ZX5 setup questions

[daz]

//please can you ask your setup questions here thanks//



cheers for the set up, mines not to far off that might have to pop and see u for a bit of advice at kiddy dude.

[JCJC]

Any definitive tips for indoors on carpet.........seems a waste indoors I know and expect to be outside with the Stotfold setup soon, but what should I adjust (I have yellow minipins in the box) for flat track with a couple of jumps.

[niggs98]

hi
please can you ask your setup questions here thanks,

[jimmy]

CVD's!

Is it true they will square the car up under power ? do you run the cvd's all the time anyway? apart from scouring the track for the dogbone when breaking a hub is there really that much of an effect on performance with the rear cvd's ?

[niggs98]

CVD's!

Is it true they will square the car up under power ? do you run the cvd's all the time anyway? apart from scouring the track for the dogbone when breaking a hub is there really that much of an effect on performance with the rear cvd's ?


dont know as to squaring the car up as have never tested the 2 back to back for that situation but the car does seem smoother on the track with the cvd's so i do run them all the time

[niggs98]

Any definitive tips for indoors on carpet.........seems a waste indoors I know and expect to be outside with the Stotfold setup soon, but what should I adjust (I have yellow minipins in the box) for flat track with a couple of jumps.

to be honest id just go with the stotfold set up as its for dry astro with jumps and you will see that the car sits very low anyway and the stotfold set up is good with bb minipins in green and yellow minis dont seem to grip any more than those so give it a go and stiffen it up with a 1.6 roll bar on the back if required

[niggs98]

can anyone with questions as to set ups please post in the questions section so we can save this thread for just set ups. if jimmy can move the last few posts to the set up questions section and make that a sticky as well it would be awsome

cheers m8

[jimmy]

There we go, I can't re-order yours to the top, it seems nathan, but hopefully this doesnt look too messy! :)

[niggs98]

There we go, I can't re-order yours to the top, it seems nathan, but hopefully this doesnt look too messy! :)

that will be fine jim, thanks for the help m8 ;)

[stefke]

@ niggs98 :

I have a race on astro in 2 weeks and I'm going to use your Stotfold setup and start from there (thanks for that).

I have a few little questions though :

You once posted your stotfold setup in a thread here, and it mentioned yellow springs at the front. On your setup sheet in the sticky, you mention orange springs at front. :confused:
On the setup sheet, you state you used no spring preload at the front. But this way, the front ride height is a lot less then the rear. With your setup, the car lies very low indeed. Didn't it bottom out on jumps and bumps?
Will the setup work with Schum yellow minipins (the controll tyre over here).

[niggs98]

hi
the front shock springs are the yellow orange number 60,
the front ride height was that low to take away some front end grip as the astro was very dry and had loads off grip,
the setup should work with yellows we used greens,
the ride height probbaly will need to be played with to tune it to your track but shouldnt be a million miles away,

[stefke]

Thanks mate ! :thumrigh:

I don't know if you're going to the Belgian GP this year at Kampenhout (a lot of brits come over every year), but if you're interested, I can test this setup at that track. It was changed a fair bit over the winter this year.

[niggs98]

funnily enough nathan and myself(stu)will be coming over to the belgium gp this year,whats the tyre wear like on yellow minipins,

[stefke]

When it is really dry, about 3 heats per set. You can use them longer, but they loose that little edge that can make a difference. Schum yellow mini spikes work too, but I find minipins a bit more progressive and predictable there. Plus it is one of the controll tyre for our nationals.

I hope I see you at the GP. By the time I wanted to inscibe in january, it was already fully booked so I won't be driving. :( And being a member of the local club doesn't help. It seems off road is on the move again. They never had the GP fully booked so early.

[SimonW]

Has anybody tried less front kick-up yet, i have and it was loads better, really ripped into the corner and seemed to come out better too, maybe cos the front isn't getting pushed up so much under acceleration by the arms, whatever it is it's much better(used 3 nub shim under 'D' block), min' kick-up is 4 nub shim unless you leave the centre screw out

[nick oliver]

I have found 3 is best allround too.. even tho i dont know what it does much lol:p

[stefke]

For whom it might concern, the Stotfold setup works fine for me at the Kampenhout track (Belgium). So for all of you coming to the EFRA race you can use it as a base setup.

I found it very agressive but I like it that way. I was using Schum minipins (yellow) front and rear with the outer and inner two rows cut. What I changed in comparison to the Stotfold setup : I went for 45 oil in the front and one type of spring harder, 1,4mm rear stabilizer instead of 1,6mm and a slight reduction in rideheight (about 3mm)

[jim76]

Hi all
i recently aquired a fully modded ZX5 and am in the middle of preparing it for a regioanl this weekend.

I've been advised to run a front diff with a centre one way on the driveshaft. I thought the centre one way was an option part, but a brief conversation with a model shop and the guy thinks it's the same bearing as the front one-way diff, you just swap it into the centre driveshaft. Does anyone know if this is correct, it's just the Kyosho manual is a little less informative than i'm used to!

thanks
James

[jimmy]

yes mate.. The car comes with two one way bearings, the diff one way uses both. the Centre one way uses just the one. The best option is just to buy another bearing so you can use both easily without so much messing about.

So if they are in the diff one way you'll have to pull one out - not sure how easy that is as its been a while since I looked.

[jim76]

cool, cheers Jimmy.

[notlawnomis]

With the Interclub coming up at Batley next month wondered if anyone had a good setup they'd be willing to share!!

Looks like NERCR will be able to put at least one team together!!

[niggs98]

i have sent a set up to jimmy for what i ended up on at the batley national so euros allowing it will be up soon or pm me a email addy and i shall forward you a set up sheet for the track.

Thanks

Nathan
With the Interclub coming up at Batley next month wondered if anyone had a good setup they'd be willing to share!!

Looks like NERCR will be able to put at least one team together!!

[notlawnomis]

Cheers Nathan and Jimmy for getting it posted so quickly

Simon

[KyoshoK]

anyone here got a general setup for dusty dirt tracks?? i'm looking for something from mark pavidas but cant find any

[niggs98]

if you go to 4wdrc.com there is a kyosho section there and pavidas's setup from the cactus classic is in there somewhere

[wolli]

Does anybody know the best Setup from the European Championship in Vienna at the RMC-Track?

[niggs98]

having just done the euros last week i shall be posting a setup soon for the vienna track

[KyoshoK]

hi guys. just building my first zx-5.

the manual says put spacer in the front of each of the bulkhead (under D plate for the front and BR plate)

but it doesnt say anything about putting a spacer under the rear toe plate (A30), and also behind the front bulkhead (under C plate)

do you put spacers there? coz i seen some setup sheets it specifies to but plates there.

thanks

[andreasH]

Hello all,
I have my Lazer since a couple of weeks. Watching the Lazer category in this forum I found many ideas and good hints.

I just tried setting up my ZX5 like the Batley sheet.
Some general questions for the setup sheets figured out here:
(Maybe because I could not interpret the english name for the parts in the right way)

- Front and rear suspension 'Upper Spacer': Is it an optional part or is it in the kit?
Where to find, which itemnumber?

- Axle Hight Spacer: What is meant by UP or LOW? Is the UP position with the spacer on the bootom?

- Hub Carrier back: How to set up the hub carrier to 2°? Is it an option part or just put the screw to another hole?

- long wheel base on rear hub: What to do here?

Is there an general description for the setup sheet and for the effects using option parts?

Please help me a little here.

thanks
Andreas

[KyoshoK]

thanks to jimmy for his review and suggesting to use short camber links front and rear. it made the buggy so much easier to driver and less twitchy.

this always went against what i thought those links was supposed to do.

i always thought a longer links gave more stability, and better for loose tracks.

[andreasH]

- Front and rear suspension 'Upper Spacer': Is it an optional part or is it in the kit?
Where to find, which itemnumber?

- Axle Hight Spacer: What is meant by UP or LOW? Is the UP position with the spacer on the bootom?

- long wheel base on rear hub: What to do here?
Still looking for answeres to my last post.
I need a working setup for very low traction.
Someone who can help me here?

[sosidge]

Well, I have run the car on slippy gym floors a couple of times (pretty low traction), and found that basically the kit setup minus rear anti-roll bar, with a diff up front, centre one-way (locked if the track is REALLY slippy) worked just fine, maybe a slight lack of steering on-power.

Pretty basic I know but it might be a starting point.

[andreasH]

Thanks. I run the front diff and center locked. Steering could be better.
The car of a friend has the KMC conversion and runs much better here.
The track is clay/loam and is absolut glibbery.
I run Proline Hole Shot, which tires would be good here?
So I will test without the anti-roll bar. Would an anti-roll bar in front be good here?

[sosidge]

No harm in trying a front anti-roll bar, however it is more likely to reduce steering than create it. Personally speaking I don't really like anti-roll bars as they make the car a bit fidgety over the bumps.

All you can do is try these things!

[bert digler]

i run losi silver front springs and pink rear spring the car was loads better this on wet astro so it was slippy like clay and it jumped a load betteri n fact u could push it thats a first for a lazer also run 50 wt oil in the front with big pistons

[andreasH]

I will try some changes tomorrow on our last clubrace.

[andreasH]

The weather was very bad this weekend so our race was canceled.:(
The Buggy season is over for this year, now we go for indoor onroad.
The club is doing an modification of the track in the next weeks.
Hopefully they change the road surface to get more grip otherwise
i have to work very hard on an working setup next season.
(now waiting for christmas to get some new parts, maybe the conversion kit)

[niggs98]

upper spacers are just a standard 1mm thick washer so 2 of those to raise the ball stud to stiffen it up the roll a little

up position is with the washer below the front hub

2 dgree hubs are an option part (sorry dont know the number)

long wheel base on the hub is to put all the hub spacer washers in front of the hub to push it backwards as far as possible

hope this helps. sorry for the delay in answering your questions but i dont get the chance to look on here very often ;)

Hello all,
I have my Lazer since a couple of weeks. Watching the Lazer category in this forum I found many ideas and good hints.

I just tried setting up my ZX5 like the Batley sheet.
Some general questions for the setup sheets figured out here:
(Maybe because I could not interpret the english name for the parts in the right way)

- Front and rear suspension 'Upper Spacer': Is it an optional part or is it in the kit?
Where to find, which itemnumber?

- Axle Hight Spacer: What is meant by UP or LOW? Is the UP position with the spacer on the bootom?

- Hub Carrier back: How to set up the hub carrier to 2°? Is it an option part or just put the screw to another hole?

- long wheel base on rear hub: What to do here?

Is there an general description for the setup sheet and for the effects using option parts?

Please help me a little here.

thanks
Andreas

[Southwell]

hope this helps. sorry for the delay in answering your questions but i dont get the chance to look on here very often ;)

9 months delay? :D

[niggs98]

but still answered :S :) :S

[andreasH]

but still answered :S :) :S
thanks for the answer

I learned to be patient.

[Lestat]

Hello,

has anybody a good basic setup for the ZX-5 with the KM conversation kit?

thanks

Roman

[bert digler]

Hello,

has anybody a good basic setup for the ZX-5 with the KM conversation kit?

thanks

Roman

losi red springs rear
losi blue front
35 rear oil
40 front
basic kit geometry

[Lestat]

Thanks!

[lazerboy]

Okay, so heres the science! Dogbones and universal joint axels spine the wheel at a varying rate if the axles aren't parallel to the ground because the pivot point and engagement point( where the dogbones touch the diff. i.e. the little nubs that stick out.) This makes it so that the rotational force is now trying to make the axles parallel to the ground instead of spinning the wheels. CVD's, or constant velocity drives have the pivot point in the center of rotation. This means that as long as the axle doesn't make a 90 degree bend, it will still spin at the same rate. This causes the suspension to move freely without the axle trying to hold it still. Somebody just needs to come out with cvd's that are easily removed from the diff side so you can have a true cvd.(have two joints on one axle, not one and a dogbone.) JIMMY you should understand this. it's like a four bar link or horst link on a bike. When you pedal the susp. is still free to move. (and braking too)

[SimonW]

Schumacher did this with uj's not cvd's, they where telescopic i do believe, their only downfall was they where plastic and broke easily. This is why they switched to blades. HTH

[lazerboy]

that's what traxxas does. if they were metal they would be insanely heavy. They have to be telescopic. I want to see some cvd joins connected by a carbon telescopic axle. On the cheap.

[Sabben]

Hi guys!

I just wondered what setup I should have as a basic. The track I'm going to run at is quite smooth and hard-packed gravel/sand with some bits of carpet in some corners. It is in general a quite small track, with many hairpins and sharp corners.

I just ordered the middle-rear conversion, so I will be trying that.

I thought of Mark Pavidis' setup for the Cactus Classic -06 as a basic, and adjust after. Good idea?

If somebody got any kinds of tips for a good setup, please post it;-)

Andreas=)

[RogerM]

Does anybody know where I can get a blank set-up sheet for the ZX5-SP?

If I can get an editable one I'll post up my set-ups here!

[MATTY]

http://www.kyoshoamerica.com/setupsheets/

[RogerM]

Matty, thanks for the link but that is for the ZX5 .... not the ZX5-SP with the revised front end (which is worth every last penny by the way!!!!)

[gps3300]

Where can I buy the SP conversion kit from in the UK and what price should I expect to pay? Can't find it in stock.

[JCJC]

Matty, thanks for the link but that is for the ZX5 .... not the ZX5-SP with the revised front end (which is worth every last penny by the way!!!!)

Look at this one Roger,

http://werkzrc.com/kbuggy/wp-content/uploads/2008/01/zx5_sp_setupsheet.pdf



I can download it (open it) but it won't work, no click save, mabey you will have more luck

[RogerM]

Thanks mate, I've found that one ... there is also a JPG of it too on the Kbuggy site ... should have posted it up, my bad.

Got the SP to the point I am really happy with it .... now I just have to drive it!!!

[JCJC]

Just worked my way back to the KBuggy bit,

http://werkzrc.com/kbuggy/

Looks usefull.

Can you get the "editable" sheet to work ?

[jim76]

Where can I buy the SP conversion kit from in the UK and what price should I expect to pay? Can't find it in stock.

Microtech stock it at £65 but currently show out of stock. Give Keith a ring there and find out when it's due back in, shouldn't be long.

[RogerM]

DC Racing will get it for you ...... be ordering for me regularly so won't be a problem at all.

[Hog]

I race a KMC converted ZX-5 on a polished wooden floor, still using NiMh at the moment but running a Novak GTB with a 13.5 motor as we race stock.

As of late the handling on my car has gone to pot. Whatever I do I cannot stop the arse end from breaking away constantly. I've tried changing camber links in and out, moved the shocks, rebuilt the shocks, introduced a little kick-up, etc etc, but whatever I do seems to have little or no effect.

Is anyone racing a KMC chassis on a similar surface? If so - do you have a setup to give me a starting point to return to?

It's getting so frustrating I'm considering selling the damn thing!

Current setup:
Shocks 35wt front, 30wt rear.

Pale yellow springs all round.

Front camber link middle hole, washer under knuckle arm. Washer under inner ballstud.

Shocks outer hole on wishbone, middle hole on tower.

Rear camber link middle hole, inner on the hub (alloy). Washers under both ends and hub on middle wishbone pin. Long wheelbase.

2 deg camber on rear, 1.5 deg on front.

10deg castor blocks on front.

I have loads of steering, but the back end is just floating.

Any ideas chaps?

[SimonW]

if you have just switched to brushless and it would appear to you that it's all gone bad since you put it in then maybe you should try adjusting the drag brake value i had a similar problem with my RB5. HTH

[Hog]

I do have the drag brake set - but how is this going to affect the car breaking away under acceleration?

I may try it with drag brake switched off and see what that does though. Seems to be more of a suspension / transmission problem.

[SimonW]

Coming out of corners oversteer can be easily cured by either less anti-squat, softer rear springs or lowering the inside ballstud @ the rear. I would try the springs first

[RogerM]

Go back to the original chassis ............ get an SP suspension upgrade pack (LAW35) and it will all be sorted.

I've tried a KMC converted car (bought off ebay, sold 2 weeks later) just out of interest and it was very, very poor compared to the standard chassis arrangement!! It was the rear end that was the problem there too.

[Hog]

Go back to the original chassis ............ get an SP suspension upgrade pack (LAW35) and it will all be sorted.

I've tried a KMC converted car (bought off ebay, sold 2 weeks later) just out of interest and it was very, very poor compared to the standard chassis arrangement!! It was the rear end that was the problem there too.

It had been fine up until recently. I've been running the KMC chassis for ages now and really like it - even more so outside.

It's either something to do with going brushless and the way the power is delivered is causing the problem, or it could be something as simple as the last set of tyres I put on (we all run yellow full spikes) are duff.

Something has to be causing it!!

[Sabben]

I'm quite sure this have been posted here some place... But does anyone have an chart for the Kyosho shock pistons versus the Associated pistons?

Are they quite similar, or are they way different?

Thanks for answers!:)

[rjs_13203]

im running stock set up anyone got any suggestions on who to git rid of a on power push

[RogerM]

Which car ...... ZX5 or ZX5-SP??

[rjs_13203]

is a sp

[RogerM]

What sort of surface and what tires are in use front and rear?

[rjs_13203]

hard packed clay high traction, using inside jobs all around, no oneway. im starting to think im just goin to have to deal with it

[markwilliamson2001]

A one way will remove lots of power on understeer.... but can make the car twitchy on very bumpy high traction tracks, should be okay on clay though I would think.

Give it a try!

[niggs98]

either add the oneway as that will aid on power steering, try 10 degree blocks as on the standard zx5 they gave you less going in but more coming out or posibly try adding a degree or 2 of rear antisquat as this will make the car try and climb up itself under power so will give you more onpower steering. hth

nathan

[Benh]

Right then:eh?: - built and now fine tuning a few bits to RogerM's set up as a good starter for the weekend coming. (Our track - outdoor, grass, bumpy to very bumpy, jumps and high grip.)

Front
Q1 - I can't quite read location of ball stud on front Hub on the set up sheet posted. Is it toward the front or back?
Q2 - Axle height spacer - is this the location of the spacer itself, or the result of the location of the spacer (I hope that makes sense)

Rear
Q3 - Hub spacing. It states back. Do you put the spacers at the back - therefore Short wheel base, or is it the Hub at the back therefore Long Wheel base?

General
Q4 - I have followed everything, but the ride height is pretty high - i.e I have unwound the rear shock adjusters all the way and only now are the wishbones just showing level. On the Front the same and have the drives showing level (slightly smiley wishbones) I notice 3.75mm on the ride height for the front? Where's that measurment from and too?

Phew - that's it!:lol:

[Benh]

I took the recently upgraded ZX5SP for a spin yesterday.

Turning not as tight as I would like, but I think I have a solution for that.

Real problem was the corning stability. Taking it fairly easy, plenty of grip, but it kept going up onto 2 wheels. Push any harder, it was going to roll it's way back to the eighteenth century. The camber link is raised as high as it can go on the rear hubs, but anymore and it will rub on the inside of the wheel when drooping. Could put spacers in the rear shocks to limit the droop and then put more spacers than the existing 3mm on the rear hub, but don't really want to, as I hear that's not such a good thing.

Anyones thoughts on this would be great.

[SimonW]

have you tried cutting spikes off the outside of the front tyres, 1 row at a time, 2 rows max. You could try and get the car to roll more (raise inner ball stud or lower outer) so that you can see it going and have a chance to steer out of it, instead of it just leaping off the track with no warning. My final suggestion maybe to stiffen the rear springs so that the car doesn't just dump and roll. Post a set-up and myself or Roger can help (we need to know where you are to see where you could go)

[Benh]

have you tried cutting spikes off the outside of the front tyres, 1 row at a time, 2 rows max.

I took the 1st outer row on the fronts. Turning circle was pretty wide so I didn't dare take another row off. (Although on the S4 I have two rows off and it's superb now). I think I'll adjust the ball studs on the steering rack slightly as its just clipping the gear box. Once I have done that it should get a touch extra steering and I'll be happy to take another row off.


You could try and get the car to roll more (raise inner ball stud or lower outer) so that you can see it going and have a chance to steer out of it, instead of it just leaping off the track with no warning. My final suggestion maybe to stiffen the rear springs so that the car doesn't just dump and roll. Post a set-up and myself or Roger can help (we need to know where you are to see where you could go)

The set up was copied (as best I can - see last post;)) to RojerM's posted one. Oil, springs, shock type etc. Shock mounted positions are all the same. I did have a couple of queries, but your reply has just highlighted an obvious error on my part. I was raising the rear hub spacer - I need to lower it there and raise it the inside to let the car roll.:eh?:

I'll make the changes, take another row off the front tyres, give it another spin and I see what happens. On some areas of the track it was a totally different car - much improved and am looking forward to getting it tweaked.

Once that's done I'll post up a set up sheet and results.

Thank you:thumbsup:

[RogerM]

Ok ......

firstly the set up has moved on a little since then ..... still need to get it hosted but my PC at home, with the set-ups on, has had an OS failure and I need the time to get the data off the HDD before I re-instal .... will be weeks before I have the time!

I will try to write it in words later when I have a moment....

You need to take a fair amount of the material off the ball cups for the inner end of the track rods .... some people I know have gone to the Yokomo rose-joints as a solution but you don't need to ... just trim generously!!!

Once you have free movement of the rack trim the parts off the chassis the bell cranks touch right back to the thicker section.

Now you'll turn inside anything!!!

As Simon said, post up a set-up exactly (inc tires and track surface) and we'll try to help ..... can't say I'm short of steering!!!

[bigboots1302]

hello, i have just assembled my lazer zx-5 sp and i was wondering if there was any need to know information regarding the setup on this car. i was especially wondering about the front and rear toe in or out and what degrees either way would be the best for an all around race setup. also anything else would be much appreciated. also what would be a setup change that would help keep the back end of the car from sliding around. thank you very much.

boots.

[Benh]

Maybe one of the most drawn out sagas but.....

I am trying to eliminate the bump steer on the ZX5 SP - It's aweful.

Steering knuckle as standard (thought about switching them but looks like they'll knock into the wishbone?)

Spacer under the Hub Carrier. (Attempting to lower steering knuckle), slight change but not enough to write home about.

Really need to raise link on the steering rack - but obviously doesn't go any higher than it's higher of 2 settings.

Do you run your car with bump steer and live with it or am I missing something?:eh?:

[SUNA]

For the original ZX-5...are there specific part breakages that I should be concerned about ie) upgrade.

I just bought the 3Racing chassis and I was wondering if it would be worth while to upgrade to the carbon shock towers and center piece. Are there any aluminum upgrades that I should consider for added durability.

[Col]

I run alu tower mounts on mine, both as an original and an SP. Mine is quite an old car and the material is supposed to be much stronger now, so may not need doing. Other than that I've never broke anything that I've not broken on any other car. Seems to be as strong as most others

[dave p hall]

I run alu tower mounts on mine, both as an original and an SP. Mine is quite an old car and the material is supposed to be much stronger now, so may not need doing. Other than that I've never broke anything that I've not broken on any other car. Seems to be as strong as most others

yep:thumbsup:all the latest plastic part's are nice and strong:thumbsup:carbon part's aren't worth buying(in my experiance),stick with plastic;)

[rc_penguin]

Can someone please help!!
I have a kmc converted zx5, i run it on polished wodden floor at faversham. For ages i have had problems with the back end staying where i want it, my dad also has the same problem with the standard chassis. For example i will go into a corner but if i put to much power on the car will swap ends! But what i dont get is that i can hear the tyres squelling with grip. my current set up is pale yellow springs all round, 35wt in front 30wt in back, front shocks in middle hole, rear shocks in outer hole, 10 deg hubs and a15 block on rear. oh and i also run 13.5 brushless and a trakpower 4800 saddle pack with 100 grams of weight in the back.
cheers Will

[SimonW]

Try A30 in the rear that will help and put a two notch shim under the 'B' block, you could also move the bottom rear shock to the Middle hole and lenghten the rear camber link. All these will help with rear grip. HTH. almost forgot to say put the kit 70# silvers back on the front too.

SimonW

[rc_penguin]

cheers mate i will give it a go on wednesday and see what happens

[rc_penguin]

sorry this is proberbly a really stupid qeustion but what do you mean my the "B" block, do you mean the "BR" block :confused:

[niggs98]

B block from memory is the one in front of the rear gearbox that holds the other end of the hingepin on the rear. will possibly be popping up to faversham on wed night so will show you if you are not sure ;)

[caneye]

will the SP knuckle & hub LA254 fit on the original standard ZX5 or RTR kit without any modification? will it be a direct swop (without replacing arms nor CVDs)?

[RogerM]

will the SP knuckle & hub LA254 fit on the original standard ZX5 or RTR kit without any modification? will it be a direct swop (without replacing arms nor CVDs)?


No!!

[Fabs]

Maybe one of the most drawn out sagas but.....

I am trying to eliminate the bump steer on the ZX5 SP - It's aweful.

Steering knuckle as standard (thought about switching them but looks like they'll knock into the wishbone?)

Spacer under the Hub Carrier. (Attempting to lower steering knuckle), slight change but not enough to write home about.

Really need to raise link on the steering rack - but obviously doesn't go any higher than it's higher of 2 settings.

Do you run your car with bump steer and live with it or am I missing something?:eh?:


Might seem like a strange question, but what colour are your balls ?

On the SP you should be running the silver coloured balls on the knuckle, they are a different design that lowers the ball joint and reduces bump steer significantly.

[RogerM]

I have practically zero bump steer on my ZX5-SP ..... anybody who knows me will tell you I'm far to anal about such things to stand for any at all!!!

Sorry to say it but sounds like you have built the car wrong!

Post up a pic of the front end assembly please and we'll work out what is wrong.

[Benh]

I am just uploading some pics. But I have a strong suspicion that I am going to be made a fool of - publically!:lol:

5 mins and they'll be up;)

http://a7.vox.com/6a00e398f1628400050109d07c9d7f000e-pi

http://a4.vox.com/6a00e398f1628400050109d0fe3b7c000f-pi

http://a2.vox.com/6a00e398f162840005010980c97b22000b-pi



Thanks for the response guys. Looking forward, (nervously) to the response. :lol:

[dave-p]

is the rear shock tower the wrong side of the bulkhead?

[Benh]

How can you see the rear bulkhead from the pics:eh?:

Both ends are on the right way round.;)

[RogerM]

I will have a look when I have my car in front of me but from memory that all looks to be assembled correctly.

I have checked my car since your first post and there is a tiny fraction of bump steer but only in the parts of the travel where if your using that area bump steer is the least of your worries.......

How much droop are you running on the front, notice that you have your hubs low like me .......... I run the shock length a little shorter than stock IIRC

[Mogg]

:bored: Can any one tell me what set I shood do for astro and grass and what mods or parts i shood get for my zx-5sp kit I'v got coming as would like to get it set up right from the start but no I will have to tweak it a bit still for new tracks when I go to them and for my driving.:D

[RogerM]

:bored: Can any one tell me what set I shood do for astro and grass and what mods or parts i shood get for my zx-5sp kit I'v got coming as would like to get it set up right from the start but no I will have to tweak it a bit still for new tracks when I go to them and for my driving.:D

http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii250/Roger_Mills/RogM_Kiddy_Feb08.jpg

That will get you going, only a few changes from then .....

Main change is that I am now using the middle camber link position on the bulkhead both front and rear ends.

Often run 10 degree castor blocks on the front too.

Run it like that for a bit then let me know what you would prefer it to do handling wise if it's not perfect for you and I'll tell you how to change the set-up to suit.

I have a personal preference which means most of the time I run #70 silver springs on the front which have had 1.5 coils cut off.

Ride heights quoted as the gap between the top of the upper spring platform and the shock cap.

For carpet I run a very similar set-up but .....

Lime green springs (#75) all round, in outer holes on the wishbones and a 1.2mm rear anti-roll bar ... no other changes.

The ZX5-SP is a VERY easy car to drive, this set-up will give you loads of steering without making the car feel too twichy.

[Mogg]

:D Thanks for that mate I'll let you no how I get on. But can I by a spring set with all the spings so I can try different ones?:bored: As can only see one pear at a time for sale.

[RogerM]

Kyosho only sell springs in pairs.

Trust me, all you will need is



silver #70s (ZX5 kit springs), two pairs of fronts if you want to try the cutting...

lime green #75s front and rear

#68 and #72 rears.

You will need nothing else on grass or astro!

[JCJC]

Roger is right again, we mostly ran kit silver (there may be another silver-stronger spring), its tyres that you will mostly have to get used to and adjust for grass & astro, wet/damp/dry/short/long/grippy/whatever. ask around where you are racing.

[Fabs]

well looks like I found a good setup for the FS on carpet, it will be posted on Petit RC as soon as Arn0 will be back I'm sure. Car was fantastic everywhere on the track and produced laptimes which I thought were way beyond what I thought I could get.

[dibble34]

Hi All

Not sure there is simple answer to this but here goes....

I race outdoors on a pretty bumpy astroturf track .I have a standard ZX5, and am pretty happy with the setup, apart from the following.

I suffer from understear on initial turn in and off power, especially if the track is damp It feels like i have to wait too long when cornering before i can apply power. If i put really grippy tyres on it just spins round as i then have too much grip coming out of corners. Not sure i really know what i am talking about but if feel like i aM lacking mechanical front end grip when off power. I have 30 oil front and back, yellow springs at the back and orange at the front.

Any suggestions?

Thanks in advance,

Dave

[Neil Skull]

Hi Dave,

Are you running front diff or one way? or maybe center one way?

[dibble34]

Hi Neil, normal 4wd if that makes sense, same setup front and rear.

[SimonW]

Run the centre shaft 1-way with a tight front diff, that should cure it.

[Neil Skull]

As Simon says :)

[dibble34]

Thanks Guys, i am not sure i have the centre shaft one way. Could you give me anymore info on it/ Would i then just run the normal diff in the front? Sorry this is all new to me :confused:

[dibble34]

Thanks Guys, i am not sure i have the centre shaft one way. Could you give me anymore info on it/ Would i then just run the normal diff in the front? Sorry this is all new to me :confused:
It's ok i think i have cracked it :)

[c0sie]

Anyone have a decent indoor carpet setup that I can use on the wifes RTR?

Would like to give her a fighting chance to whoop my arse on the track if I can :)

[Nellybobs]

As per cOsie above but for an SP...iv been tryin for a few weeks now but just cant get it right...:confused:

i run at Macctrack, its a tight twisty small track so speed is not really an issue...any ideas

Cheers...

Paul..

[RogerM]

Nelly, I'll try and give you an SP set-up later for carpet.

[Nellybobs]

At the moment im running as follows:

FRONT
Springs.............Silver (kit)
Oil....................30w
Shock pos..........middle top, middle arm
Castor blocks.....10 degree
Camber link........inner pos. on both ends
Camber.............1 degree negative
Toe..................1 degree out
Arms................. just below level

REAR
Springs.............Silver (kit)
Oil....................25w
Shock pos..........middle top, inner arm
Camber link........inner pos. at both ends
Sus holder.........A25

19T reedy brushed motor
Schumacher mini pins all round with blue inserts (slightly worn)

The problem i have is both understeer and oversteer!!....:confused::confused:
let me explain...using this setup i get poor high speed turn in and poor turn in on full lock at medium speed, i then changed the oil in the rear to 35w and put the shock mounts to outer, top and bottom! this now gives me oversteer at the end of the straight and it seems to 'hook' at tight corners.. I have tried a lot of different combinations but this is about the best iv found

Now i am no great driver but it is hard to develop your skill when the car is not setup right, Iv had my Lazer from December and think its a crackin car! half the joy of racing it for me is learning the setup....i think i just need a little help...:blush:

Thanks Roger...

Paul..:thumbsup:

[SimonW]

Try running your rear/lower shock position on the out side with blue 68# springs, that should make it more stable and stop the hooking in and give you more exit steering too.

HTH SimonW

[Col]

At the moment im running as follows:

FRONT
Springs.............Silver (kit) Silver
Oil....................30w
Shock pos..........middle top, middle arm schu 35w
Castor blocks.....10 degree 10 degree
Camber link........inner pos. on both ends outer (closest to wheel) on inside, inner (closest to car) on outside
Camber.............1 degree negative 1 degree
Toe..................1 degree out 0
Arms................. just below level level with cells in

REAR
Springs.............Silver (kit) silver
Oil....................25w schu 35w
Shock pos..........middle top, inner arm middle top, inner arm
Camber link........inner pos. at both ends middle on car, inner on hubs
Sus holder.........A25 A25

Schumacher mini pins all round with blue inserts (slightly worn)

I also run with TP4900 lipo with a foam ( from a B4) at the front of the lipo to move the lipo back. The car is a little twitchy and still tends to try to throw the rear out on high grip high speed, but other than that it's fairly planted

[Fabs]

I know we're running a different car to you but Woody and I have found that cutting the rear wing's gurney right down helps a lot with high speed steering.

[RogerM]

All this from memory as the car isn't here to look at but here goes ....


At the moment im running as follows:

FRONT
Springs.............Silver (kit) #75 lime green
Oil....................30w 35wt AE (maybe try 40wt)
Shock pos..........middle top, middle arm outer on arm
Castor blocks.....10 degree
Camber link........inner pos. on both ends inner - king pin ball (from original ZX5), stud 0mm washers both ends ... if you can't do that then outer holeon hub, 3mm under outer ballstud
Camber.............1 degree negative -1.5deg
Toe..................1 degree out 0deg (toe out will make the car twitchy)
Arms................. just below level

REAR
Springs.............Silver (kit) #75 lime green
Oil....................25w 30wt AE (maybe try 35wt)
Shock pos..........middle top, inner arm mid top arm outer on arm
Camber link........inner pos. at both ends outer both ends (3mm under outer ball stud)
Sus holder.........A25
short wheel base
Rear roll bar 1.2mm (kit)
ride height so rear slightly higher than front at rest

NOTE:- SET-UP FOR NiMhs AS I'VE NOT USED LIPOs

Also might be worth trying outer rows off the tires as this will allow the car to slide more rather than digging in and rolling.

19T reedy brushed motor
Schumacher mini pins all round with blue inserts (slightly worn)

The problem i have is both understeer and oversteer!!....:confused::confused:
let me explain...using this setup i get poor high speed turn in and poor turn in on full lock at medium speed, i then changed the oil in the rear to 35w and put the shock mounts to outer, top and bottom! this now gives me oversteer at the end of the straight and it seems to 'hook' at tight corners.. I have tried a lot of different combinations but this is about the best iv found

Now i am no great driver but it is hard to develop your skill when the car is not setup right, Iv had my Lazer from December and think its a crackin car! half the joy of racing it for me is learning the setup....i think i just need a little help...:blush:

Thanks Roger...

Paul..:thumbsup:

[Nellybobs]

Thanks a lot guys, ill give both setups a blast later in the week...ill post back my findings when i can....

Cheers...

Paul...:thumbsup:

[dibble34]

Hey alll

Been tinkering with my standard ZX5 and thanks to all the help on this forum i pretty much have it sorted:D. One final question and i may just be being picky! From a stand still under heavy acceleration it pulls right. If i pull away gently it is fine and straight or if i am moving at a reasonable pace and floor it, it is fine too. Just the initial race start kind if setup it pulls right. Any ideas?

Thanks in advance

Dave O

[jono83]

did you notice this on carpet?

[dibble34]

No on tarmac, i usually race on astroturf but haven't taken it there yet

[jono83]

ah ok then nevermnd then lol

[madmax]

nelly ill be at macc on tues with my sp. you can have a look at my set up, i find it realy nice and nutral to drive, and allows you to push the car hard.

[Paulstar]

losi red springs rear
losi blue front
35 rear oil
40 front
basic kit geometry

Is there anywhere on the net I can get hold of these shocks?

Cheers Guys

[RogerM]

Paulstar, before you go down the Losi spring route lets try and get you some where close to the right sort of set-up using Kysoho parts, that way you'll be much more able to compare your set-ups with the rest of us.

So here are the questions we need answered

1) Which version of the car do you have?
2) What track surface(s) are you running on mainly?
3) How many jumps and how big?
4) Do you like understeer, oversteer or neutral handling?
5) What other equipment are you using (particularly motor and battery types)?
6) How experienced a driver are you?

If you can answer all those we should be able to point you in the right direction, the last couple of % can only come from your own fine tuning but we should be able to advise if you word your questions something like "I require more corner exit steering" or similar.

Look forward to trying to help.

[Paulstar]

Paulstar, before you go down the Losi spring route lets try and get you some where close to the right sort of set-up using Kysoho parts, that way you'll be much more able to compare your set-ups with the rest of us.

So here are the questions we need answered

1) Which version of the car do you have?
2) What track surface(s) are you running on mainly?
3) How many jumps and how big?
4) Do you like understeer, oversteer or neutral handling?
5) What other equipment are you using (particularly motor and battery types)?
6) How experienced a driver are you?

If you can answer all those we should be able to point you in the right direction, the last couple of % can only come from your own fine tuning but we should be able to advise if you word your questions something like "I require more corner exit steering" or similar.

Look forward to trying to help.

First of all can i say thanks. Its like having my own pits crew lol

ok here we go

-I have the KMC version of the kit.
-The surface is now going to be short grass, with dusty patches
-They have built a new track so not sure on how many just. But I know there is a large table top there. (I'll get more info)
-At the moment I have cell saddle packs. and i'm running a 19 turn motor
-I used to race a lot. Back in the days of the B2. I'm just getting back into the sport and i'll be looking to race at least once a month. Spare time being the major factor.
-Neutral steer I would prefer. But being a big lover of MK2 escorts I like oversteer lol. If you can make my car handle like that i'll pay you. (hehe)

Cheers

[RogerM]

Unfortuantely I can't comment further now but I will.

Most imprtantly loose the KMC chassis .... it doesn't work, not at all IMHO. I know a few people who've tried it and all have gone slower than on the stock layout. Weight is in the wrong place, it's too stiff and makes the car much harder to drive!

[Paulstar]

ok. Anyone got a stock chassis for sale??

[dibble34]

Hi All

Have a question about tyres, i race outside on astroturf and when it is dry the grip is very good. To the point i have been using nearly bald green mini spikes all round to avoid grip roll, however i feel like i loose out on a bit of performance as it stuggles to put the power down in a straight line. If i put new tyres on, it grip roles quite badly. Any suggestions?

Thanks

Dave

[RogerM]

dibble, post your set-up on here.

Depending on the type of astro used it'll be either Balistic Buggy green mini spikes or Schumacher Yellow minispikes (sometimes Green but I normally prefer the BB greens in those conditions).

If you show us your set-up and describe the handling problem in a little bit of detail (fast / slow corners worse etc.) I'll do my best to help.

Also what version of the car do you have? I always found the ZX5-SP to be wonderful on astro and the current ZX5-FS looks like being even better!

[dibble34]

Hi Roger

I have the following

Standard zx5 with losi 4.5 brushless
NIMH
Centre one way
Orange front springs (55 i think)
Light Yellow rear springs (65 i think)
30 wt oil front and back

Front

Shocks connected to outside whole at the top and inside at the bottom
7 degree hubs

Rear

Shocks connected to Middle at top and inside at bottom

It seems worse at change of direction at slow/medium speed

I can get schumacher tryes a bit cheaper so would like to stick with that brand if possible

I have tried new rears and worn fronts which is better, but still rolling a bit

Thanks in advance

Dave

[Fabs]

I'm no standard ZX5 specialist but I'd say right away you're running your front end way too soft. I'd try the kit silver springs on the front and the middle hole on the wishbones to start with.

[dibble34]

Hi i have another (backup) ZX5 with silver springs and it bounces quite badly as the track is quite bumpy. Do you still think i should try it?

[Fabs]

Well I just had a look for a setup for you,

Have a look at this setup:

http://www.petitrc.com/setup/kyosho/setupzx5/ZX5_Nathan_Stotford20060115.htm

[dibble34]

Thanks, i note they cut the outside row off the rear tyres too. Worth a go i reckon, can't see what kind if track this is for though

[Fabs]

It's an astroturf setup.

[Col]

I have the following

Standard zx5 with losi 4.5 brushless

There is your problem...

[RogerM]

Softest spring I have ever run on the front of a ZX5 is a #65 yellow with 1.5 coils cut off!!!

My stock set-ups are always on #70 silvers. I'll have aproper look at your setup but I agree with Fab, far too soft!!!

I'll try to get back to you tomorrow but I never ran the stock car so will be asking around ..... niggs98 on here is the man to ask about the earlier car.

[dibble34]

Thanks Roger, look forward to hearing from you. I think i am at the stage now where my driving is good enough for the setup to mate a difference:). Will be sad to see the orange springs go as i love the way it leans into corners;)

[jaank]

Please setup for carpet.
Only 2 jumps at the track and thats all.
And i have SP

[petemid8]

This is a carpet setup:thumbsup:

http://www.petitrc.com/setup/kyosho/setupzx5/Lazer_ZX-5_Heligoin_LeHavre.pdf

[jaank]

Any carpet setup more?
I dont have asso pistons.

[jaank]

Now bought myself a FS conversion and need a setup.
It's carpet/slash ash 50/50.
Lot's of jumps, but not very bumpy.

EDIT: And lipos all day long.

[jaank]

Okey, lets try once more.

Half a carpet, half a somekinda ash.
LowToMid grip.
Lots of jumps but not very bumpy (in the morning :D)
Only lipos so light weight.

[Neil Skull]

Hi,

Im not a team driver but i can tell you.

As per kit but:-
Go up to 400wt shock oil.
Stiffer anti roll bar I use the copper one on rear.
lay the shocks down one hole from the kit.

Oh and try both of the hubs you get in the kit the ones you have spare make the car a little easier to drive but at the expense of turn in.

try That and let us know!!

[RogerM]

Do you have an e-mail address at all? I'll send you a couple of set-ups to try for the FS, these days I have the car so nice that I barely change a thing track to track or surface to surface!

One thing though, put some weight back in ... at least 60g down the spine between the batteries as that will help calm the car over the bumps and balance a bit on long jumps.

[jaank]

Sent you a pm.
Thanks dude.

[billybou]

Hi,
Is somebody know why in a recent french race many ZX5 FS competitors didn't have the rear shocks infront of the rear tower ? :confused:
http://www.petitrc.com/_forumphp/showthread.php?t=37234&page=8
thanks.

[Gayo]

Hi, I made that race with a FS.

the best french FS driver (Héligoin) setup the car this way, so most of FS owners (including me :D) took that route.

I don't have tried yet the FS with the shocks on the usual side (it was my first race with it) but I used that trick several times on my B44. Having the shocks behind the rear wheels really helps with handling on rough tracks. The rear stays planted on ruts and slippy parts, to the point that the car can become a bit understeery. Try it, it really works.

[billybou]

Thanks for this answer. Perhaps, I saw you because, even if I did not participate, i saw some runs. I'll try this setup when i'll drive in such conditions.

[touringdriver]

test

[MikeT2]

Just out of interest, has anyone ever *needed* to change the steering servo from stock on the ZX-5 as I bought one the other day and it sometimes struggles to go from full left lock to full right and ends up just going in a straight line?

The only thing I can think thats causing this is that the servo is a bit on the weak side and can't turn that quickly/much?

[RogerM]

right guys, I need a starting point for the FS2 on carpet as I am getting more and more lost .... not something I am used to.

I am finding that;

1) as soon as I lift off the power the rear end wants to rotate ... not a little to the point I am going through the middle of most corners on opposite lock.
2) it is killing rear tires like they are going out of fashion.

Now I know there are quite a few of you folks who run this chassis on carpet and I really, really wasn't expecting it to be hugely different to the FS so I am lost as I say.

Anybody else find this or is it something strange in my chassis?

I've tried decreasing anti-squat and toe in, running a little extra camber and running the longest possible camber link (also tried the low height inner ball stud and 3mm under the outer end) ... nothing seems to be taming the rear of the car .... an anti roll bar turns it into a spinning top!
Right now the Scorpion is MUCH quicker around a given lap than the FS2 and the RB5 is also quicker (although not as much so as Scorpion). I think that I have lost something like 1s a lap in the FS2 rear end. Very very confused!

Damping range has been from 3b 30 down to 20 and 3a 35 down to 20. Tried 3x1.3 and 3x1.4 pistons in similar oil ranges too and the big bores! Springs from my usual #68 blue to #60 dark yellow and all in between.

Just to make sure that it wasn't a tweaked chassis I put the original FS rear end back on ... back to it's normal predictable and stable self!!!

Any help appreciated .... at the moment I am considering the most likely cause is that I am just too old to drive such a lively car and it's me not the FS2 at fault but before I get out the walking stick I am hoping somebody can pin point it for me! I know Nick Caro says he is "always on it" with his FS2 but I'm more of a lift and coast driver than a power-brake-power driver ... as I say, maybe that is the problem!

[njc11]

Roger.. You have an email mate..which may help ;)

As for your issues with the car mate... i know you say the car is fine with FS rear end on... but have you checked your diffs and slipper setting??

If this aint right, it can be as you describe... if you remember i went through all this with mine.

Have you tried the different shims under Law36 and Law37?? Ride height makes a big difference also...

On mine with standard velvets i was 40wt 3b front and either 25wt 3B or 30wt 3A rear..

FS to FS2 to me just makes the rear end rotate much easier and in doing so makes the car much more nimble...

Yesterday at Broxtowe running Big Bores Front 45wt Yellow Spring, inside hole tower, middle wishbone.. Rear 35wt white spring, middle tower,inside wishbone.. ride height 21mm approx all round, long wheelbase, shortest link on the ally 0deg hubs.. inside link on tower, LAW40 chassis stiffner.. The car felt better than ever... effortlessly turning on the tight and twisty track, with out the need of having to use abit of handbrake etc..

As youve not run much 4wd recently, it maybe that you just need more time behind the wheel mate!

:thumbsup:

[Fabs]

Hey rog, i know exactly what you're saying, I've had this issue with the fs until I made my ally chassis. Was a good 1s per lap slower than with the rb5. Now I've switched to a proper handling 4wd I'm 1s a lap faster than 2wd...

[mattb]

roger have you tried making some changes to the front of the car,id shorten the rear links again as when you use long links on the rear,the rear rolls way to much and lifts the inside front wheel in corners and it becomes a bit unpredictable.Id try maybe washers under the inside ball stud on the camber link to reduce turn in and maybe 75 rate front springs,this minght suit you and stop whiping the rear end round and get a bit of understeer back for you.also you could try putting your front shocks out at the botton,hope this helps matt

[discostu]

right guys, I need a starting point for the FS2 on carpet as I am getting more and more lost .... not something I am used to.

I am finding that;

1) as soon as I lift off the power the rear end wants to rotate ... not a little to the point I am going through the middle of most corners on opposite lock.
2) it is killing rear tires like they are going out of fashion.

Now I know there are quite a few of you folks who run this chassis on carpet and I really, really wasn't expecting it to be hugely different to the FS so I am lost as I say.

Anybody else find this or is it something strange in my chassis?

I've tried decreasing anti-squat and toe in, running a little extra camber and running the longest possible camber link (also tried the low height inner ball stud and 3mm under the outer end) ... nothing seems to be taming the rear of the car .... an anti roll bar turns it into a spinning top!
Right now the Scorpion is MUCH quicker around a given lap than the FS2 and the RB5 is also quicker (although not as much so as Scorpion). I think that I have lost something like 1s a lap in the FS2 rear end. Very very confused!

Damping range has been from 3b 30 down to 20 and 3a 35 down to 20. Tried 3x1.3 and 3x1.4 pistons in similar oil ranges too and the big bores! Springs from my usual #68 blue to #60 dark yellow and all in between.

Just to make sure that it wasn't a tweaked chassis I put the original FS rear end back on ... back to it's normal predictable and stable self!!!

Any help appreciated .... at the moment I am considering the most likely cause is that I am just too old to drive such a lively car and it's me not the FS2 at fault but before I get out the walking stick I am hoping somebody can pin point it for me! I know Nick Caro says he is "always on it" with his FS2 but I'm more of a lift and coast driver than a power-brake-power driver ... as I say, maybe that is the problem!

im confusaed when is it breaking away into a compleate off power corner hairpin etc or when lifting round sweepers.

[RogerM]

Cheers guys for the suggestions but saddly they have all been covered :(

Nick, you saw the diffs at Broxtowe, they are like silk mate and the slipper is letting go when it needs to. I am running the LAW36 on the chassis and currently having to run just about zero antisquat to be able to drive the thing at all (makes me nervious as to what it would be like if th heavens opened).

Matt, I'd like to run a shorter rear link to get more square up but none of that matters if the car is facing the wrong way .... it is litterally that bad! I am running a #75 front spring on carpet anyway ... always have. Currently 2mm under front inner ball to help calm it and all the other front end settings are subdued too.

It is definitely the rear as even when just coasting through a corner the rear is breaking away ... in fact that is when it is worst. Also the fact it is killing rear tires tells me it's not working them well at all, the fronts are lasting as long as ever.

I am trying to use the roll to generate some grip from the rear, yes that is a big compromise but it is all I had left to try!

I think I am building the answer I need here .... those of you guys who are happy with the car are very happy ... those who aren't are struggling a lot. I REALLY liked the FS, always suited me I though but I think the FS2 might be a step too far for those of us who like a planted car (that said I've just thought about droppign some extra weight under the cells .... cogs are turning).
I'm going to start playing tunes with the rear end combinations to see what I can achieve as and when I get chance, wrong time to be working away for 3 weeks hey :(

[RogerM]

im confusaed when is it breaking away into a compleate off power corner hairpin etc or when lifting round sweepers.

Everywhere ... it is like somebody has sanded all the spikes off the tires ... which is what the result is from running like that .. lol

Notice it most when coasting through a section of the corner, the more it shrugs of speed the worse it gets.

I've never come across anything like it in 25 years of racing 4wd buggies!

[markwilliamson2001]

I guess the FS2 is designed more for those low and mid grip tracks, and super smooth clay like they have in Japan and the states, where a little more rotation is required. The friont end just does not have enough traction to 'pull' the car around the corners like we have in this country from high grip carpet, AND pins. The minispikes will slow down reaction and response of the front end on carpet, so should help your situation Rog. Or just stick with the FS! :lol:

[mattb]

roger im running no weight at all and the chassis stiffener i suggested this to nick after trying it and he loves it to,how much weight are you useing maybe to much and youd get the pendulum effect so the rears trying to over take the front?

[carlin]

Roger i would try putting bit more weight over the rear. I have been suffering from tire wear on the rear loads but the car is flying at the moment though handling wise very happy with the car.

I was running 85g on the rear i have just put 60g in the rear to see the difference hope it wont destroy my setup to much as i have always been pretty close to setup as to Nic most tracks. But i have always been carrying little more weight not just in the car too lol :p

[RogerM]

I am running 60g in the spine and the shocks on the rear of the tower, tried moving them to the front of the tower as I thought it might be a pendulum effect but this actually made the car worse still ... so much so I pulled it off after 3mins as it wasn't going to finish the run in one piece!

In the summer I was running the FS rear end most of the rear and 65-70g under each LiPo too. Actually when it got slippery I prefered the narrower still SP width rear .... I think this is all pointing to one thing sadly. The more I think about it the more I suspect I will end up with the FS2 rear back in the box.

God only knows how you guys run it with a rear ARB!

[discostu]

Everywhere ... it is like somebody has sanded all the spikes off the tires ... which is what the result is from running like that .. lol

Notice it most when coasting through a section of the corner, the more it shrugs of speed the worse it gets.

I've never come across anything like it in 25 years of racing 4wd buggies!

that sounds like a front end issue to me if i was having that problem and the car wanted gto turn arse about face of power the first thing i would do is soften the front shock oil and spring and lay down the front shock position to make the front end more progrssive. im sure you would have tried this.

it seems to me to be the front generating way to much front taction than is nessary.

stu

[discostu]

I am running 60g in the spine and the shocks on the rear of the tower, tried moving them to the front of the tower as I thought it might be a pendulum effect but this actually made the car worse still ... so much so I pulled it off after 3mins as it wasn't going to finish the run in one piece!

In the summer I was running the FS rear end most of the rear and 65-70g under each LiPo too. Actually when it got slippery I prefered the narrower still SP width rear .... I think this is all pointing to one thing sadly. The more I think about it the more I suspect I will end up with the FS2 rear back in the box.

God only knows how you guys run it with a rear ARB!

you have pretty much confirmed my last post by saying it gets worse when you move the shocks back to the front of the tower.

in my veiw sticking more weight in is not the way forward i agree a heavier car with todays power can feel more settled but i feel to much weight can make a detremental effect to handling and it seems to get over looked.

i run 60g between my batts but i would never put any more in that area.

stu

[mattb]

that sounds like a front end issue to me if i was having that problem and the car wanted gto turn arse about face of power the first thing i would do is soften the front shock oil and spring and lay down the front shock position to make the front end more progrssive. im sure you would have tried this.

it seems to me to be the front generating way to much front taction than is nessary.

stuthats what i think mate,roger try no weight and the stiffener next mate.its got to be one of the two mate especcialy as you say its breaking away of power

[RogerM]

that sounds like a front end issue to me if i was having that problem and the car wanted gto turn arse about face of power the first thing i would do is soften the front shock oil and spring and lay down the front shock position to make the front end more progrssive. im sure you would have tried this.

it seems to me to be the front generating way to much front taction than is nessary.

stu

Yes mate, front end over one hole inside more than the stock tower, oils reduced to match.

Tried 4 rows off the fronts too just to be sure (and worn tires for that matter).

Fairly sure it's not initial / front end based but not 100%

[discostu]

you are having an intresting problem rog its odd though how the fs2 rear end seems to be the issue i must admit im not the best person to ask about the fs2 or fs rear end as my kyosho doesn't run either what may be best put the fs rear end back on get the car as you like it and maybe step out the box with setup as a lot of drivers i know only tend to go down the same route once you have done that go back to the fs2 rear and see how it feels.

stu

[njc11]

Reading through all this again, i would too suggest its the front end thats the issue..

Especially if its hooking round lifting off into a corner....

Try different pistons, the spacers to alter kickup... ( on high grip carpet i take them all out..) remove any spacers of the ackermann..

Also on the slipper... are you using the same colour pad front and rear???

At Broxtowe on sunday, i could come round the corner at the end of the straight by just lifting slightly then back on the power once round it... if i gave it too much (trying to line up for the next corner..) i could opposite lock it and drift it totally controllably to square it up.. its never like what you describe...

Infact when i drove your car at the Xmas Cracker briefly.. the car seemed ok... then only thing i didnt like was the whole feel of the transmitter, just felt extremely " slow " in response..

YOu got my email.... i sent to the googlemail work one you set up when you finished for xmas..

:thumbsup:

[MikePimlott]

All these problems! makes me want a FS2 to see what all the fuss is about :lol:

[mattb]

the only problem i had sunday was some c**t taking up my table!!! lol but thanks for the wheel nuts mate

[RogerM]

Mike, I am certainly not saying I think there is anything wrong with the car as there are many people who have picked it up and are flying with it.
I loved the FS, great car in my opinion.

I am just asking those who have run an FS2 longer than me to help me solve an issue which might very well be more down to how I like to drive than the car.

[discostu]

no problem mike the fs is only for the fast drivers lol

stu

[RogerM]

Sorry Nick, no mail from you .. please send it to my work address as I'll be there tomorrow. Cheers

[RogerM]

no problem mike the fs is only for the fast drivers lol

stu

Stu mate I think you may have hit the nail on the head there .... I am afterall going grey now :p

[MikePimlott]

the only problem i had sunday was some c**t taking up my table!!! lol but thanks for the wheel nuts mate

No Worrie's mate and thanks for letting me charge on your table. Though you really didnt like the slippy floor :lol:

Mike, I am certainly not saying I think there is anything wrong with the car as there are many people who have picked it up and are flying with it.
I loved the FS, great car in my opinion.

I am just asking those who have run an FS2 longer than me to help me solve an issue which might very well be more down to how I like to drive than the car.

I was'nt saying there was a problem with the car, mearly suggesting that i get one and have a play (NO not had one of these yet) :woot:
no problem mike the fs is only for the fat drivers lol

stu

I'll fit right in with you all :thumbsup:

[Gayo]

Roger, are you sure everything is working OK on your FS2 parts? I know you are a veteran racer (so I am :blush:) but I didn't find such a handling difference going from the FS to the FS2. Your problem sounds as something is binding, bent, or broken. A stiff CV joint, a gritty bearing or a bent axle can look OK when checked by hand a make a mess of the handling on track.

[RogerM]

Reading through all this again, i would too suggest its the front end thats the issue..

Especially if its hooking round lifting off into a corner....

I first thought that if you remember, why I attacked my front tires so savagely ... 2 rows off inner and 2 off outer ... then every other off what was then the outer before the final. I am running 2 rows of pins on the fronts now .. lol
It doesn't feel like a "hook" from the front, it's mid to late corner and I can almost see the rear coming around and the front, if anything, was pushing slightly as I normally like it. It might be a hook but it really doesn't have that feel about it.

Try different pistons, the spacers to alter kickup... ( on high grip carpet i take them all out..) remove any spacers of the ackermann..

I went to 2C pistons, never run any spacers between gearbox and front hingepin mount on high grip, actually no ackerman spacers and the low height balls in there too. Not sure if there is much left to do with the front end.

Also on the slipper... are you using the same colour pad front and rear???

Yes mate, whites both sides, new 1 meeting before the broxtowe cracker meeting.


Infact when i drove your car at the Xmas Cracker briefly.. the car seemed ok... then only thing i didnt like was the whole feel of the transmitter, just felt extremely " slow " in response..

Please explain as I am not sure I understand what you mean there. It's the same handset and spektrum modual as you run, all the curves / exps / rates etc. are set to neutral as I prefer a linear feel to the throttle / steering. Not sure if it's relevant but I'll try anything that might help me understand this issue as I know I can make the car nice again by going to the previous rear end but its the not understanding the problem that is driving me mad!!!

[RogerM]

Roger, are you sure everything is working OK on your FS2 parts? I know you are a veteran racer (so I am :blush:) but I didn't find such a handling difference going from the FS to the FS2. Your problem sounds as something is binding, bent, or broken. A stiff CV joint, a gritty bearing or a bent axle can look OK when checked by hand a make a mess of the handling on track.

Everything moves freely and falls under it's own weight. New bearings fitted when I fitted the new axles, about 15 runs old now but new for the meeting where Nick drove the car and not a mark on them.
I gave the car a really good look over when I got it home hoping to find something like the above but it all looked fine.

[Fabs]

Get a blue car, lol. Gayo can vouch for the change of speed from the moment i switched back to the belt car :thumbsup:

[RogerM]

I'm not ready to move from under the big red K just yet mate. Tamiya seems to suit you well though.

[Fabs]

I know I'm just winding you up... This just sounds like my old ZX5 when I ran it with the plastic chassis, I could never get the rear end to stick...

[RogerM]

I know I'm just winding you up...

I know :lol:

I think I am understanding this a bit better now ... amazing what a CAD model and some e-mail chat can do to get the old grey matter working.

I will try a few things over the next few weeks and hopefully will be able to report back a positive message very soon.

[SimonW]

I know this is gonna sound wierd but, try #60 springs in the front and #72's on the rear.
Mount the shocks, Front top in- bottom out and rear top middle - bottom inside. As for oils and stuff 40wt 3B front and 30wt drilled#55 rear. It sounds to me like you have too much pressure on the front tyres off power and instead of the front diving and transferring weight forward you are getting the rear lifting as the front is held up eg: front too stiff or rear too soft, hope that sounds right- visualise mid corner ride hieght. Is your car a nightmare to keep the front down on jumps?

[fastinfastout]

I know you said everything mechanically is fine, I had a problem just like yours on a different car. I traced it back to the rear axles shimmed too well!

With no wheels on, the car was freewheeling well. With wheels on and nuts done up tight, the car was essentially apply drag brake and causing the over rotation.

These days, and I do this to all cars now even if it can become time consuming. Remove the pinion, wheels ON and TIGHTENED, and see if there is any binding.

anyway, just a solution to a problem which may help some one out there if not yourself.

[mattb]

roger,in another thread you mentioned youd taken all the kickup spacers out of the front AND machined the gear box to so you must have about 14 degrees of caster if your using the 10 blocks this would give you more mid corner and exit steering,you could try reducing that to mate.

[Al3xis007]

no it would be 10deg caster with monster kick up, similar but not 100%the same effect.
not sure why u would want to do this but hey

[RogerM]

Thanks for all the replies.

Transmission spins super free. When you calculate wheel rates the spring set up I am using is softer than yours Simon, damping will be a fraction stiffer and pack quicker though.

I think I have traced the problem though now.

It's a combination of diff freshness balance (front is much looser than built, obviously I didn't bed it in well enough) and my driving style.

I think the FS2 simply has too much natural rotation for my style. What Kyosho have done is build a car that rotates very freely and changes direction super fast. That is not what suits my style so the fix is simple, either I work on generating less natural rotation from the FS2 via some geometry tweaks or just put it back to FS spec.

Seems that in building the car the majority of its customers want they have exposed the weakness in this old man ;)

Just as well the FS is still available, I might have to buy two :D

[fastinfastout]

they prob built the car around what tebo wanted, and no one can currently wheel a kyosho like he can

[RogerM]

They seem to have built the car that the major market sectors have asked for.

The major strength of the Kyosho brand is the continued development and updates. By using combinations if components you can get whatever balance you prefer from locked down to free rotation.


Just glad I've worked out what I'd done wrong.

[rcpower]

Hi guys,

can one provide me a good starting point for a FS on a medium bite, rough clay track? I will be running proline caliber tyres(control), orion 45c lipos with a orion 7.5(or 6.5 if needed) motor. The track is rather tight and technical.

I also like to know if the pinned slipper is a good possibility in this case?

Another concern is weight: currently I have 38gr under each lipo, is that any good?
Or can I better put it in the spline of the car? or perhaps do both?

thanks in advance.

[z00m]

Can you advise where you are at with the LAW36/37 toe block inserts?

I run outdoors on a clay track. When the track grips up (nothing like carpet of course!!), I can run A RF and E RR inserts for 2.5 degree toe in and the rotation is affected a lot. I usually have to dial out a little steering on the transmitter.

When the track goes away (like after it rains all the sand comes to the top), I run the B and F inserts for 3 degrees and the rear is more much more locked in.

Like you I have also noticed how sensitive the car is to the balance of the diffs. I often use this as a tuning aid when I want a little more or less steering.

[RogerM]

sorry guys ... don't seem to be able to paste in from Excel anymore as the formatting goes hay-wire ... :(

[werner1619]

I had the same rear end problem once, after lots of looking, I found that the weight I placed in the rear had come a bit loose. So, on coasting and turning, the weight would rub against the drive shaft into the gearbox.

Also, check how far the cvd dives into outdrive when suspension compresses. If it dives to deep on the outside wheel, it will lock up.

Hope it helps :-)

[Windy]

Guys,

I got my ZX5 with the e speed mod on the steering and wondered what it actually did. So i asked Tony Evdoka. Gave a simple answer for me, hope it helps other people.

With the mod it makes the outer wheel turn in more, ie more lock, thus you have a smaller turning circle ideal in a tight indoor track.

Many thanks to Tony for the advice.

Hope i understood that right

[fastinfastout]

yes I have also noticed the kyosho has the biggest turning circle of all the 4wd's I've had.

[ju']

hello, which insert you use in schum mini spike yellow on grass track ? I can not find a set up sheet on this surface.
thanks

[RogerM]

I normally use the same inserts as I would for astroturf ... in my case that is MrO medium compund wide inserts both ends

[h0m3sy]

Can anyone point me in the direction of a decent carpet set up for the Lazer ZX5 rtr?

Thanks
David

[dancr125]

Gearing for fs2 7.5t 6.5t astro track

[paul78]

Hi would any one have a set up for zx -5fs2 sp @maritime track