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Elliott Hopkins
27-09-2007, 04:29 PM
A recent interview has drawn to my attention my lack of CAD experience.

What is the industry standard program? What is the cheapest and easiest way to learn it?

Thanks.

Elliott.

Stu
27-09-2007, 05:20 PM
Auto-Cad is widely used, easy to use for simple drafting, layouts, blah, blah.

There are many other products also, depends what your field is as to what else you would look at, especially if you are doing solids rather than just 2D stuff (allthough Autocat is a 3D).

gps3300
27-09-2007, 05:30 PM
It depends what industry you're looking at. *Very* generally speaking, aerospace uses CATIA V5, the electronics industry tends to use PRO-Engineer & automotive was IDEAS but is now swinging towards CATIA. A professional course for any of these is going to be a week long and cost around 1K :o

josh_smaxx
27-09-2007, 06:05 PM
Ive got the manual for an old auto-cad (release 8 IIRC) and its huge, like 1000's of pages :D read the first 40 odd and gave up, still got auto-cad 2000 though.

LEGEND
27-09-2007, 06:32 PM
At the school i go to there is a program called 'Pro Desktop' where you can create all sorts e.g camera's, cars, wheels, nuts, bolts, computers. You can make almost anything you can think of. And it is very easy to use as-well.

Stu
27-09-2007, 06:53 PM
Pro-desktop is a freeware program from the makers of Pro-engineer. It's a nice little thing for training and the makers promotion, but not really an industry standard.

Chris Doughty
27-09-2007, 09:40 PM
I know nothing about what the industry uses.

but I really like solidworks, I have no CAD training at all but I am able to make some cool things in it. it feels quite similar to 3D graphics model/mesh making applications.

Elliott Hopkins
27-09-2007, 10:44 PM
I hear solid works is quite good.

I may have to try Autocad. I think it's on a computer at work.

I may also give the freeware programme a go.

Thankyou guys.

Elliott.

Chris Green
28-09-2007, 06:21 AM
I have used Solidworks regularly for the past 7 years now. The company I work for, has 7 licenses. I use it to model refrigeration systems, mainly sheet metal housings and pipework layouts.

I've also used Pro/Engineer, and Solid Edge. From what I can tell, Solidworks has really grown stronger and stronger over the past few years. I believe it is one of the more common systems nowadays, behind the high-end stuff like Catia.

Its kind of a mid range bit of software, not quite as powerful as Pro/Engineer, but it is soooo much more user friendly. That said, it is still about 4k for a license if I remember correctly. plus a 1k computer to run it, and your license will need renewing each year to get the latest release, at a cost of about a grand.

Catia is one of the most powerful packages out there, but it is very very expensive compared to Pro/Engineer, Solidwork, Solid Edge etc.

elvo
28-09-2007, 08:11 AM
AutoCAD used to be the standard, long ago. It's coordinate-driven and uses mostly a command-line interface. Not too n00B-friendly... Inventor is from the same company, a lot better and relatively friendly.
Catia is the ultimate CAD software, but costs.... millions. You only really need it if you're designing a Boeing or military aircraft :-)
Pro/Engineer is.... very engineer-like. I think it used to be UNIX-based. Ver ytechnical.

SolidWorks is BY FAR the most intuitive to use, imho the best complete package. I'm quite sure it's what a large part of 'the industry' uses nowadays. Its tutorial is also the bees knees BTW. You'll like this one.

Elliott Hopkins
28-09-2007, 08:21 AM
In general, the CAD programs are incredibly complicated programmes, that are very expensive?

Do they all share a certain common style of user interface and method of operation?

Elliott.

Chris Green
28-09-2007, 08:28 AM
Most 3D systems use a similar interface, with a design tree down the one side of the screen, where you can view either assembly hierachy, or features of a modelled part.

If you got the hang of one system, you could pick up another fairly quickly really. I managed to pick up Pro/Engineer pretty quicky after only using solidworks.

mark christopher
28-09-2007, 09:40 AM
i have full auto cad and solidworks, both blow my mind.................................need to find a good teacher or somin simpler

Chris Green
28-09-2007, 09:56 AM
Hi Mark,

Have you tried the online tutorials within Solidworks? (Go to "Help" and then "Solidworks Tutorials" if using SW2007).

I have recently trained a couple of guys up in my department, and all the excercises they completed were from the tutorials.

It's quite surprising how quickly you can pick it up. One guy is almost fully competent, after using it for a few months, and he had no previous 2D or 3D cad experience.

If you get stuck on anything, feel free to give me a shout, I should be able to help.

Chris Doughty
28-09-2007, 10:12 AM
I ran through the SW2004 tutorials, very good material to learn from.

rich_cree
29-09-2007, 07:38 AM
I love Unigraphics :)

Cooper
29-09-2007, 10:14 AM
http://users.pandora.be/231st/B4temp2.jpg


;)



http://myspacetv.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&videoid=17047939

Molgorain
29-09-2007, 01:34 PM
AutoCAD used to be the standard, long ago. It's coordinate-driven and uses mostly a command-line interface. Not too n00B-friendly...

The commandline, was long time ago, its still there, but all commands has icons now. Been wokring with it for 8years now, still running Autocad2004, but I have been klooking a 2007 and the dynamic block-thing.

Its not cheap, but atleast in Sweden you can get a studentlicens, for a very good bargainprice.

Otherwise you have sketchup, very simple 3D-program. It has some very good video-tutorials online.

All depends on what kind of "computer-aid-drawing" you want to do, 2D or 3D?

TRF_Tastic
29-09-2007, 05:12 PM
Auto-cad superb tool to use, but you need a lot of hands on time to become fully proficient.

Catia, absolutely fantastic piece of software but major overkill for most applications.

Of the 3d apps Solid works is the daddy, but I have been using Sketchup for over a year now and its great for making things up very quickly, also for the more involved excerises.

There are a load of other CAD apps out in the market place mostly for very specialist applications Allplan for Architectural work along with caddy. There are also specialist apps for Chip design like L-Edit.

I would choose the most popular application for the area you want to specialize in and just spend as much time as you can completing as many of the online tutorials and tasks as you can. There is no substitute for experience with CAD design.

Chris Green
29-09-2007, 05:21 PM
http://users.pandora.be/231st/B4temp2.jpg



http://myspacetv.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&videoid=17047939

Cooper, what package was that modelled in? Fancy sharing your hard work? ;)

Cooper
01-10-2007, 11:44 AM
Cooper, what package was that modelled in? Fancy sharing your hard work? ;)


the B4 is in solidworks, made it together with Elvo

the assembly movie is in Inventor, made it in my CAD training

Somerwil
04-10-2007, 06:22 PM
As a mechanical engineer and application manager I thought it would be helpfull to join the discussion.

For 2D: AutoCAD is simply the best known application. It has it's limitations but it's just the best-known and most used CAD application around

For 3D: SolidWorks is probably the market's standard.

Forget about Catia and Pro-Engineer. That's for whizzkids and weirdo's with too much time.

The company I work for uses 7 CoCreate OneSpace Designer (3D) licenses including their Model Manager and 2D Drafting (previously ME10). Designer has a very different method to build up 3D models which I think is very easy to learn. It has a no part-history, no constraints, no bull-shit user interface. It's basically what you see is what you get. AND THAT'S GREAT! I love the program although it has it's limitations. You only come to the point of limitations when you want to program something that builts up machines/ parts automatically, but that's probably not what most people here are trying to do. :)

There's one problem with OneSpace Designer: It has a very limited user group so you will probably end up asking me questions? :)

CoCreate now offers a Personal Edition. This is a limited edition of the program I use at work. It's able to handle up to 60 unique 3D models and needs an internet connection to start up.

I really hope this was helpfull to anybody. Please feel free to give CoCreate OneSpace a try (sorry, you need to register first). I think it's worth it.

https://apps.cocreate.com/OneSpaceModelingPE/register.cfm

Gr,
Michael

Eotz
13-10-2007, 01:51 PM
Hi.

I'm working like 3D CAD designer for 10 years specially with I-Deas and Catia V5. I worked in many important automotive companies, like Ford at Cologne and Genk (Belgium), Nissan at Madrid (No a day closed) and Cranfield and many other automotive supliers and industrial companys. In fact I'm november I'm going to start working like freelance at Ford in Cologne.
First, the choice of the CAD system that one company need depends of the work they want to do with this tool. I mean, if you are looking for complex styling surfaces, you should think in programs like Alias, Icem Surf or Rhinos. If you are looking for big mechanical assembles, advanced surfaces, drafting tools, even with calculation options, you are looking for I-deas, Catia V5, Pro-Engineering or Unigraphics.
Then in a lower step are progams designed for small meachanical assembies (Like an RC car). Solid Works, Solid Edge, Autodesk Inventor...
And finally small companies that principally are looking only for 2D normally use Autocad.
I should say that there is not an specific CAD tool for every diferent industrial sector. For example, in the aeronautilcal sector you can find companies like Airbus that use Catia V5, but you can also find companies using Pro-Engineering or even Unigraphics (For me the worst CAD progam ever made). In the automotive world every group use a diferent progam. Nissan and Ford works with I-deas/C3P (Now Ford is changing to Catia V5), General Motors use Unigraphics (I think that Fiat uses it too) and the rest of the European groups, Mercedes-Benz, PSA, Renault, BMW and so on use Catia V5 (With their own working enviroments).
Then, other sectors like small tooling companies or arquitectural studies use normally Autocad. Another small industrial companies use Solid Works and similar products.

In my opinion according to my sperience, the most complete CAD system is I-Deas but this program have a very close death line. Unigraphic Solutions bought some years ago SDRC (The company who development the I-Deas) and is going to eliminate this system to avoid competence to their Unigraphis, in the future named NX.

Forgive my English, is no so good. I hope this help you.

Regards. :rolleyes:

RogerM
13-10-2007, 03:12 PM
Solid works is fast becoming the standard in the Automotive industry. The company I work for is one of the largest component suppliers in the automotive scene and all the sub suppliers and all of the customers my business devision work with all use Solidworks as their 3D modling package.

In the 8 years I've been using it it has changed a lot and now is super powerful and also easy enough your average high school kid could pick it up and run with it in a day!

Eotz
14-10-2007, 09:34 AM
Solid works is fast becoming the standard in the Automotive industry. The company I work for is one of the largest component suppliers in the automotive scene and all the sub suppliers and all of the customers my business devision work with all use Solidworks as their 3D modling package.

In the 8 years I've been using it it has changed a lot and now is super powerful and also easy enough your average high school kid could pick it up and run with it in a day!

I don't know wich is the company for you are working, but all the suppliers for I worked in 3 different countries use diferent CAD sistems depending of the customer, but I never seen nobody using Solid Works in the development of automotive parts. The packaging is a different history. Solid Works sure is a nice program, but now a day you should admit that is some steps below Catia, I-Deas, UG and so on.

Bye.

glypo
19-10-2007, 03:41 PM
Maybe I missed it, but Inventor doesn't seem to have been mentioned in detail.

AutoCAD is, and probably will always have the 2D market as people say. However on the Solid modelling front it's much more open. I use ProE and Catia an awful lot, and wouldn't say one is better then the other, both have different advantages.

However Inventor from Autodesk (AutoCAD makers) is an amazing bit of software. It is by far the quickest to use and easiest to learn. I must admit I came across problems when trying to draw some more complicated systems, but unlike most solid modellers I didn't have to spend ages working out where everything was, and the right procedure to run things. It works simply, the in-program documentation/help is the best out there and I think its dimensioning etc is the best. The rendering (has a built in, scaled down, version of 3d studio max engine) is the best out there too. So not the best for complicated drawings, for a beginner it's a perfect intro and it is capable of some good drawings.

jimmy
19-10-2007, 03:44 PM
I use 3d modeling software a bit, not cad stuff though. I must admit when I had a go on Inventor it was extremely easy to use. If someone like me can pick it up and model something in an evening then it must be easy!

Chris Doughty
19-10-2007, 03:53 PM
Jimmy, I came to solidworks with only expericen of 3d 'game' modeling software and its very easy to pick up how to use the software.

designing something from an engineering perspective is a different matter though

gps3300
22-11-2007, 05:47 PM
[quote=RogerM;64634]Solid works is fast becoming the standard in the Automotive industry. The company I work for is one of the largest component suppliers in the automotive scene and all the sub suppliers and all of the customers my business devision work with all use Solidworks as their 3D modling package.


Not sure what company you work for but Tier 1 suppliers tend to use the same CAD system as their customer for data compatibility i.e. Benteler would have IDEAS seats for a Ford project, CATIA seats for a Renault project etc. I've never seen any Solidworks data after 10 years in the iindustry so can't agree it's becoming a standard. However with CAD translation tools getting better all the time, converting data between software isn't the problem it used to be so perhaps things have moved on since I used to sit in front of a workstation.

Catia/Pro-E/NX etc tend to be used by bigger companies because of their ability to incorporate tools for change control/BoM generation/FEA/tolerance analysis/3D visualisation etc. The comments about these programs being too complicated and for weirdos with too much time are true if you sit at home playing with CAD or work for a small company, however with licenses costing tens of thousands of pounds that's not the market these CAD programs are aiming at. They are designed for companies creating large assemblies such as planes with 15,000 components and 100's of suppliers all contributing data.
They all fairly easy to pick up if you have any CAD experience, although not in the same league as say Solidworks for ease of use. To get an RC reference in, it's like the difference between a RTR and full blown race kit - both have the same basic function however one needs more knowledge and skill, but ultimately offers superior performance.

Stu
22-11-2007, 08:53 PM
Hi.

I'm working like 3D CAD designer for 10 .................................................. .................................................. .................................................. ......................... ago SDRC (The company who development the I-Deas) and is going to eliminate this system to avoid competence to their Unigraphis, in the future named NX.

Forgive my English, is no so good. I hope this help you.

Regards. :rolleyes:

Do not apologise for your English skills, they are better than some of the English people that post here.

From my experience your advice is spot on, re. the levels of detail needed.

Cooper
28-11-2007, 07:20 PM
Don't forget that alot of companies are depended on their customers. Like mine, we build gearboxes for industry and wind turbines.
We still use AutoCAD because our customers want this and because we have like 200.000 draings on the server, all autocad. Our newest products are in Pro-E and that is because a BIG client also uses Pro-E. Sometimes we also use Inventor (for other clients) but they told me it is slower with calculations...

Ezymango
20-05-2008, 01:59 PM
does anyone have an idea on what rc companies use for designing boddies for their cars? is it manual stuff like wood or clay sculpture for the buck or cad software and then a cnc'ed buck? i use alias wavefront for automotive surface design, its a fussy programe for a learner but after a while the results you can get are awesome!

Chris Doughty
20-05-2008, 04:50 PM
I know someone who managed to get solidworks to produce a nice truck shell (no idea how he did it!!)

Chris Green
21-05-2008, 07:28 AM
Yeah, you could use Solidworks to create 3D surfaces etc.

However, in all the years I've used Solidworks, I haven't done any surface modelling.
When I first started using Solidworks, back in 98, surface modelling was one of its weaknesses. I believe that over the recent years, it has progressed a lot.

To me, it seems that Solidworks is one of the more active companies in the CAD industry. I receive magazines in the post at work, such as M-Cad, Design Engineer etc, an

I might try and model something through lunchtime. :)

In my understanding, there is a big cost difference between the high-end Catia V5, Unigraphics & Ideas, compared to the more mid-range programs such as Solidworks, ProE, Solidedge, and inventor.