Speed Passion Wireless Power

[k£v!n]

Just noticed that it has already been posted in the right section! Sorry all!

http://www.rc-area.co.uk/blog/wp-content/uploads/2008/02/speed-passion-wireless-power.jpg
Source - http://www.rc-area.co.uk/blog/?p=2383

“Speed Passion have announced details of a future product line, which they say looks set to revolutionize both gas and electric R/C racing. Their rather criptic release states: We are proud to bring the Power of freedom, “The wireless power”. “Reduction” is one of the ways to help to protect the Earth. Imagine playing with an R/C car, boat, or soft air gun without chargers, power supplies, and extra battery packs. No more worries about battery pack quality, and chasing constant small advances in battery capability and size. Saving you time and money and developing new ideas to improve your skills in order to enjoy the pure fun of R/C.

What product they are announcing I dont know, but the picture above shows version 1.2 of the Wireless Power prototype, which looks like a speed controller with battery inputs that has a built 2.4Ghz system, judging by the aerial. Speed Passion will release more details every month in the lead up to its 2009 release date.

Brushless system is one of the best ways to help new user easier to enjoy R/C, more affordable, and help to protect our world. For pass year our team “Alex, Michael, Jack and Mr. Pan” had been working very hard day by day and putting more resource on R&D to delivery you the one of the best brushless system. King Golden company had focus main product strategy, “Reduce cost and item, more easier for new join R/C user and be respond to protect the world”. Speed Passion and King Golden “ASIC Design team” after day and night continue development and thousand, million resources we ready to bring you to next R/C revolution.

Our latest R/C technology and development solution will revolution 2009 which will change the R/C EP and GP racing, We are proud to bring the Power of freedom “The wireless power”. “Reduction” one of the ways to help to protect the Earth. Imagine playing with an R/C car, boat, or soft air gun without chargers, power supplies, and extra battery packs. No more worries about battery pack quality, and chasing constant small advances in battery capability and size. Saving you time and money and developing new ideas to improve your skills in order to enjoy the pure fun of R/C.”

[craigosh]

that'll be something like this then, http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/6129460.stm or the magnetic induction that things like electric tooth brushes use to charge.

[Michael.]

The 2009 release date does tie in (sort of) with the resonance technology, and the amount they're hyping it up (every month until 2009!) suggests something big.

Although I wouldn't be surprised if it was some crappy wireless battery gauge...

[b4rs]

surely sending eleccy wireleessly is gonna fry some brain cells, super radiation, and how hey gonna direct the power?

[sparrow.2]

Judging by your spelling they must have tested it on you :lol:

I've only ever heard of power being transmitted via microwaves and if this is anything close to that I don't really think I want to put my reproductory organs anywhere near the power transmitter...

[b4rs]

well i type really fast, and sometimes miss letters or add to many.

and tbh, dint know this was a spelling bee

[Michael.]

The link Craig posted explains it pretty much. It's to do with the resonance of the 'transmitter' and 'receiver' being the same.

[sparrow.2]

well i type really fast, and sometimes miss letters or add to many.

and tbh, dint know this was a spelling beeEase up! It was meant as a legpull. I don't mind if you stutter while typing ;)

It was just the first thing that came to mind when you wrote about fried brains :thumbsup:

[glypo]

Blimey hasn't anyone read any of Nikola Tesla's work in this area? It's far from a new technology, I think you'd find your mobile phone whacking out around 1 watt of power will fry many more brain cells then this.

As someone said over on RcKindom...... imagine 30+ minute electric finals. Proper racing like nitro rather then the rather sad 5 we have to race now. This technology will no doubt revolutionise RC in the same way 2.4GHz radio systems have. Technology in RC is finally going places :D

[bondy]

Can someone tell me how they are going to transmit "enough of something" to create a steady 20 amps cont with peaks of 100amps. Without us having to wear lead scheilding etc etc ! many years at college and university is struggling to wonder how ??

Tooth brushes sit on the charger! and its "milliamps" !

car moving around a circuit ???? This is gonna be intresting ??? :thumbsup:

[glypo]

Amps aren't anything really. Current is not the defining problem, it's power. Very basic Physics here. Current is obviously relative to power, but not the defining problem. Anyway lets say for a number of reasons we initially run around 7 volts to keep using standard ESC's etc. 7x20=140 watts. That's nothing. Mobile phone masts pump out factors more in terms of power. And you have to consider this is radiation, it's being emitted into a 3 dimensional environment. The actual power output is actually irrelevant really, rendering my above basic calcs useless, only good for comparison. What actually matters is the intensity of the radiation, and as I said 3D environment so you're talking about an exponential decay of radiation when you compare a linear distance from the wireless power transmitter. In fact just a couple of meters could mean factors less radiation.

In-fact I have just been typing some basic figures in my calculator and it would seem you would experience much more radiation from your microwave oven (all microwaves leak a bit) then from this technology. If it makes anyone feel safer, there is international legislation covering this stuff from the International Commission on Non-Ionizing Radiation Protection (ICNIRP), so we should be fine.

Funnily enough when I was in the first and second year of my bachelors degree I was planning to write my dissertation on wireless power for low level aircraft, mainly because one of the lecturers was an expert in the wireless power field. And my basic calculations showed that for low level (6,000ft) flight it was actually possible without frying anybodies brain providing 103 metres safety distance was kept from the transmitters. The technology is actually much more viable in use for cars on roads, and is being looked at in industry and academia as a way of getting around the battery/recharge problem on full size electric vehicles. Unfortunately my electronics lecturer left before the third year of the degree and luckily that lead me onto doing aerodynamics.... and as I'm sure I've demonstrated I've managed to lose most of my leccy skills lol. Anyway my point is, if it's safe and possible for massive vehicles, powering our little cars should be no problem. :D

[antnee]

http://www.rc-area.co.uk/blog/wp-content/uploads/2008/02/update-speed-passion-wireless-power.jpg

this is just wierd now!

[mobile chicane]

http://www.rc-area.co.uk/blog/wp-content/uploads/2008/02/update-speed-passion-wireless-power.jpg

this is just wierd now!


no wires at all ?

[DCM]

the cables from the ESC to the speed passion unit are missing, plus the wires to the motor and the ones to the receiver, I think they have been ommitted for a reason there.... I still think it is a wind up module lol.

[Garry]

My best guess:

You have a personal wireless basestation that you bind or pair up to your wireless 'battery' thingy, so your 'battery' only looks for power from your basestation.

Then, the power is sent and picked up by the 'battery' where it does its usual thing of powering the car.

If thats the case, imagine a race where the duration is limited by managing heat.....or your transmitter batteries? :lol:

Or another way is that the 'battery' is charged by placing it near or next to a charging pad, this technology already exists for mobile phones but the range is poor (less than 5 metres).

Lots of possibilties though.

[glypo]

Indeed, lots of possibilities. The photo just makes it more confusing lol. But isn't it very hard, if not impossible to bind a wireless power unit to specific transmitters though?

[DCM]

still, if you need a power supply at some point, not exactly green is it, still got to use power at some point.

They have removed the wires for clarity.

[Swiss]

Amps aren't anything really. Current is not the defining problem, it's power. Very basic Physics here. Current is obviously relative to power, but not the defining problem. Anyway lets say for a number of reasons we initially run around 7 volts to keep using standard ESC's etc. 7x20=140 watts. That's nothing. Mobile phone masts pump out factors more in terms of power. And you have to consider this is radiation, it's being emitted into a 3 dimensional environment. The actual power output is actually irrelevant really, rendering my above basic calcs useless, only good for comparison. What actually matters is the intensity of the radiation, and as I said 3D environment so you're talking about an exponential decay of radiation when you compare a linear distance from the wireless power transmitter. In fact just a couple of meters could mean factors less radiation.

In-fact I have just been typing some basic figures in my calculator and it would seem you would experience much more radiation from your microwave oven (all microwaves leak a bit) then from this technology. If it makes anyone feel safer, there is international legislation covering this stuff from the International Commission on Non-Ionizing Radiation Protection (ICNIRP), so we should be fine.

Funnily enough when I was in the first and second year of my bachelors degree I was planning to write my dissertation on wireless power for low level aircraft, mainly because one of the lecturers was an expert in the wireless power field. And my basic calculations showed that for low level (6,000ft) flight it was actually possible without frying anybodies brain providing 103 metres safety distance was kept from the transmitters. The technology is actually much more viable in use for cars on roads, and is being looked at in industry and academia as a way of getting around the battery/recharge problem on full size electric vehicles. Unfortunately my electronics lecturer left before the third year of the degree and luckily that lead me onto doing aerodynamics.... and as I'm sure I've demonstrated I've managed to lose most of my leccy skills lol. Anyway my point is, if it's safe and possible for massive vehicles, powering our little cars should be no problem. :D

Glypo

Some interesting comments. Athough this is a RC Car website, makes you smile when you read something connected with Work.

I have been many seminars relating to RF Radiation, particualy when the wireless market was booming, and everyone had fears relating to either Mobile Phones or Basestations. All those key words you remember SAR, Near field and Far field. Ionising and Non Ionising radiation. We work closely with a company called NSTS who design and manufacture the 'sniffers' that detect all these differant RF Fields also there is now available software to Map areas for 'hot spots'...

By the way, I am no expert on this, but the US Regalations, (so very much worldwide) state the maximum amount of leakage from the Oven at distances of 5cm = 1.0mWcm, (squared) and 5.0mWcm, (squared) throughout it's operating life.

Paul

[b4rs]

too hightech for me, ill stick wi my wired one, surely this is gonna be like wireless internet. problems and glitches wirelessly but no problems wired.
direct fit and direct travel.

ill go with the flow if it takes off. but i doubt it will be out in 2009 will it?

[glypo]

Cool stuff Paul. Sounds like you have a very good idea about this stuff.

Have you got any predictions about how they could go about this, and whether it would be safe or not?

DCM - Who says electricity is not green? Even using electricity from coal or gas burning stations you still get a very good power to emissions return. Not to mention by the time this technology takes off in the UK we will probably all be running from super green Nuclear power :)

[Northy]

By the way, I am no expert on this, but the US Regalations, (so very much worldwide) state the maximum amount of leakage from the Oven at distances of 5cm = 1.0mWcm, (squared) and 5.0mWcm, (squared) throughout it's operating life.


That is exactly why this will never work, the power is too low.

Forget about it. I think it's marketing bullshit to get people talking - oh look, it's worked! :lol:

G

[glypo]

G - I don't think Paul was trying to prove that wireless RC power is not possible with that statement.

Microwaves have strong ionising radiation which excites water to generate heat. So if microwaves from your oven escape it will literally cook you from the inside out... nasty! With wireless power for RC I doubt very much the frequencies would be anywhere near that of a microwave over (although they may be on the microwave spectrum).

[Northy]

OK, but think of the POWER we use.....
A motor can take 100A + at start up, and an AVERAGE of 20A over 5 mins.

I too have read the articles about this (I work in the electronics industry), there is no way you could wirelessly transmit that sort of power at the moment (which does not mean with 6 months development it will be BRCA legal in 2009 - I'm talking 10's of years!).

G

[Nick Goodall]

They had a completely Wireless TV at the recent(ish) Technology show in Vegas..... and i've heard about them working wireless powered Laptops for about a year now - Could be interesting and i think there's no doubt it WILL work in the future, but not sure how far off it is yet......

If it's 10 years time just think how good the Lipo's would be by then anyway - 30min races are almost possible now!!

[Swiss]

OK, but think of the POWER we use.....
A motor can take 100A + at start up, and an AVERAGE of 20A over 5 mins.

I too have read the articles about this (I work in the electronics industry), there is no way you could wirelessly transmit that sort of power at the moment (which does not mean with 6 months development it will be BRCA legal in 2009 - I'm talking 10's of years!).

G

I must admit to find a MMIC, (IC) that could handle this sort of power would be tough. I personally don't know of any FAB's worlwide that are currently producing this sort of technology, (I could be wrong). Although, I guess becuase the data rate would be low, you could operate the Amp in its saturated power band, e.g. it wouldn't have to operate in the linear band, (conversation e.g. Bluetooth headsets have high data rate, and consequently have to work in the linear range to minimise distortion)

Regarding exposure, there are so many differant aspects to consider when talking exposure levels. e.g. time exposed etc.. Even ICNIRP have differant std's for RF Workers, General Public etc.. So I think we should leave it to the experts... and wait and see. Who nows in a couple of years this could be the technology. I am sure if we could all guess what is round the corner we would all be very rich :)

P

[glypo]

G you mention power then talk about current. 100A means nothing, as lets face it sub-c cells can't even supply that. Wireless power will still rely on capacitors and low capacity high draw systems for the bursts we need just like current cells. So it's only the 20A we need to worry about. So lets consider power, that's 144 watts. That's not an awful lot at all really.

I agree with Nick, this is already being done. Fair enough at a shorter range, but at a much higher power. Who knows when this will come to rc, 10's of years seems a little too far off though! But yes, just because this is viable (well I suppose lets wait and see what they actually come up with before mentioning viable) I don't think it will be wide spread in RC in the near future. As said, LiPo's are too good even now. That's going to be the future for RC for a long time yet.

[Swiss]

G - I don't think Paul was trying to prove that wireless RC power is not possible with that statement.

Microwaves have strong ionising radiation which excites water to generate heat. So if microwaves from your oven escape it will literally cook you from the inside out... nasty! With wireless power for RC I doubt very much the frequencies would be anywhere near that of a microwave over (although they may be on the microwave spectrum).

Just one thing Glypo, as Microwaves are Non Ironizing radiation, they don't actually 'excite' the water molecules. Ironizing radiation doesn't start until 2420million MHZ, and at this frequency the photon energy levels are approximately the same 12.4eV, (at 2.45GHz energy levels approx 0.01eV) as the energy binding electrons to atoms. And at this energy water molecules can be ionized.

Roughly the way a microwave works is at 2.45GHz the wavelength which is a couple of cm, will absorb into the product and release energy, (heat)..

P

[glypo]

Non-ionising, oops.

Sorry for going off topic, but if microwave ovens aren't ionising and it's not to do with excitation... how do microwaves generate heat. A particle can't just absorb heat from electromagetic radiation. Is it simply to do with water being a dipolar particle, so as these move to orient them self in a planar, or polar, direction the movement generates heat?

That's the only possible explanation I can think of. I just assumed it was ionising, thanks for correcting me. I might have to do some google and wikipedia'ing later :)

Either way, my overall point stays true that microwaves are only dangerous as they heat water and perhaps other dipole molecules so can effectively cook a person anyway. And that rc power in theory at least is possible and could be done safely.

[MRD]

BAM! wireless power technology

http://www.crazyparkrides.com/images/bumper-cars/3.jpg

Just give me the prize for sience now :D

[DCM]

hey, it is a stock touring car race!!! or thats how they drive like