Newbie Help

[ShaneyB]

I'm really keen on getting a 1:10 electric buggy for myself and 8 year old son. Got a few models I'm keen on for different reasons and would appreciate any advice you can give. I live in a nice place with plenty of dirt tracks, old bmx tracks and skate parks so decided to go for a buggy rather than touring car (even though WLRC is a few minutes away from me) as I thought I'd get a lot more neighbour friendly use from electric as opposed to nitro/petrol. I'm also not sure how often I will get to local clubs for race nights.
So.....what to go for? For different reasons I'm looking at the following models (no specific order):

1) FTX Vantage 4WD RTR for general bashing. Seen a couple live with a few upgrades and they don't look bad to the untrained eye. Very robust.

2) FTX Edge 2WD RTR as above.

3) Associated B4.1 RTR (too good for running through my local trails)? Remember I may race it also....

4) Losi 22 RTR as per B4.1

Would love to buy a kit and build it with my boy but price seems to be much higher that way and I set a budget of around £300.00 as we may both get bored (doubtful) in a few months.
Also I haven't used any decent RC vehicle before so reciever is confusing me. I quite like the idea of the wheel but I would prefer to use the throttle with my right hand finger and steer with my left. All seem to be the other way around?? Should I look at sticks instead?? Like I say I haven't used any of note so think we'd adapt to any eventually.
Sorry to rattle on but I can't wait to get hold of our new toy.

Fingers crossed I'll be at a DMS/Taplow meeting this week.

Thanks in advance.

Shane

[bomboms]

I race a 22 which is fantastic but a couger kit is 130 on modelsport which is another good car:thumbsup::thumbsup:

[Naushad]

22 all the time

Owned a Cougar....not bad but 22 is better

[(off)roadrunner]

have you considered a "shortcourse truck"? still 1/10th offroad class, but they tend to be alot more forgiving than buggys especially if your mainly going to be using it for play more than racing but still want something that you can chuck on a track and race properly (maybe just a change of tyres keep a set for races and a set for playing),

main adavantage of the SCT's is that the body encloses most of the car and absorbs most of the impacts, whereas with a buggy the suspension and wheels stick out and are very exposed and can break in heavy impacts, meaning that if you plan on running at skate parks bmx tracks etc with your son there is less chance of breakage with the SCT's

Also its a good fun class to race in with body comtact being allowed more and good close racing without the tangles of buggys arms etc.

if you do fancy one for the £300 area you can get some good RTR trucks

hpi blitz
kyosho ultima readyset
venom gambler
losi XXx sct
(2wd)

4wds tend to be more expensive with the trucks although there is the LRP 4wd which is under your budget

[JCJC]

You are on the best plan, visit local clubs, Taplow (new venue) in Slough and DMS in Watford, there is also another club in Watford: http://hertfordshirerccc.webs.com/ run outside on Sundays I believe.

Of course DMS also have one of the best shops in the country, (catchyerlaterDarren)

You will find the speed controls we use do not have reverse at this level, forward & brake mostly, takes some getting used to when starting for younger drivers, the cars are much faster than you may expect, advantage of the B4 is everybody in the sport has had one, fixed one and a good chance you may get spare parts trackside or quickly, they can be converted to mid motor(X6) if you are inclined. What about a B4 RTR and a B4 kit, upgrade the kit as and when. There is second hand stuff around as well. (B4 is Associated = imperial tools)

[Jamesk]

HRCCC,is ideal for beginers and people having fun, we have a few members running the cars you listed, so come down and talk to the guys running the cars and a general chat with us. As you get to grips with the hobby you can pace yourself agaisnt the quicker guys too.

jK

[VintageRacer]

Have a look at Ansmann as well, their kits and RTR are good value but still good for racing as a beginner to intermediate.

[ShaneyB]

Thanks guys,
I'm a typical bloke who wants the fastest, best thing I can get my hands and no doubt will struggle with it at first. Got hooked on the buggy's watching RC6 on Motors TV so have my heart set on a buggy. Went to look at a Mad Monkey a week or so ago but can't get the B4.1 out of my head. I've looked at more pictures and vid's of that than I have my family recently! Didn't realise it could be converted to mid motor so that's a bonus as the main reason I was looking at a 22 was for that versatility.
DMS are probably fed up with me already so apologies to the staff there. I'm lucky it's only a 10 minute drive from my office. Also seen a Durango on sale on this forum for £200.00 with spares - worth a look??

Thanks again all.

[Layloo9136]

The B4.1 is a great car no doubt. I got a factory team version and it was an easy build and nice car. I now have a Losi 22 which is also very good as per peoples comments above, so you really can't go wrong with either. Durango is very much the new kid on the block and a couple of friend have the 210. The 410 some have issues with linkages bursting lipo's etc. But I don't know too much about them to comment

Bear in mind when you commented about the Mid motor in the 22 and mention about the B4.1 being able to be mid motor too - remember that to get your B4.1 mid motored will cost you well over another £160 for the C4.1 conversion kit http://www.modelsport.co.uk/pages/cml-centro-c4.1-conversion-kit-for-the-associated-b4.1/rc-car-products/366927. The Losi gives you the choice out of the box but only in the kit version. The RTR 22 only comes set one way and you can buy the parts to convert it the other way which is a lot less than buying a C4.1 chassic for a B4.1 (sorry for the onslaught of initials! )

[Stu]

The 410 some have issues with linkages bursting lipo's etc. But I don't know too much about them to comment

Probably best not to then, eh.

For a club racing starter don't get hung up on mid/rear motor, to a starter there is not be much difference. Until you get hooked on racing and you get a couple of years practice at racing it will not matter at all.
The B4 or the Losi willbe fine. Possibly Durango will bring out a 210 RTR at some point with rear & mid in the kit, who knows.

If you just want to go smashing about the local BMX track it matters not what you get as you'll soon smash it up and get bored/frustrated.

[neiloliver]

I agree with Stu. My advice would be to go for either the Associated B4.1, Losi 22 or Durango DEX210. Forget about C4.1, Cougar or X6 for now (and I am saying this having run two of the last three). You will have enough to worry about without having to consider conversion kits and making bits from other kits fit each other.. leave that to when you have raced for a few years and have reached the limit of your initial talent.

All of these three models will be good to learn with, easy and cheap to repair and would win a club/regional/national/european or world meeting in the right hands.

Try to race at a club.. driving around BMX tracks is OK for a while but leads to the darkside and boredom. Racing around a track against other people with the same passion as you leads to great fun, great friendships and is a fantastic way of using weekends.

Neil

[Layloo9136]

Probably best not to then, eh.



What can I say - I simply go off what I read on forums and see from people experiences - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-e_0nKDne4A

[RoyalCBR]

I was a newbie at the start of 2011, and my first 2wd was a B4 - it's a good car don't get me wrong but as a newbie the main thing you will be doing is breaking it! Trust me I know.

Getting spares for the B4 was ok, but alot of the time things were always out of stock :( in my opinion either go for a Losi 22, or an Ansmann mad monkey (x2c if you can afford it). Both are mid motor and I can only comment on the Ansmann which is easy to handle, cheap spares and lots of availability - plus it transformed my club racing :)

[ShaneyB]

I agree with Stu. My advice would be to go for either the Associated B4.1, Losi 22 or Durango DEX210. Forget about C4.1, Cougar or X6 for now (and I am saying this having run two of the last three). You will have enough to worry about without having to consider conversion kits and making bits from other kits fit each other.. leave that to when you have raced for a few years and have reached the limit of your initial talent.

All of these three models will be good to learn with, easy and cheap to repair and would win a club/regional/national/european or world meeting in the right hands.

Try to race at a club.. driving around BMX tracks is OK for a while but leads to the darkside and boredom. Racing around a track against other people with the same passion as you leads to great fun, great friendships and is a fantastic way of using weekends.

Neil

Thanks Neil,
I will race at a club but thought I'd spend a while getting used to the car first before I turn up at a meet and embarress myself.

I am SO confused on which car to go for......

Can get a Mad Monkey Kit with the the following spec for around £300.00 + tools

1 x Ansmann Racing Mad Monkey £65.00
1 x Etronics AX3G LED Controller £32.99
1 x Metal Servo £17.99
1 x Brushless 9.0T Motor £69.99
1 x 7.4v LiPo Battery £24.99
1 x 11v LiPo Battery £42.99
1 x Core RC UAC50 Fast Charger £45.99
1 x Tool Kit £15.99
1 x Set Alkaline Batteries £ 4.00

Total £319.93

Any thoughts??

[Col]

Any thoughts??

Dump all ideas of running the 11v lipo. Even if the electrics take it, the car wont.
A 1/10 car can already be far too fast with 2cell brushless

[Jamesk]

NEIL, get a good reliable and easy car to fix and i'd agree the Mad Monkey fits the bill. Pop down to a club or two and everyone will be happy to chat to you, what ever you choose it will be great fun and very frustratilng at the same time. Speed is only a matter of money and talent is cost free (ish)

jK

[RoyalCBR]

I think the 11v Lipo was for the TX?

Totally agree about getting something easy to fix. I have raced at Taplow quite a few times and the majority of the 2WD cars are Losi 22s and Ansmann X2Cs (the pro version of the Mad Monkey).

My thoughts:


Mad Monkey kit
Radio system - have a look here (http://www.jespares.co.uk/electric-models?page=shop.product_details&flypage=flypage.tpl&product_id=9433&category_id=504)
Stick Lipo - anything really (get 2 if you can)
Servo - go for a Savox if you can afford it
AA batteries for your Radio
9.0t brushless should be fine to get you going


Some things you have missed:

ESC - speedo, I use Hobbywing nice and cheap and on ebay
PT (personal transponder) you could borrow one of these when at your club night


I know how confusing everything can be, one of the best things would be to go along to a club and see if anyone has anything for sale 2nd hand or check out the oOple FOR SALE section.

Hope that helps, Mark

[mattybucks]

- plus it transformed my club racing :)

Did it??:lol:

[bomboms]

Thanks Neil,
I will race at a club but thought I'd spend a while getting used to the car first before I turn up at a meet and embarress myself.

I am SO confused on which car to go for......

Can get a Mad Monkey Kit with the the following spec for around £300.00 + tools

1 x Ansmann Racing Mad Monkey £65.00
1 x Etronics AX3G LED Controller £32.99
1 x Metal Servo £17.99
1 x Brushless 9.0T Motor £69.99
1 x 7.4v LiPo Battery £24.99
1 x 11v LiPo Battery £42.99
1 x Core RC UAC50 Fast Charger £45.99
1 x Tool Kit £15.99
1 x Set Alkaline Batteries £ 4.00

Total £319.93

Any thoughts??

Dont get a ansmann as they may not be making parts or cars anymore

[JCJC]

Dont get a ansmann as they may not be making parts or cars anymore

is that true ?

[bomboms]

is that true ?

Rumoured by one of the ansmann sponsored guys at my local club

[mattybucks]

Rumoured by one of the ansmann sponsored guys at my local club

There's nothing like representing a brand to the max.

[Col]

Dont get a ansmann as they may not be making parts or cars anymore

is that true ?

Nope. Utter rubbish.

http://www.oople.com/forums/showthread.php?t=91225

[VintageRacer]

Rumoured by one of the ansmann sponsored guys at my local club

Soon to be an ex-sponsored driver possibly?

It's exactly what you said, a rumour.

[ShaneyB]

OK,
My preferred choice is........

Associated B4.1

1 x Associated B4.1 £209.00
1 x Overlander 3000ma LiPo battery £28.99
1 x Core RC UAC50 Fast Charger £45.99
1 x Set Alkaline Batteries £2.00

Total £285.98

This is based on information over the phone from Modelsport but will buy the car from DMS. I'd love to go for the kit but to get I want will be out of budget. If anyone can advise on better alternatives for the B4.1 feel free to let me know.

Thanks again all, I love forums :woot: wife thinks I'm weird.

[Col]

That's the RTR, then?

Not a bad choice, but be aware that all the electrics will need replacing as you progress in skill level.

[ShaneyB]

Yep RTR as I can't get anything I like for sub £300.00 as a kit.

Remember I will race but we're both completely new so may (doubtful) give it up in a couple of months. Also the Parmiters meet on a Thursday night is very late for me to get to with an 8 year old so will have to travel to Taplow for earlier racing but not sure I can get there much before 6.30pm.

[VintageRacer]

OK,
My preferred choice is........

Associated B4.1

1 x Associated B4.1 £209.00
1 x Overlander 3000ma LiPo battery £28.99
1 x Core RC UAC50 Fast Charger £45.99
1 x Set Alkaline Batteries £2.00

Total £285.98

This is based on information over the phone from Modelsport but will buy the car from DMS. I'd love to go for the kit but to get I want will be out of budget. If anyone can advise on better alternatives for the B4.1 feel free to let me know.

Thanks again all, I love forums :woot: wife thinks I'm weird.

Looks to be a decent starter set-up. I'd be inclined to spend a bit more and get rechargable AA's for the transmitter, they can probably be charged with the Core charger (I say probably as I don't know that specific charger).

As I've said before though, for about the same money as the RTR B4.1, I got a new Mad Monkey kit and used electrics, which should out last the car and be more sale-able when/if I decide to upgrade.

Mad monkey - £65
Novak GTB esc - £45
LRP X12 motor - £35
Etronix 2.4GHz stick tranny and rx - £50
Savox servo (needed some wires patching up) - £25

Don't forget to budget for a set of wheels and tyres for racing. Don't know about Associated but the standard tyres on the Ansmann cars are not the best for most racing tracks.

[ShaneyB]

Thank you.

So you'd suggest going Mad Monkey kit over B4.1 RTR? Could I get that set up from DMS?

I wish someone would just put one on my desk and ask for the money - far easier!

[VintageRacer]

Thank you.

So you'd suggest going Mad Monkey kit over B4.1 RTR? Could I get that set up from DMS?

I wish someone would just put one on my desk and ask for the money - far easier!

Having never driven a B4 I can't comment on that, and you couldn't get that full set up from DMS as most of it was 2nd hand, which is the point I was trying to make. Buying second hand carefully chosen items one-by-one should get you a better overall set-up for about the same money.

If you want an all-in-one solution, I'd say go for the RTR but be prepared to upgrade more of it in the future.

[ShaneyB]

Cheers

[lovechild]

ill probably get slaughtered by the model shops...but if you are after cheap batteries then these work perfectly fine....i used them all last year....

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/KingMax-battery-4200mAh-7-4v-25c-lipo-Akku-RC-model-new-Free-Shipping-/110800982873?pt=Radio_Control_Parts_Accessories&hash=item19cc40d359

[Andrew Twigger]

If you're thinking of going down the route of second hand electrics, you may as well also consider a second hand car. There are tons of fickle folk on here who buy the flavour of the month one week and sell it the next at reduced prices, so you could bag a bargain. Better still, you may be able to find someone selling everything you need. The problem is, since you're not dealing with people face to face and whom you've never met, you won't necessarily know whether they're trustworthy or not. Which will always be a problem on forums like this.

However, as someone who is testing the water and has questions that need answering, I feel your local model shop will be invaluable in this case. Not only will they be able to advise you on what to get, but they should also support you in case of any failures.

[VintageRacer]

If you're thinking of going down the route of second hand electrics, you may as well also consider a second hand car.

Agreed to a point, but part of the reason for wanting a kit (if I remember the start of the thread correctly) was because he wanted to build the car himself. A second hand car doesn't allow this, unless of course it is un-built first, but that's true for a RTR too.

[lovechild]

what's second hand? the ebay link was to new batteries.

[JCJC]

what's second hand? the ebay link was to new batteries.

Cheap Hong Kong batteries, sure they will be great for bashing and some club level racing, but most clubs and any BRCA (regional & national) meetings will require 'approved' batteries. (I know DMS club require approved batteries). It is possible these will be on the 2012 list but ...........................

[lovechild]

Why arent they BRCA legal though? The raw material cost I imagine is the same. The only major difference is marketing cost. I also have some speed passion batteries and honestly I cannot tell the difference.

[Gonky]

Why arent they BRCA legal though? The raw material cost I imagine is the same. The only major difference is marketing cost. I also have some speed passion batteries and honestly I cannot tell the difference.


To become BRCA legal they need to be submitted for approval and only approved items can be used at BRCA events. The 2012 lists are due out in a month or so i assume.

[lovechild]

I don’t want to divert away too much from the persons original thread, but in a way it is relevant, as he is looking for advice as to the best way to get started in the hobby, and to me £11.50 for a set of 4200 lipo 25c batteries seems a great way to start. How do you get on the BRCA approved list? Can anyone just simply send in a set of batteries for approval? or does it have to be the distributer or manufacture or what? Because until the peg is changed or removed between the Hong Kong dollar to the US dollar, these batteries will remain cheap for quite a while. And one of the barriers to entry into this sport is the cost, and if we can do something to lower those barriers of entry then surely that will help attract more people to the sport.

[Col]

Cells (along with motors) have to be submitted by the official distributor of the item. They are then extensively tested for size, safety and god knows what else.
Whilst I agree that cheap batteries are fine, they are cheap for a reason. Can't say I'd want to risk my £700 worth of car for the sake of an additional £50 on decent quality cells.

[lovechild]

They are cheap (as far as I can see), because Hong Kong has an artificially low exchange rate to the US dollar. And they are not at the top end of the performance scale. And they do not have high marketing costs. I have used these batteries with no problems. I have even shorted them by accident :blush:. But they did not blow up and they charged fine after. And I’m sure there are other people out there who are using them on the weekends and have also found that they work perfectly fine. If I was running a model shop I would look into speaking to the manufacture or even one of the Hong Kong distributers and see if some sort of arrangement could be made with becoming the UK distributer for these cells, and see if we cannot bring down the cost of racing a bit.

[JCJC]

The cost of batteries is vastly reduced for racers at club level and above from a few years ago, we used to carry 6 or more sets of 'factory' matched cells, we would use them once only at any meeting, that's 4 heats & a final or 3 finals if no one else turned up, these packs were over 50 quid each and needed attention between meetings, discharge, balance & charge. These days we can & do race on one lipo (second as backup in box) all day. Saving money & time.

The approval process also keeps the sport fair, you can assume now more than ever that other driver's don't have better batteries than you, we all have more power than we can handle.

ShaneyB seems to have this thread running twice so a bit off topic's not so bad.

but there is lots of good kit in the for sale section, problem when starting is knowing whats worth having & whats not. Visit to a few clubs will help.

[lovechild]

Totally agree that the cost has been reduced. But cant we reduce it more? Realistically two sets of batteries I think is what you need to race. And if it is possible to obtain two sets for £30 rather than £80 - £100 why arent we doing it? When in essence they are the same batteries. Anything we can do to encourage more people into the sport has to be a good thing right?