A Lazer Zx-r for racing

[Ema]

For all bored Lazer (and kyosho in general) fanatic I think it's time to start a new thread :thumbsup: .

Probably someone will remember my restoration one (here: http://www.oople.com/forums/showthread.php?t=37223); unfortunately still not complete as I have to wait the Kamtec body repro ....
However as promised there it is finally time to build another Lazer but this time for racing ;) ;) ;) !!!

And when I say racing it means that will run among modern cars (Schumacher, Durango, Associated, Hot Bodies, and so on ....); do you think I am totaly crazy :woot: ?
Onestly I don't thik so, however I'd like to read your opinion (and advice ...) here.

Ok, let's stop talking, it's time to start ;) !!

Ema

[Ema]

Problem 1: the battery placment.

I decided to run again the zx-r chassis because it is possible to choose the battery configuration you prefer.
Honestly I don't like at all the saddle configuration, so I have to found a way to secure the stick lipo battery.

My idea is quite simple, I use a small pice of teflon in order to secure the battery at the rear and I get some rc12 body mount in order to replace the standard battery ones because they are too short to use with a lipo.

I know it is possible to make a better holder, however using this solution I did not modify the chassis and/or any lazer parts, so I can improve the design in the future (probably the weight distribution is not the best available ...).

http://img693.imageshack.us/img693/2785/p1010896e.jpg

http://img11.imageshack.us/img11/3831/p1010895o.jpg

[Welshy40]

I can see one problem, the belt rubbing the battery. Ive designed the lipo saddle pack holder so why not use that.

[Ema]

I can see one problem, the belt rubbing the battery and top deck may be lower than battery. Ive designed the lipo saddle pack holder so why not use that.

Don't worry ;), I already checked that there will be enough clearance between the battery and other elements.

You have also to consider that this is an MKII chassis, so the batteries(battery) are (is) placed a little backward compared to the standard one and the belt is a little higher in that position.

At the moment I only own stick lipo battery and I also like the idea of having less wires inside the car, however I don't made any chassis modification, so if I change my mind I can return to saddle configuration.

P.S. I'm glad to know you suggestions as your knoweledge on the Lazer platform is really huge ;).

[Ema]

Some fresh parts before starting the build :thumbsup: !!!

A new set of rubber shielded bearing ....
http://img717.imageshack.us/img717/1883/p1010897w.jpg

A Zx-r MkII motor plate (new) and an good condition 48dp Rw Racing spur gear (hope it will do a good job in the slipper department)
http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/1616/p1010900r.jpg

Together with the MKII motor mount it's necessary to use the latest kind of LA31, the one with the recessed area for the motor ;)
http://img30.imageshack.us/img30/6009/p1010893l.jpg

[Ema]

Another choice ... gear or ball diffs ?

I'm tempted to start with the gear diff because I prefer the easy maintenance, at leat during the first test runs.

Plus for the ball diffs I'd like to wait the new "Welshy Design" smoother pulley ;) !

http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/3781/p1010899w.jpg

[isobarik]

or something like these

http://proxy1.pixbox.se/arkivet/synligt_35/29870000-29879999/120x120/29873788.jpg?0

http://proxy1.pixbox.se/arkivet/synligt_33/29580000-29589999/120x120/29586648.jpg?0

regarding the teamline hubs yeah i can trade just have to deside with what...
i´ll get back to you...

mvh Isobarik

[Welshy40]

I personally go with the gear diffs, not the white Diff halves that iso has as they will snap unless you can set the drivetrain to 70 percent rear as they were designed for a touring car. But the diff ball gears iso has are superb. Gear diffs got me some great results and can handle the power but the slipper had better be set correctly.

[isobarik]

Those white complete diffs i got for the white pulleys they looks so good...and they have a ballbearing in the center...

mvh Isobarik

[Welshy40]

Those white complete diffs i got for the white pulleys they looks so good...and they have a ballbearing in the center...

mvh Isobarik

My kyosho prototype diffs are almost identical except they are made in metal. Two bearings, one in the outdrive and one in the centre of the pulley. Super smooth. How much for one set of outdrives as im tempted to send off to a machinist and have more made seeing as mine are wearing out.

[isobarik]

What do you mean one in the outdrive is it instead of the axial bearing or ????

I can lend you mine so that you may have them copied.

mvh Isobarik

[Welshy40]

What do you mean one in the outdrive is it instead of the axial bearing or ????

I can lend you mine so that you may have them copied.

mvh Isobarik

One of the out drives has a bearin in it and the diff gear in the middle as well. The idea is a good one as there is no resistance due to the two bearings.

I will take you up on that at a later date when i have found the right machinist.

[Ema]

or something like these

http://proxy1.pixbox.se/arkivet/synligt_35/29870000-29879999/120x120/29873788.jpg?0

http://proxy1.pixbox.se/arkivet/synligt_33/29580000-29589999/120x120/29586648.jpg?0

regarding the teamline hubs yeah i can trade just have to deside with what...
i´ll get back to you...

mvh Isobarik

Those white pulleys are the one designed by Whelsy or something else ?

Thanks for the Team Line hubs, I will update my item list as soon as the build will going on ;)

P.S. Seems that you are really smart in finding vintage aftermarket hop up parts for our kyosho :thumbsup: .

[Ema]

I personally go with the gear diffs, not the white Diff halves that iso has as they will snap unless you can set the drivetrain to 70 percent rear as they were designed for a touring car. But the diff ball gears iso has are superb. Gear diffs got me some great results and can handle the power but the slipper had better be set correctly.

Another couple of questions ..

Is it possible to fill the gear diffs using some diff oil ? Or you have only to use some standard grease ?

When running the ball ones is it necessary to rebuild them often ?

[Welshy40]

Those white pulleys are the one designed by Whelsy or something else ?

Thanks for the Team Line hubs, I will update my item list as soon as the build will going on ;)

P.S. Seems that you are really smart in finding vintage aftermarket hop up parts for our kyosho :thumbsup: .

Iso is learning from the master, me. Still his skillls are good at sourcing.

I found most and designed a lot for all lazer zx, zxr, zxs and the lot made by fibre lyte are because i sent the originals to them, i also supplied kamtec with the zxs and tomcat shell. I also designed the tub chassis for the zx and zxr. Still cant find the original as i sold it.

Also due to persuasion we can now get rare items such as layshaft gears,diff gears and gearbox cases for these cars from dyna.

Ive thoroughly tested these items and i can ruin most things in a short time and the quality speaks for itself as ive not managed to kill a diff or layshaft gear yet.

Ive also done a mod on the zxr and all info is placed on radiocontrolzone.com under the lazer zx,zxr,alpha thread from page 8 onwards. May interest you.

[Ema]

Iso is learning from the master, me. Still his skillls are good at sourcing.

I found most and designed a lot for all lazer zx, zxr, zxs and the lot made by fibre lyte are because i sent the originals to them, i also supplied kamtec with the zxs and tomcat shell. I also designed the tub chassis for the zx and zxr. Still cant find the original as i sold it.

Also due to persuasion we can now get rare items such as layshaft gears,diff gears and gearbox cases for these cars from dyna.

Ive thoroughly tested these items and i can ruin most things in a short time and the quality speaks for itself as ive not managed to kill a diff or layshaft gear yet.

Ive also done a mod on the zxr and all info is placed on radiocontrolzone.com under the lazer zx,zxr,alpha thread from page 8 onwards. May interest you.

Don't worry Welshy, I know that you are the master ;) !

I also know your huge development made on the Lazer chassis; I'm also really glad that you want to share (or shared) everithing with us :thumbsup:.

[Ema]

Time for some updates :D !!

http://img132.imageshack.us/img132/5436/p1010902b.jpg

Bye bye phillips screws !!

http://img132.imageshack.us/img132/3616/p1010901f.jpg

[Welshy40]

Don't worry Welshy, I know that you are the master ;) !

I also know your huge development made on the Lazer chassis; I'm also really glad that you want to share (or shared) everithing with us :thumbsup:.

These websites are just for that - sharing, and if you make something that you believe is nice I think its got to be shared. Still I am more than happy that there are people just like me with the same passion that I can share my ideas with - thanks for making my day. :thumbsup:

PS - Iso is catching me up rapidly. I have to admit he has got a talent for finding things which I was unable to. Top notch!!!

The slipper looks good, and for your reference Rob Gammon (team Kyosho Driver in the UK used a 99 spur gear on high grip surfaces, and I tried it and give just a fraction more top end at the end of the straight so may be worth trying out when you decide to run it.

[isobarik]

The pulleys are from RW-racing the last he had they are machined so they are absolutley true....

he could make more but he wouldnt do less then 20 if i remember correctly

the complete diffs i got from an LHS

mvh Isobarik

[Welshy40]

They do look the dogs b***ocks in white and cant wait to see your completed zxs. I know its going to be superb.

[isobarik]

I hope so to will post some pics tomorrow on the rear gearbox.

mvh Henrik

[Ema]

Steering parts ready :thumbsup:

http://img118.imageshack.us/img118/4558/p1010903.jpg

[Ema]

Finally the car is taking its shape ;) ;) !!

http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/6674/p1010905z.jpg

http://img638.imageshack.us/img638/2388/p1010904f.jpg

[Ema]

Servo assembly :thumbsup: !

I used an old but good KO 2173 servo, with a kimbrough servo saver and some RPM servo mounts that move the servo a litter closer to the belt.
Here's some pictures :D :

http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/200/p1010909e.jpg

http://img686.imageshack.us/img686/2037/p1010910.jpg

http://img682.imageshack.us/img682/37/p1010911s.jpg

[Welshy40]

Looking good, however the servo saver looks like the small one, and will not give you the full steering as the saver lacks the spring strength that the bigger version has. I used the big version Kimbrough on my ZX and currently use on my ZXS. You will need the servo plate to use that.

Good idea on the servo posts, me I used B2 ones with the extra thin extension plastic plates that come with it to move it really close to the belt.

[Ema]

Looking good, however the servo saver looks like the small one, and will not give you the full steering as the saver lacks the spring strength that the bigger version has. I used the big version Kimbrough on my ZX and currently use on my ZXS. You will need the servo plate to use that.

Good idea on the servo posts, me I used B2 ones with the extra thin extension plastic plates that come with it to move it really close to the belt.

Thanks Welshy for the advice ;).
I was thinking that the bigger version was too big, but I was wrong.
Furthermore that the wasp racing chassis as an hole under the servo saver that seems made to allow the use of the bigger one.

I will fix it as soon as I can :).

[Welshy40]

You need to keep the central holes and cut off the side holes. You may need to cut the highest hole and just use the lower. When i get time i will send you a picture of mine.

[Ema]

The build is advancing slowly, however is going :D.

Maybe someone will recognize some of these parts ...

http://img709.imageshack.us/img709/7347/p1010912t.jpg

[Ema]

In order to use the associated imperial ball studs (a lot more friendly compared to the kyosho ball + 2.6 mm screw system) it is necessary to enlarge the lower holes of the shock towers from 2.6 to 2.8mm.

I just hope that the rear camber mount will still be strength enough .... :blush:

P.S. Note the non adjustable wing mount .... it cames from a Lazer Alpha , kyosho part no RD28 .



http://img169.imageshack.us/img169/9333/p1010914n.jpg

http://img710.imageshack.us/img710/5229/p1010913x.jpg

[Welshy40]

The build is advancing slowly, however is going :D.

Maybe someone will recognize some of these parts ...

http://img709.imageshack.us/img709/7347/p1010912t.jpg



I recognise them, i designed them. Great looking good.

[Ema]

Uh !! One week elapsed from the last update, sorry but I was in trouble finding some decent turnbuckles.

Finally I got them, but please don't tell to my Lazer that they came from one of its main competitor in its days ..... it's a secret between me and you :D :D :D !!

http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/1991/p1010930k.jpg

[Ema]

The arms ready to be assembles :thumbsup: !!

http://img256.imageshack.us/img256/6449/p1010931e.jpg

[Ema]

And finally some updated pictures of the car ;) .

I like the "modern look" of the titanium turnbuckles together with the black RPM ball cups :) .

Note also the 7 degree wider front hubs with the longer universal joint.

http://img293.imageshack.us/img293/523/p1010932.jpg

http://img709.imageshack.us/img709/5443/p1010933.jpg

http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/6232/p1010934r.jpg

[moth898]

Hey Ema, where can I find a set of those aluminium arm holders?

[Welshy40]

Ema,

looking good. I would advise turning the very rear blue alloy pivot block upside down as this gives the cars wishbones an angle and does improve the overall performance.

[Ema]

Hey Ema, where can I find a set of those aluminium arm holders?

I got those holders together with an used Zx-r I bought some time ago (more than one year ... ) here on oOple, I was lucky.
It was a quite common upgrade in the Lazer era, but now I don't really know where you can find them.

Keep an eye on ebay, because some of the used Lazer that appears came with these parts (according to Welshy only one holder is really mandatory, the front one).

For example in this closed auction there was a front one:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=320503534179

And maybe also this car got something, but more squared, not as nice as mine :
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=360256299953

[Ema]

Ema,

looking good. I would advise turning the very rear blue alloy pivot block upside down as this gives the cars wishbones an angle and does improve the overall performance.

Thanks for the advice ;) .

[isobarik]

Hey Ema, where can I find a set of those aluminium arm holders?

watch ebay or you could ask Skidrow ( manolis ) he seams to be a wiz with the machine.

mvh Isobarik

[Ema]

Ok Lazer's guys, I know you are half asleept but now it's time to finally wake up :) !!

I finally found some time to continue the building, do you like these shocks ?
Probably you will easily recognize that are from an Associated buggy, but with some little modification they fit without any problem.

http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/7150/p1010937j.jpg

[Ema]

And now some photo of the whole thing together :thumbsup: .

I decided to change the front spring to a silver one, probably better that the super soft brown used generally on the 2wd.


http://img72.imageshack.us/img72/8906/p1010018r.jpg

http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/3572/p1010017lz.jpg

http://img210.imageshack.us/img210/6294/p1010020tu.jpg

http://img94.imageshack.us/img94/7965/p1010019e.jpg

[Welshy40]

Looks stunning with my shock towers, thanks for that. Lovely job.

[Ema]

The electronic is ready :) !!

Motor: Orion Vortex 6.5 (new)
ESC: Xerun 120 v1.1 (used but like new)

http://img683.imageshack.us/img683/397/p1010028p.jpg

[Ema]

Uh, fitting the new huge brushless electronic on the Lazer is really a difficult task, however at the end I'm quite satisfied ;).

http://img248.imageshack.us/img248/9536/p1010032y.jpg

http://img28.imageshack.us/img28/5438/p1010033h.jpg

[trd179v]

EMA..Your Setup is very Hip-no-tizing!:drool::wub
Uh, fitting the new huge brushless electronic on the Lazer is really a difficult task, however at the end I'm quite satisfied ;).

http://img248.imageshack.us/img248/9536/p1010032y.jpg

http://img28.imageshack.us/img28/5438/p1010033h.jpg

[Welshy40]

Nice, but why the orion instead of the LRP SXX TC as that fits more easily, and the new speed passion motor with the three corally end connectors so no soldering on the motor. Still looks good.

[Ema]

Nice, but why the orion instead of the LRP SXX TC as that fits more easily, and the new speed passion motor with the three corally end connectors so no soldering on the motor. Still looks good.

You are right, but I will definitely need to find a sponsor for buying all that newest stuff :D :D :D !!!!

[Welshy40]

Hehe well the sxx tc esc is noticably quicker. But if it works why change it.

[rondoolaa]

great car ema

[Ema]

great car ema

Thanks ;) !!!

I just finished (yesterday night) to paint the body and the undertray, so I will complete this building tread soon ....very soon :thumbsup: !!

Bye
Ema

[isobarik]

yeah show us some body pics .....

what type pf body are you going to use ???

mvh isobarik

[kek23k]

Looking sweet Ema. I'm very jealous lol

[Ema]

As promised ..... some picture of the car with the body :thumbsup:.

For the body I used a Zx-r repro found some months ago (you can see that body also in the other Zx-r thread, the long one ;)) delivered by hand from a guy that lives 15 km away from my house ....

I have to admit that I'm not really a great painter, however looking at the Zx-r body I thought that was not really a good thing using a too complex painting scheme. This because the body is full of small details and so I prefer to didn't hide them with flames, tribals, bubbles and so on.

Ok, now it's time for some photos, hope you like them ;) .

http://img541.imageshack.us/img541/8379/p1010049o.jpg

http://img708.imageshack.us/img708/7376/p1010051ga.jpg

http://img813.imageshack.us/img813/2224/p1010053.jpg

http://img440.imageshack.us/img440/9902/p1010055i.jpg

Need to get some other DMS decals, as they match perfectly my paint scheme :D !!!

[Ema]

A little note about the battey retaining system .....

During the build I changed my mind and I prefer to use a simple, effective and old style method called ..... velcro :D .
And in order to keep the battery in a fixed position I cut two small pice of 1mm Lexan and fixed them to the battery using some double sided tape.

http://img155.imageshack.us/img155/4734/p1010056u.jpg

http://img28.imageshack.us/img28/645/p1010057kr.jpg

Now the car is ready to hit the track, probably this happen the 12th of December at the first of our indoor (not vintage) race in Bologna (Italy).
For that date I still need to find a couple of associated front blue springs (I already got the rear silver ones) and two B44 offset spring cups (9724) for the front shocks (now the shock collar is at the bottom end of the threaded part of the shock body, but the car is a little too low).

Bye
Ema

[Welshy40]

Very nice. Dont forget the car is now 225 grams lighter with Lipos so you will need to soften the suspension a bit. Good luck on the track

[Boyracer]

Fantastic rebuild:thumbsup: How did it work on the track? I have 2 Lazers myself, one buildt to race. Welshy40 helped me a lot a couple of years ago, thanks for that:)

[Ema]

Fantastic rebuild:thumbsup: How did it work on the track? I have 2 Lazers myself, one buildt to race. Welshy40 helped me a lot a couple of years ago, thanks for that:)

Glad to know that another Lazer Fan likes my rebuild :D !!!

I run the car only twice in two indoor meetings.
The first one was the first time on the track for my Lazer and I spent all the time in fixing minor issues (all related to non kyosho parts :woot:), in order to get more reliability ;) .
At the second meeting the car performed well among newer cars and only few people recognize that I was using a 20 years old model ;).
I still need to find a better setup and probably I have to adjust a little the weight distribution, but the feeling is that the car can still compete at high level.

http://img526.imageshack.us/img526/8075/mylazer.jpg

Bye
Ema
P.S. Welshy also helped me a lot of times ;); it is incredible the work he made around the Lazer platform but the best part of his work is that he share everything with us, so now in 2011 we can still find a lot of parts ...... thank you James (Welshy40) :thumbsup:.

[Welshy40]

Guys your all welcome. Im glad that there are lazer fans out there just as passionnate about this as i am and i went out of my way to make sure that this car will still be going years from now.