop. Unless your car is pitching forward too much under braking. Also, depending how bumpy the track is, you may need droop.

[Billy]

To get more steering you have also the option to tighten the rear diff a bit.

Had the same issue last weekend and this improved the steering on corner exit on throttle and the back of the car just follows your steering nicely.

This will make a different effect depending on the traction of the track!

Also I would not suggest the 7 degree caster blocks, 10 is perfect together with very little toe out!

[Cameo]

I have a question about Ball stud position and camber link length
1. Why are people working so hard to lower the inside ball stud height and raise the outer?
2. I see some use the short rear camber link and some use the long so why do you use either one.

[Eotz]

Hi all.

In 2 weeks finally I'm going to run with my D4 WCE in the new circuit of Bilbo's Club Carbi (The 2009 Euro Circuit) and I would like to know if anyone have a good setup for running over Astroturf?. :)

Regards.

[Fatal1ty]

Hi all,

In a Setup of Adam Skelding stand "Piston: 3x #55 and 3x #56". What does that mean? I only know the 1-3 Pistons uf HotBodies.

thanks! :)

[bigred5765]

they refer to losi piston sizes, IE drill bit sizes,see attachment bellow

[mark79]

I'll be driving indoors on a medium/slippy surface which'll be tight also.

I've sussed out tires but i'm not sure where would be a good place to start in terms of set-up. Can anyone point me in the right direction please :confused:

Thanks :thumbsup:

[ClydeBuilt]

I got my D4 2nd hand and Im a complete noob...worse, an old noob!

I can sort of understand the things some of you guys recommend to get better steering, mines has a very wide turning circle and could do with a lot less understeer.

I've downloaded the setup sheets but have no idea where to start as a baseline, I dont think the buggy is set up right when the understeer is as mad as mines is! The transmission feels/sounds fine and it will whack off down the track dead straight, no wandering and plenty of power.

Its just the steering for me?
I'de be happy to have a working point to start from, the I can change things and log them on the startup sheet, and know rather than guess where I am and where we are going with the adjustments.

Didnt get a manual, having to work off the parts diagram and reviews of the buggy.:blush:

[mark christopher]

make sure you have a good steering servo, and the servo saver is not loose, it needs to be tighter then the manuals setting,
they do understeer, one of its traits

[JCJC]

Manual download from here: http://www.hbeurope.com/manuals/61410.pdf

other gumph that may be interesting:
http://www.hbeurope.com/kit.php?partNo=61410&lang=en

setup wise I would think BJ4,s or B44's would be very close, D4's and B44's being a bit BJ4ish.