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VincentVisser
02-04-2012, 01:15 PM
Hello to all.

Let me clarify for you what I mean by this.


We were at the Robin Hood Racing event this Sunday and well myself and a couple of people got chatting about young drivers and how there is a lack of them.


One of the people there has 2 sons but only had 1 there on the day. I had to ask where the other one was because they normally always in a 3 pack group at our club. (father and 2 sons)


He pointed out that his other son is a bit younger then the son racing that day and that because he still brakes things allot with club lvl he wants to keep the costs down, he also pointed out that because none of the younger drivers where his age he felt that other drivers in his class (some adults) will just get angry with him racing slower and might say something to upset the younger boy and make him not want to race again.


He also pointed out that at his age he just wants to race but wants to really just have fun with the car and at completion lvl well it is completion and most fathers become over spenders to give their kids the best kit to get them to win races.


I think here lies the problem. The kit they use.


On the day there where I think I counted only 4 kids under 13, and the rest where well adults with toy cars and we had 1 woman driver.


What if we had a series like the clio cup?


RTR cheap series where kids up to a set age can race each other but the only thing is that itís down to driver skill and not the car.


The car will be a brushed rtr car and no modifications are allowed. I think one exception would be tires due to surface changes. This will mean that itís really down to the individual driver and the fact that someone has beaten you is just down to practice and time behind the wheel so to speak.


Now im not saying RTR TA or lossi cars but more the £100 - £150 mark where the cars are cheap to run and even cheaper to fix. It means the costs are down and well fathers that already come there to race their cars might actually bring their sons and daughters (We need more woman drivers) with to actually try it out.


What you think am I just the only one that has noticed this or are there others and if you have any good suggestions please inform me.


Thanks Vince

Dudders
02-04-2012, 01:21 PM
At Surrey and Hants on Sunday we have a heat for the Novice/Junior's and there were 6 of them, ranging from 6 years to 11 years of age.

Mixture of cars used from Vega, B4.1 RTR, Losi 22... so now real lack of kit. I think we've all gone on the fact that a quality car does have less issues, and when your running two kids AND yourself at a meeting you do not want to be repairing cars!!!

As a father myself and back after a 20 year break I was shocked at the lack of kids, that's why we always run a kids race as a stand alone.

They have zero pressure and crash and bash about like no business. As far as I can recall, only two cars had minor breakages over 4 rounds and 3 legged finals. Most of the cars top end is tweaked down though which helps.

Good luck with trying to get the kids racin' :thumbsup:

cjm_2008
02-04-2012, 01:26 PM
What if we had a series like the clio cup?


RTR cheap series where kids up to a set age can race each other but the only thing is that itís down to driver skill and not the car.


The car will be a brushed rtr car and no modifications are allowed. I think one exception would be tires due to surface changes. This will mean that itís really down to the individual driver and the fact that someone has beaten you is just down to practice and time behind the wheel so to speak.



makes a lot of sense, and is something I've often banged on about when I was more active at club level.

one of most amazing things about the tamiya eurocup (especially the m-chassis and tl-01 chassis classes) was how close the competition was. those were the days!

Big G
02-04-2012, 01:28 PM
we only have 1 under 16 at our club. its a real shame since we hold the club nights at the local high school and no one goes to that school :(

When I was 11-16 I think there were 8 or so from the school racing.

VincentVisser
02-04-2012, 01:44 PM
Clubs need to invest a bit to get more younger drivers there...

If you have a club buy 4 cheap cars and get people to bring there kids with to give it a go. yes they will break something but its a quick fix. Plus if you have a fathers and kids day you can have the dads vs the kids with the same kit and you might find that dad and son go and buy the same car to have fun and join the club.

I mean yes it might be a bit expensive for the club but have a open day where people can come try the car for a 5min heat for like a £5 or £10 and you cover your cost for the cars plus you get people to actually see that it is not that expensive to buy and run a £100 RTR car.

I also blame sponsors and Car manufacturers for the same reason. I mean someone like annsman that has a car for £100 should donate cars to the clubs and get them to have a annsman cup or something like that... I mean if you have driven with the car you will want the same car when you go buy one so not only are they making there money back they actually investing in the future racers.

Stuweatherman
02-04-2012, 03:38 PM
What you'll find is that a lot of the dad's don't have time to take their kids to a track. And consider the cost of everything its cheaper to buy them GT5 or Forza for the console they already have than to buy couple of hundred pounds worth of rc stuff and spend £5 a week to go racing.

Also we see it in the shop a lot that they don't want to invest too much in it as a lot of kids nowadays seem very fickle and loose interest in something at the drop of a hat!!

Yes rtr kits have come a long way but its the use it now mentality that has ruined a lot of it as the passion to build something and use it has gone. So when it breaks chuck it in the cupboard and move on rather than fix it themselves.

eyeayen
02-04-2012, 03:58 PM
I think Stu's comments above are quite valid about games consoles being what kids are really into, they can play on line, chat to their friends, do whatever with out the parents having to leave the house and actually take them anywhere.

When I was younger I got into cars because my mates brother had them, loads of us were into them at school, what do they talk about in the playground now though ? Xbox and how to complet a level on a game...

If shops or clubs could go to schools and get the kids interests with demo's that would help. I think the manufacturers need to take note though, I've got back into this now because I can afford it but if I hadn't done it when I was younger I probably wouldn't be doing it now. Everything is SO expensive now though.

The clio cup series idea is a good one. One make series, cheap speedo ( what's the cheapest brushless set up ? ) and a basic chassis, I'd like to do that myself just for the cheapness. I've been looking around and a lot of people you ask advice from seem to just bang on about how much they've spent as opposed to telling you how you can start cheaply.

westyguesty
02-04-2012, 04:09 PM
Same problem went I went to Kidderminster event the other weekend, only a couple of kids, think 9 and 12 were the youngest.

I'm not sure rtr is that good long term, unless they have a decent model shop or get to know people at a local track who can help quickly. If you build it your self (or with the help of dad :D) you will have some idea on how to fix it. There are probably lots of people who buy rtr, have a breakage, then they just sit in a box, never to be used again. I do like the idea of a one make series, makes good sense.

Maybe a motor limit to keep it a bit more consistent, but to be honest if i put a 6.5t in my sons car he would be slower round the track than with a 17.5t. Not sure how many weeks most clubs run leagues over, but 5 or 6 tops for juniors would be good, with certificates for all, and small medals etc for top 3.

My lads only six and another problem he has is non of the clubs run weekends, and finishing at 10 on week nights is too late. Going to take him to a few over the summer months to get him some practice.

Aran
02-04-2012, 04:10 PM
getting demonstrations in primary schools would help. promote it as accessible father son activity.

RogerM
02-04-2012, 04:28 PM
I think in quite a few areas the lack of model shops selling race quality (even cheaper RTRs that are race worthy like the Ansman stuff) is also a deciding factor. How would most of the potential young racers even know RC racing exists?

Again, I feel this is down to a lot of model shops realising that so many people buy abroad for reduced costs that there is little to no point in stocking stuff for racers.
For that reason all you tend to see is the cheaper (£50ish) RTR cars you can't really get spares for on the shelves and maybe the odd Tamiya kit.

Very very sad, when I started racing at Alcester Buggy Club in the mid 80s about 1/3rd of the drivers were in the junior classes.

Promotion would certainly help and it is relatively easy for a club to run a demonstration event at school open days, local carnivals etc. but that rarely seems to happen.

Shame, how long will it be until the lack of younger interest breaks clubs and we all have to head to Hong Kong / China to race as well as buy the parts?

grumble over ...

Dudders
02-04-2012, 04:39 PM
I've got back into this now because I can afford it but if I hadn't done it when I was younger I probably wouldn't be doing it now. Everything is SO expensive now though.

Sorry totally disagree with costs. I think it has got CHEAP in terms of cost and inflation.

Kits have remind fairly low, you can run a meeting on one lipo (£30 to £90 new) instead of old Nimh's (£45 min and you'd need 5 sets at least. Spares are VERY low as well. So cost IMHO is NOT the issue.

Technology is the issue and also lazy parents. As said above, consul generation (although we had them in 1990 :cry:).

I'd be very interested to see some costs of purchases in 1990 as I cant remember what race fees and kits truely cost.

hotrodchris
02-04-2012, 05:06 PM
Another thing that would help is a bit of TV advertising but the only time it is on TV is Motors TV at about 11pm! apart from the odd time MK Racing appeared on Top Gear!

eyeayen
02-04-2012, 06:18 PM
Sorry totally disagree with costs. I think it has got CHEAP in terms of cost and inflation.

Kits have remind fairly low, you can run a meeting on one lipo (£30 to £90 new) instead of old Nimh's (£45 min and you'd need 5 sets at least. Spares are VERY low as well. So cost IMHO is NOT the issue

Yes I see your point but as I said when I've asked people have often said to me about getting certain ESC's and when home from the track and checking prices they're phenomenal money. ESC's seem to be the most expensive thing these days. If you imagine that in the eyes of a dad who is getting his child into RC and doesn't want to go down the RTR route you would add up all the costs and the little electronic box is generally over £100. When I used to run brushed with NiMh's fair enough I had 3 sets of batteries but the speedo was only £20, so although your saving money with Lipo's your spending more on ESC's. For the first timer that is an expensive outlay. And as was mentioned before kids are quite fickle these days and if they're going to loose interest that's a lot to waste along with the rest of the outlay. I just think it would be nice to see a budget class, there aren't any budget speedo's now are there unless you get from China / Hong Kong ?

Tomk26B4
02-04-2012, 06:20 PM
The Tiverton club has a junior touring car class and championship, and seem to always have at least 7-8 drivers :thumbsup:

lardy37
02-04-2012, 06:25 PM
well i got 2 sons one 14 and one 12 the 14yr old not interested in any thing but xbox but the 12yr old loves racing and actually beats me most of the time, he races micro,tc and now going to do 10th buggys allthough it can be pricey he only has one new car an MI1 tc as a christmas present the others are all my old cars, as most will know we all want the newest car out so instead of selling them cheap just give them to your kids, also trccc dont charge a race fee for juniors so if they brake something every other meeting it dont matter as you saved on race fees so maybe more clubs should do free entry for juniors it might help :thumbsup:

Dudders
02-04-2012, 06:30 PM
Yes I see your point but as I said when I've asked people have often said to me about getting certain ESC's and when home from the track and checking prices they're phenomenal money. ESC's seem to be the most expensive thing these days. If you imagine that in the eyes of a dad who is getting his child into RC and doesn't want to go down the RTR route you would add up all the costs and the little electronic box is generally over £100. When I used to run brushed with NiMh's fair enough I had 3 sets of batteries but the speedo was only £20, so although your saving money with Lipo's your spending more on ESC's. For the first timer that is an expensive outlay. And as was mentioned before kids are quite fickle these days and if they're going to loose interest that's a lot to waste along with the rest of the outlay. I just think it would be nice to see a budget class, there aren't any budget speedo's now are there unless you get from China / Hong Kong ?

Taken onboard, how I miss my condom cover speedo!. The fun we had when we dumped and the servo stuck!.

BUT take an AE B4.1 RTR, 2.4ghz, Brushless, just add Battery and charger for just under £250 all in. That's bloody good value to get racing.

Yes, it wont win you the World's (oh it did! lol) but for entry its not 'that' bad compared to other hobbies.

Si Coe
02-04-2012, 06:43 PM
We've got plenty of kids racing at Bury - I know because all the adult drivers (who's kids aren't racing that is) never stop complaining!
I suspect that's part of the problem. The vast majority of our younger drivers are the sons/daughters of those who raced as kids themselves. Father and son now both race, which is great for the family but does mean that Dad can't get that serious.
Clubs with tight rules, where people get super competitive and arguments happen after racing incidents are not the place to take your child. Bury isn't like that, so we tend to attract them, but at the cost of our more hardcore racers going elsewhere.

I'm not convinced you need a spec class - in fact it might be counter productive because many new drivers turn up with a car they already have. They don't want to buy new stuff. What we do is much simpler, we run a 'Fun' class. 2wd, 4wd, Short course or Stadium - doesn't matter. The only rule is that if you get too good we bump you up to the relevant adult class.

We've also got a few club cars available to rent. Currently I think its a Master Smacker and a couple of old Academy's all with basic 540's and NiMH's. To date they've not seen much use but we don't really publicise them so that might be why.

Paul str
02-04-2012, 09:23 PM
I haven't been racing for 24 years but as a kid I went racing with my grandad. This Sunday me and my grandson went racing at bury buggy club, there were a few kids there and it was a really friendly place, he is now hooked and this is partly due to the warm welcome we received :thumbsup: we are now planing on going ever week

qatmix
02-04-2012, 10:50 PM
The local onroad clubs all seem to have a good amount of young drivers. However they do focus on skill not balls out speed so there is a more gentle introduction to rc racing. Most importantly it depends on the clubs attitude. Kids need to come first, anyone that doesn't like it needs to put up with it and make do or leave, you only need a couple of arseholes mouthing off to marshals to put most kids off.

terry.sc
03-04-2012, 01:04 AM
Yes I see your point but as I said when I've asked people have often said to me about getting certain ESC's and when home from the track and checking prices they're phenomenal money. ESC's seem to be the most expensive thing these days.From my experience racers will usually tell you that you need this high spec ESC and that it's better than anything else. You never seem to see a racer pointing out they are running with the cheapest equipment. For beginners the racers should be recommending the Fusion Xceed or Etronix Fusion combos when in reality the racers suggest whatever they use, and how many new buggy racers are recommended a 7.5T or 8.5T motor when they would be faster with a 10.5T or even a 13.5T.
The clio cup series idea is a good one. One make series, cheap speedo ( what's the cheapest brushless set up ? ) and a basic chassis, I'd like to do that myself just for the cheapness. Nothing wrong with setting up your own 'Clio cup', if your local shop sells a cheap RTR buggy then make that the car to use, it doesn't matter how basic it is as long as it's relatively cheap and everyone in the class uses it.
Why does it need to be brushless? For beginners there's nothing wrong with the kit 540 motors when the intention is to get round the track rather than the typical buggy setup which appears to be as much power as possible that can only be used on the main straight and then try and control it round the rest of the track.

I've been looking around and a lot of people you ask advice from seem to just bang on about how much they've spent as opposed to telling you how you can start cheaply.I've got a good example of this. Some newbie racers came to my club, they had 20 year old Tamiya TA02 tourers with the kit motors in them. They first visited Phoenix Raceway, only to be told by the racers there they needed the latest spec cars and top spec motors, ESCs and batteries and had to spend £800 on their top spec cars before they started. They didn't go back there and Phoenix eventually closed due to older members moving on and no new racers coming in to replace them.
They came to Stockport and were told what they already had was good enough to get them going. The next week they turned up with what they had, and as they didn't have a fast charger the other racers charged their batteries for them. They ran in with other novices with their basic cars and kept on coming racing after that.

terry.sc
03-04-2012, 01:07 AM
There are two points that have to be addressed to get more kids into the hobby. We are always going to be competing with video games, something we never had during r/c cars heyday in the 80s.

First you've got to get them to know about r/c racing in the first place. Not easy to do, but having spent last weekend hiring r/c cars out at a local classic car show there is plenty of interest from kids wanting to have a go. To me that is the hardest part, getting them to the club in the first place. Once they have seen what racing is all about and that most importantly club racing is fun and not serious then they usually want to start up with whatever they have.

Once you've got them interested you've then got to do everything to get them racing, just getting them running in the first place with whatever they have is a start, whether they are slow or not BRCA legal is irrelevant.
We always run a novice heat with everything that isn't fast enough to run with the others all mixed together, the last thing you want is some idiot who isn't capable of avoiding a car in front of him shouting because the kid he just crashed into isn't going as fast as the others.
Then help the kids and treat them the same as your adult mates. Don't hang around in your own little clique but get to know the kids and help them out. Charge their batteries, help them sort out their handling problems, give them spare parts when they break their cars. All gets them involved with the club and keeps them coming back. Finally if anyone doesn't respect the kids tell them to go race somewhere else.

We keep things fun and just like Bury the number one priority is enjoying yourself, not race results. Amazingly we also have plenty of kids who race regularly. Show them a club made up of serious hard racers with high end cars and they won't be coming back.

sosidge
03-04-2012, 07:27 AM
Some good stuff already in this thread.

At our local club (Chippenham - www.cmcc.org.uk (http://www.cmcc.org.uk)) we happen to have a lot of juniors coming in to the club at the moment. We must be doing something right, and it is things that all clubs should be doing.



We have a club car (Tamiya TT-01) that has a junior using it most weeks, and a few of those juniors have gone on to buy their own cars
We don't go around telling people they need the best of everything to compete. In fact we mostly suggest a TT-01, Schumacher Mi1 or Tamiya Mini for people to get started with.
We suggest the £10 Saturn 20 motor for newcomers to touring and it is also our spec motor in Minis - on our small club track, the Saturn 20 is barely any slower than the 13.5 "blinky" cars, so the low-budget racers don't get the impression that they need to upgrade to the fastest of everything to compete
We have just been at the South West Model Show where we put on a racing demonstration (which usually gets a few spectators). This year some club members donated their old Minis for "Have-a-go" sessions which had a HUGE amount of interest, mostly from younger drivers, I'll wager there were 40 or 50 people having a go on the Sunday.
We have the support of a local shop (MMR (http://www.mmrflux.co.uk)) who are trackside most weeks.
The more juniors we get, the more word-of-mouth they spread - quite a few of them have brought their friends along, and then their friends have started racing as well. We also have a few father-and-son racers. Mothers and daughters are also welcome!

It may seem like hard work for clubs to attract members, and it may seem like there are no rewards at times, but basically you need to keep plugging away.



Keep a cheap/simple class of racing on the rulebook. Avoid elitism.
Have a club car at the track every week. I've seen club cars mysteriously become "personal" cars after they haven't been used for a while - don't let that happen.
Promote the club. Get on the web, get posters in the shops, get out to the local shows, get in the press. If people don't know about you, they will never come.

If anything it is easier to encourage new racers in off-road right now. There are a lot more electric off-roaders available for reasonable money, and a lot of the intimidatingly expensive "pit-bling" that you would see at a TC meeting is unnecessary. A new racer with a B4.1 RTR or a short-course RTR is only a set of tyres and springs away from having a car quick enough for the sharp-end of the club A-final (actually that is more or less the case with on-road too, but it doesn't look like that when everyone is running tyre warmers and has their laptop on the table).


It's tough to sell RC to a generation that is used to computer games. RC is much harder to master, but the satisfaction of doing well is so much greater. It's a real-life hobby, only constrained by your own talents, not by the programmer's code.

swappyd
03-04-2012, 08:10 AM
Reading through I can see that there are two problems:
Cost.
20+ years ago when I raced at Harrogate buggy club I really enjoyed it until it became very much a cost thing. pushy parents and kids wanting the latest motors batteries and they took over! So I jacked it in and discovered Beer, girls and big cars!

So a cost class would be good not just for the next generation.
maybe a max cost for chassis, batteries etc. like the old stock brushed motor class!

Tollerence.
some people forget that this is a hobby and we do it for fun!
Everybody started somewhere, crashing, been slow!
People need to remember that! yes it is racing but it is not the money driven uber competative world of F1!
If you want that racing do the Regionals or Nats.

If people show poor sportsmanship on or off the track drop their best laps and they will soon learn!

Soap box rant over!

df-03
03-04-2012, 09:16 AM
i think there is a lot of young drivers but this "facebook" generation is more into drift class today,they do not wanna to wait for spring and summer like we with buggys to race, that sort of bling bling cars are for them, like NFS that they are play when they are not racing :). Hiere where i am living it is a Fire Station where they are alowed to race whole year, also there is not top speeds or jumps where they could brake cars and that is the way is interesting so much to them.

Si Coe
03-04-2012, 09:24 AM
As Terry says the cost bit tends to be exaggerated badly. I always made a point of explaining to new drivers at Bury that I was running a 20 year old RC10 kitted out with a brushless system off ebay - whilst mine is never the fastest there its far from the slowest either. Bury sees plenty of ex-racers coming back with their old cars - we had a meeting last year with 4 generations of RC10 in the same heat!

I really do believe that at most clubs if the best driver ran an out of the box B4.1 RTR they would win. Whilst it doesn't have a sensored esc, the motor is around a 10.5t, the shocks aren't the latest spec etc its actually quite good enough. Unsurprisingly the majority of our new drivers (of all ages) have one.

One thing racers could consider is keeping old but decent gear to sell cheap to new drivers. I sold my old Cat'98 to a lad that turned up with an HPI Brama for £40 - it was old and a bit worn out but still more reliable and competitive than the Brama. In addition I made sure it was set up for our track.

This is why I'm against cost controlled spec classes - ebay and some old gear makes for a better, more enjoyable racer than a 540 equipped out of the box Mad Rat and for less. What is needed is education not restriction!

Si Coe
03-04-2012, 09:31 AM
i think there is a lot of young drivers but this "facebook" generation is more into drift class today,they do not wanna to wait for spring and summer like we with buggys to race, that sort of bling bling cars are for them, like NFS that they are play when they are not racing :). Hiere where i am living it is a Fire Station where they are alowed to race whole year, also there is not top speeds or jumps where they could brake cars and that is the way is interesting so much to them.

Very true. I'm a teacher and my RC's have been into school. Whenever they do, the students love them and want their own. Several have bought them but without exception they all want to drift not race.

VincentVisser
03-04-2012, 09:42 AM
I think the cost thing is a bit of a given... to run a car costs money...

The annsmann brushed version was going for £100 all included at modelsport the last time I checked. and the XTC Edge I think they called where £80 all in. I would not go brushless simply because they are way to fast for some kids and you want to keep the costs down.

Yes they dont last as long I get that but thats not the point.

The point is to make them the same speed and kit like the above where its cheap to buy and spares are cheap so your costs are down. Its to get kids involved into it and get them to a club meeting. If you have a young drivers club race where all the drivers are young then you will not have the parents complaining about it unless you have to marshall for them (owww my ancles )

The playstaion generation or Facebook generation kids just need to have 1 race with the car against other kids there own age and my god they will love it. Plus there is a massive thing now where kids dont know how to talk to people outside facebook and so on so they actually meet kids there own age and doing the same thing outside and out of there homes.

When I went into modelsport yestersday there was a guy there that bought a rc car RTR for his I would guess about 7 year old daughter. He spent £100. The thing that struck me was the guy behind the counter. He never asked the guy what is it being used for and if she would want to race the car. Its was not a RTR that you would use in touring or nitro or 1/10th at all so technically if she wanted to take it to the next lvl and join a club they would not have the correct kit to start off with and would have waisted the £100 spent.

Its tuff cause we all have diffrent views on this but I wolud say to keep it simple.

Same car (not TA or Lossi £250 is not cheap when you strating a hobby)
Young driver heats at club lvl
Clubs going to school and introducing this to kids to show them its still around and just as much fun. (ultirnative to PS3 Xbox 360)

It will just die out if we dont actually do something about it and it will be one of those..."when I was young you could go racing these cars around a track with friends and have so much fun...agh that was them days"

df-03
03-04-2012, 10:01 AM
yes, even if they are not racing well they own one just to show, it is more interesting to them and that is the fact. Few times i hade thinking to get one for my self, cause they are racing whole year and every night there is always 20 of them, we, with buggys must wait nice wheater and we are happy if there is more then 4 of us to race. I must also input like one mate already say, sometimes there are few dad's that sons are racing but if that kids are not racing well dad's are making problems, they are fight, they are yelling at kids etc. , and that is not good. we are all hiere for fun. That is not a place for frustated unsuccessful persons when they wase young and now they are pushing kids like there is fight for death or life

Si Coe
03-04-2012, 10:35 AM
Ahh but Vincent - you missed my point and hit it at the same time! At Bury that girls car would be allowed to race (provided it wasn't nitro and could get round the track) so she wouldn't need a different car to start racing.

New racers find out of about the sport 1 of 2 ways - before they buy a car (and thats what makes them buy one) or after when they wonder what they can do with it. There are as many afters as befores. Making them buy a new car to compete in a restricted class even if it is cheap is a lot of extra expensive when they already have a car. We just let them race together. Yes, there have been times our Fun class has had an out of the box FTX Carnage (brushed) truck alongside a Durango DEX210 but when both hit every single corner who cares?
Why was there a 210 in fun class? Because the lad in question had started last year with something less competitive and got the 210 as a Christmas present. He's got too good with it, so now he's in regular 2wd but it was his performance that moved him, not the car.
Keeping it simple means anything goes as far as I'm concerned. When the kids can't control the cars it soon becomes clear that the fastest rarely wins you don't need a new motor etc. But if you get good enough to handle it why not?

Si Coe
03-04-2012, 10:42 AM
Parents are a problem. On the whole, the ones I've met at Bury and Stockport have been great, but I also remember from racing as a kid myself the angry pit dad's. You get pushy parents in all sports to be honest but in RC younger drivers often need them there to pit and marshal for them so they can't be pushed to the sidelines as the junior footie team does!
So far we've not had much trouble there was just one incident last year where a marshal fed up of being rammed every lap by the same truck chucked it off the track not really knowing how young its driver was. People hate marshalling for them and hate being marshalled by them even more but thats about the biggest issue to date.

df-03
03-04-2012, 11:06 AM
yes, i just wanna to say that parents are also one of the problems that kids are not racing today, Children today are more nervous than we were and if you are yelling they would be quick cooled from that hobby.

Sportp4ck
03-04-2012, 11:19 AM
There are two points that have to be addressed to get more kids into the hobby. We are always going to be competing with video games, something we never had during r/c cars heyday in the 80s.

First you've got to get them to know about r/c racing in the first place. Not easy to do, but having spent last weekend hiring r/c cars out at a local classic car show there is plenty of interest from kids wanting to have a go. To me that is the hardest part, getting them to the club in the first place. Once they have seen what racing is all about and that most importantly club racing is fun and not serious then they usually want to start up with whatever they have.

Once you've got them interested you've then got to do everything to get them racing, just getting them running in the first place with whatever they have is a start, whether they are slow or not BRCA legal is irrelevant.
We always run a novice heat with everything that isn't fast enough to run with the others all mixed together, the last thing you want is some idiot who isn't capable of avoiding a car in front of him shouting because the kid he just crashed into isn't going as fast as the others.
Then help the kids and treat them the same as your adult mates. Don't hang around in your own little clique but get to know the kids and help them out. Charge their batteries, help them sort out their handling problems, give them spare parts when they break their cars. All gets them involved with the club and keeps them coming back. Finally if anyone doesn't respect the kids tell them to go race somewhere else.

We keep things fun and just like Bury the number one priority is enjoying yourself, not race results. Amazingly we also have plenty of kids who race regularly. Show them a club made up of serious hard racers with high end cars and they won't be coming back.

Im 15 years old and always wanted to race I have a few rcs about 8 scx10, sprint2 etc etc, So I got a saturday job £35 every weekend valeting high performace cars, like swindon towns fc cars and other very expensise cars it not easy, 7am to 5pm. I buy abit every weekend like the tyre warmers one weekend then the set up board trailing for second hand deals including the car , Dad has snap on account so thats the tools covered:thumbsup:. Its just got soo expensize these days guuna have to miss the first and second race, Because I ve just found out the local club Cotswold, Don`t do transponder hire so that will be another thing to get!

Sportp4ck
03-04-2012, 11:22 AM
I race a HB cyclone wce I sometimes look at it and think its never ending transponder £55, 7.4 servo £75 tyres £20 etc etc thats why people arnt taking part well I cant for the first few,My mate went to go and race his hb lighting pro buggy at the local, and he was going to need £500 for the equiment for a year, then its the engine and car isnt up to the lastest model so he just pulled out of it thats why im wondering now is hb cyclone moore speed going to be competive, though is it down to your driving.

sosidge
03-04-2012, 11:45 AM
Im 15 years old and always wanted to race I have a few rcs about 8 scx10, sprint2 etc etc, So I got a saturday job £35 every weekend valeting high performace cars, like swindon towns fc cars and other very expensise cars it not easy, 7am to 5pm. I buy abit every weekend like the tyre warmers one weekend then the set up board trailing for second hand deals including the car , Dad has snap on account so thats the tools covered:thumbsup:. Its just got soo expensize these days guuna have to miss the first and second race, Because I ve just found out the local club Cotswold, Don`t do transponder hire so that will be another thing to get!

The thing is, you don't need those things to race.

Tyre warmers and set-up boards are a long-way down the list (actually a flat board is useful but it doesn't have to have an RC manufacturers name pasted on it). This is a big problem in on-road, people see these things in the pits and assume they need them. You don't.

All you need is a well-built car (it doesn't have to be an expensive one), the right motor for the class, and the right tyres for the track.

If you have spent the pocket-money you should have been using for racing on the "bling", then that is a terrible waste. Much better to be at the track than scouring eBay for stuff you don't actually need.

I race at Cotswold fairly regularly, and until now I haven't used tyre warmers. I put my 4-year-old car in the A-final of the BTCC in 13.5 last year, which is a pretty competitive field. I used one set of tyres for the whole outdoor season last year (half-a-dozen race meetings), one LiPo (which lasted me 2-and-a-half years before giving up) and the same 13.5 motor (which is still going strong after nearly 3 years).

RC racing does not have to be expensive. This is the message we need to try hard to get across - the "bling" is a personal preference, it doesn't actually make that much difference to your laptimes.

PS I didn't realise that Cotswold didn't have any "club" transponders. That is a shame, but I am sure they will still allow you to race.

Sportp4ck
03-04-2012, 11:49 AM
The thing is, you don't need those things to race.

Tyre warmers and set-up boards are a long-way down the list (actually a flat board is useful but it doesn't have to have an RC manufacturers name pasted on it). This is a big problem in on-road, people see these things in the pits and assume they need them. You don't.

All you need is a well-built car (it doesn't have to be an expensive one), the right motor for the class, and the right tyres for the track.

If you have spent the pocket-money you should have been using for racing on the "bling", then that is a terrible waste. Much better to be at the track than scouring eBay for stuff you don't actually need.

I race at Cotswold fairly regularly, and until now I haven't used tyre warmers. I put my 4-year-old car in the A-final of the BTCC in 13.5 last year, which is a pretty competitive field. I used one set of tyres for the whole outdoor season last year (half-a-dozen race meetings), one LiPo (which lasted me 2-and-a-half years before giving up) and the same 13.5 motor (which is still going strong after nearly 3 years).

RC racing does not have to be expensive. This is the message we need to try hard to get across - the "bling" is a personal preference, it doesn't actually make that much difference to your laptimes.

PS I didn't realise that Cotswold didn't have any "club" transponders. That is a shame, but I am sure they will still allow you to race.

All I neeed for my car now is a 13.5 and a decent servo Thanks for that I under stand were you are coming from. Louis PS tyre warmers were £10.50 off eBay and the set up board it just abit of mdf.

Si Coe
03-04-2012, 12:22 PM
Club transponders are a bit of a problem as they are very expensive and no longer made. Some clubs use MRTs but they need plugging in so not as useful as the old self powered ones.

westyguesty
03-04-2012, 12:36 PM
Transponders shouldn't stop kids racing, pen and paper would do if needed, they don't get any benefit from them. A few sets of wheels and tyres would be more important and fun for them, something to easy for them to change if they want to.

VincentVisser
03-04-2012, 12:37 PM
Ahh but Vincent - you missed my point and hit it at the same time! At Bury that girls car would be allowed to race (provided it wasn't nitro and could get round the track) so she wouldn't need a different car to start racing.

New racers find out of about the sport 1 of 2 ways - before they buy a car (and thats what makes them buy one) or after when they wonder what they can do with it. There are as many afters as befores. Making them buy a new car to compete in a restricted class even if it is cheap is a lot of extra expensive when they already have a car. We just let them race together. Yes, there have been times our Fun class has had an out of the box FTX Carnage (brushed) truck alongside a Durango DEX210 but when both hit every single corner who cares?
Why was there a 210 in fun class? Because the lad in question had started last year with something less competitive and got the 210 as a Christmas present. He's got too good with it, so now he's in regular 2wd but it was his performance that moved him, not the car.
Keeping it simple means anything goes as far as I'm concerned. When the kids can't control the cars it soon becomes clear that the fastest rarely wins you don't need a new motor etc. But if you get good enough to handle it why not?

Haha This sounds like a funny scene to watch.. you will need to film a race and put on youtube.

I did understand your post.

I think having a set RTR car that you use will just help giving advice when they buy there own as people there will know how to fix them plus will most likely have spares if something goes wrong. (cars are modelled on the B4 anyway.)

It could be where maybe the club gets 6-10 companies to sponser a car for £100 or £150 with company colour on or something. Plus you might get your companie advertised on the club website as a sponser.

I dont know any company that cant afford £150 pounds for the car. Its not a massive sum to ask plus they giving to kids having fun and that is good Press for them in there Local paper "Compnay giving back to the kids of tomorow". So technically the club has no outgoings but might get more members which in turn creates more revenue. (im in marketing sorry)

I dont know how clubs run there finances unfortunatley but getting the cars sponsered to the club to get kids involved would be ideal.

I dont understand why our local club does no racing at all during school holidays? Is this not the time that kids are bored and have nothing to do?
The school halls are not used. Setup the track for a day or two and let the kids come and try it out.

Skelbo
03-04-2012, 12:47 PM
It is slightly chicken and egg.

Budget wise you can get a kid up and running fairly cheaply, eBay alone is something we have now which wasnt an option back in the early 90s so deals are out there. But partly it is down to club availability.

My son Ben (7) and I are lucky to have SHRCCC (led by Dudders) as our local club and having a specific junior heat and finalse means that we have every incentive to head down there. Ben absolutely loves it and I'm allowed to race by the Mrs because he can!

Build it and they will come, as they say.

Moss Models
03-04-2012, 03:40 PM
Good post this, thanks Vince.

I was the dad mentioned in the begining. My eldest son was in the 4wd class at the Spring Cup. He is only 9 but pretty handy. The main problem being he is just so unaware of the cars around him. He is concentrating 100% on his driving and not on any car coming to lap him. The guys lapping him were A finalists so should know better. However shouting abuse at a 9 year old is not really on. I do understand that its frustrating to get taken out/held up but hey its only fun right? I make a point of trying to educate him with driving etiquette and it will come with time but we shouldn't put them off.

The lack of kids racing is a big problem and I do think it is something we all need to address.

Spring Cup (which was very well run) was the same price to enter for adults and children???

Isaac Peel
03-04-2012, 03:50 PM
I'm 14 years old I started racing at Christmas with an Ftx Carnage at Southport, but I waited until I could go as fast as the car would allow and then I bought a B4 of another club member for £ 145. Since then I have got a paper round to pay for all the things I need. I get paid £15 a week so overall I still have money to get other things that I want.

hotrodchris
03-04-2012, 04:15 PM
Personally i point parents looking to bring young kids to the club that are looking to upgrade the electrics in their rtr cars towards something like the inix combo's at £60 delivered with program card and most turn motors catered for they are a bargain and can be competitive as well!

eyeayen
03-04-2012, 05:30 PM
My eldest son is only 9 but pretty handy. The main problem being he is just so unaware of the cars around him. He is concentrating 100% on his driving and not on any car coming to lap him. The guys lapping him were A finalists so should know better. However shouting abuse at a 9 year old is not really on. I do understand that its frustrating to get taken out/held up but hey its only fun right? I make a point of trying to educate him with driving etiquette and it will come with time but we shouldn't put them off.

I've seen this myself and also had it myself when I borrowed a mates car that was an absolute dog ( tamiya mini - battery fell out on corners and everything :wtf: ), some bloke got a right cob on when I didn't move over quick enough for him. I went straight over and apologised for upsetting his lap as soon as the race was over. He wasn't interested ( I'm 38, not a young kid ), it was his attitude. The thing is if they're 'that' good and can see you're coming up on a slower driver they should allow for that and pass him in an appropriate place, there are plenty of opportunities to go around someone rather than through them ! I hope it hasn't put your son off. These people seem to be above this though and forget we all have to start some where. New blood should be encouraged into the sport whatever it takes, so if you get taken off or are a lap down at the end of it maybe better to go and give the person some encouragement and some hints and tips rather than putting them down. It took the guy who got arsey with me at the start of the evening all night to come over and say he was just caught up in the moment of the race but he did at least bother, just before I went home...

This is a great thread, I hope shops and clubs are going to take note of it.

Skelbo
03-04-2012, 06:50 PM
Good point made above. Good drivers should be able to anticipate those with lesser ability,especially youngsters, and there is no excuse for shouting at them. Same goes for shouting at marshalls.

You dont see Bloomfield and Martin a) crashing into backmarkers-they just sail past on a tight racing line and b) abusing marshalls. Top guys are intelligent enough to remember that they were beginners once and that errors happen.

hotrodchris
03-04-2012, 07:36 PM
I agree with the majority of what has been said in this thread and truly believe that the future of this sport / hobby is bringing more youth in, but i can also understand the frustration element as we are all competative or would not do this, sometimes with junior drivers they are attracted by the other cars passing them so steer towards them not deliberately but a natural act that if you look at something else then you aim towards that point!

Let the debate continue?

And yes there is a difference to shouting to get a marshalls attention and abuse, the first not ideal but is it acceptable?
The second tottally unaceptable!!!!!!!!!

mattr
03-04-2012, 08:11 PM
Shouting abuse at anyone at the club i used to go to (20+ years ago) got you penalised. Can't remember how much. But it was enough that no-one did it twice.

And i can't believe all these people banging on about the cost of the cars.

The costs are almost the same as they were 20+ years ago, for top level kit, £200 gets you into the beginnings of the top end "world class" rolling chassis range, almost the same as it was in 1985, maybe £25 or so more, which compared to inflation and wage increases, is negligible.

The only two things that have changed is (1) the cost of the ESCs, but then, you only need one motor, and a couple of batteries. Instead of half a dozen of each. I reckon you could get an A final-able set-up for somewhere around a half of the cost you'd need when i last raced. The difference being mostly in motors and batteries! (still, many people spend a whole load more!)

The second thing that's changed (2) is the quality of the RTR cars. To be frank, the bottom end ones we could get back then, were dire compared to what you can get now, take the grasshopper, hornet and the frog, and compare to things like the mad rat, FTX and others, all the way up to something like the B4.1.

BTW, our club seems to have plenty of kids in it. Some of them are pretty handy............

fencer39
03-04-2012, 08:51 PM
Isnt there a governing body?.....the BRCA... what they doing to promote the sport ?

jimdaloo
03-04-2012, 09:02 PM
Very interesting reading everybodys comments.
My personal opinion on it is that I dont think its the kids that wouldnt want to do it or the fact that it is quite expensive or the kids getting put off by loud mouths at the clubs (in my experience these days kids give as good as they get if not worse) , I think in general its the lazy arse parents, these days they just dont want to invest the time in there children which is a real shame as that for me is the reason you have kids.
My son races in most of the off road classes and at the club we belong to Herts Nitro there is a healthy number of youngsters . I think its a generation thing.

lardy37
03-04-2012, 09:04 PM
i notice alot of people keep mentioning cost and xbox but dont xbox and ps games cost about £50 each with a new game coming out every other month i aint no maths genius but 4 games you can get a good car that will last a lot longer than the game, :p

Jamesk
03-04-2012, 09:06 PM
This Sunday at HRCCC had two rounds all for youngsters of both sex's. I think it's a lot to do with the feeling of the clubs, I've been to Stotfold last year and there was a young chap who needed help and non of the top guys would lend a hand or advice on his B44, that left a bad taste to me and we fixed it in the end.
At our club we will talk to them and make sure they know that we can help fix, set up and just help what ever they drive. I know it's easy to think your there to help but do you offer help. When I started in the 1980's it was more about fun and the overall atmosphere was of fun, now it's very competive and that can be a problem at an early stage as there is little conferdance at first.
It's down to EVERYONE to make a good impression plus help out too.

jK

rondoolaa
03-04-2012, 09:54 PM
well i got 2 sons one 14 and one 12 the 14yr old not interested in any thing but xbox but the 12yr old loves racing and actually beats me most of the time, he races micro,tc and now going to do 10th buggys allthough it can be pricey he only has one new car an MI1 tc as a christmas present the others are all my old cars, as most will know we all want the newest car out so instead of selling them cheap just give them to your kids, also trccc dont charge a race fee for juniors so if they brake something every other meeting it dont matter as you saved on race fees so maybe more clubs should do free entry for juniors it might help :thumbsup:

agree with the above,

i also race at the same club and i know its not 10th but 18th / 16th / 14th but the question was where have all the young drivers gone, and we have around 7 - 9 drivers there between the ages of 7 and 15 all with either lrp sharks or losi mini 8ights, maybe thats where they have all gone, over to micro..

matthew
03-04-2012, 10:32 PM
This Sunday at HRCCC had two rounds all for youngsters of both sex's. I think it's a lot to do with the feeling of the clubs, I've been to Stotfold last year and there was a young chap who needed help and non of the top guys would lend a hand or advice on his B44, that left a bad taste to me and we fixed it in the end.
At our club we will talk to them and make sure they know that we can help fix, set up and just help what ever they drive. I know it's easy to think your there to help but do you offer help. When I started in the 1980's it was more about fun and the overall atmosphere was of fun, now it's very competive and that can be a problem at an early stage as there is little conferdance at first.
It's down to EVERYONE to make a good impression plus help out too.

jK

I agree 100%, people should be made to feel welcome and not ignored, I think things should change because there are many people that try this hobbie out and give up because of this.

terry.sc
03-04-2012, 11:52 PM
When I went into modelsport yestersday there was a guy there that bought a rc car RTR for his I would guess about 7 year old daughter. He spent £100. The thing that struck me was the guy behind the counter. He never asked the guy what is it being used for and if she would want to race the car. Its was not a RTR that you would use in touring or nitro or 1/10th at all so technically if she wanted to take it to the next lvl and join a club they would not have the correct kit to start off with and would have waisted the £100 spentI would have to agree with Si, they have a car and so they do have the correct kit to start racing and haven't wasted any money. It's not as if they are going to be challenging for wins or planning on running at the nationals. You let them run and when they start managing to get around without hitting anything they usually then start looking at more appropriate cars and equipment, quite often second hand equipment from the top racers who now know them and give them a good deal.

We also have a member with a spare car or two, a basic car with a limited top speed that is lent on the night for a race or two to people who are interested, it usually gets them hooked and they go looking for a car themselves. Being an on road club the cars lent out are basic TT01s with an EZRun brushless running on a cheap 4 cell nimh pack. The slow speed makes them so easy to drive and having tested it at the track we can get 30 minutes running out of one battery charge.

Getting the shop to push particular cars onto customers isn't going to increase the new racers, it's just going to push them away from thinking about racing if they know they have to buy a different car to what they want to buy. It's only around 1 in every 50 drivers that even have a go at racing and I would be very surprised if any newbie buying a non racing car would even know about racing, what's more important for local clubs is whether there are posters or leaflets advertising them in the model shops.

terry.sc
03-04-2012, 11:53 PM
Good post this, thanks Vince.

I was the dad mentioned in the begining. My eldest son was in the 4wd class at the Spring Cup. He is only 9 but pretty handy. The main problem being he is just so unaware of the cars around him. He is concentrating 100% on his driving and not on any car coming to lap him. The guys lapping him were A finalists so should know better. However shouting abuse at a 9 year old is not really on. I do understand that its frustrating to get taken out/held up but hey its only fun right? I make a point of trying to educate him with driving etiquette and it will come with time but we shouldn't put them off.

The lack of kids racing is a big problem and I do think it is something we all need to address.

Spring Cup (which was very well run) was the same price to enter for adults and children???
Unless your son is capable of qualifying for the A finals himself I would question why he was put in the same heat. If the drivers lapping were A finalists I would also question their driving ability if they can't see a slower car in front of them and drive round it.

At my club we have one lad who, like your son, can get around quick enough to be moved out of the novice heat but can just about handle getting round the track. I put him in the same heat I run in. First race trying to lap him usually ended up with my car being hit. Took me that one race to learn how he drives round the track and after that I knew how to pass him as I learnt where he ran wide.
Working out the problem was much more mature than shouting at a child because he doesn't jump out of your way.

The one thing I've noticed is that there seems to be two types of club. There is one type that takes their racing seriously, organises club championships and concentrates on the racing, and this tends to kill off the 'club' aspect of club meetings. The other type, which seems to be most clubs in this thread, are those that don't take club meetings seriously and go out of their way to help the kids just by the nature of the drivers there. Guess which type will be around in years to come due to getting a regular supply of new drivers.

As for those who don't see new drivers, are you actually doing something to attract them to your club and letting potential members know you exist.

terry.sc
04-04-2012, 12:12 AM
Isnt there a governing body?.....the BRCA... what they doing to promote the sport ?
Members of the BRCA were running demo events at the Autosport show, running demos at Gadget Show Live, were running demos at the South west Model Show and many others, and this particular BRCA member spent the whole of the weekend before last promoting the hobby at the Eventcity Classic Car Show.

The BRCA also produces a DVD to encourage the bashers to try racing, and gives advice to clubs to help them promote themselves. "The BRCA" isn't some great overseeing organisation, the committee members are just fellow racers like you and me who have volunteered to do some of the tasks needed to run the organisation. Considering just about everyone racing should be a member of the BRCA, then your question really is what are you doing to promote the sport.

VincentVisser
05-04-2012, 08:19 AM
"The BRCA" isn't some great overseeing organisation, the committee members are just fellow racers like you and me who have volunteered to do some of the tasks needed to run the organisation. Considering just about everyone racing should be a member of the BRCA, then your question really is what are you doing to promote the sport.

I agree and understand your point here but as the BRCA this is a very Government Body type of response.

You (committee members) create the rule book
You (committee members) create the regional events
You (committee members) set the rules for the clubs to follow.

Instead of pointing the finger and saying the above which is such a "it's not us its you response" you could have looked at it and said these are valid points and as the BRCA we could maybe look into making some changes to the rule book to try and see if we can force clubs to have young driver heats. (I think some clubs might be shocked to only see 1 or 2 people standing there on the rostrum)
We can also look at regional or competition events to have under 13 heats instead of having everybody of all ages in the same heats. We could also have a look at regionalís or competitions where under 13 do not pay entrance fees. You could be doing allot more than "your question really is what are you doing to promote the sport."

This is where the problem is. We need to look at clubs as to what you/they do and what can be imroved to try and get more young drivers involved.

I can honestly say I have not been to any of those shows before you mentioned and I am not planning to go because they are pricey so would have not found out about racing rc cars unless I met someone that did it and introduced it to me. (This is where we come in...promote what we do more...I am doing this on a regular bases)

We need the info structure in place to make the under 13 kids injoy it when they come to a club and to a regional event and unfortunately it is not up to the normal racer but up to the BRCA to put rules in place so that clubs and race event organisers take action. (Some clubs refuse to change because the BRCA Book they follow does not state that they have to do so.

Iím not going off on you here as a individual person and sorry if it feels that way because letís be honest you trying to promote and I take my hat off to you. Itís more to the BRCA in general.

I could be wrong and if I am then I say sorry now as I donít know how all clubs run themselves and is only a suggestion.

sosidge
05-04-2012, 08:47 AM
Quite right on the typical BRCA response!

If something is a great success... the individuals that represent the BRCA are to be praised. They give up so much of their time etc. etc.

If something is a failure... it's the BRCA membership as a whole that are to be blamed. You vote on the rules etc. etc.

Si Coe
05-04-2012, 08:47 AM
The BRCA can't force clubs to do anything. Clubs don't even need to be part of the BRCA.

It does make sense however to have a junior regional champion for example. I don't imagine this would involve a separate heat at regionals but might encourage younger drivers to higher levels.

Clubs can help promote racing by hosting meetings at major events, but so far I think the thing thats been lacking there is support from model shops. For example, Southport hold a meeting annually at the Woodvale Rally which attracts big crowds. The event is an RC airshow and by the runway there are loads of stalls selling planes etc but over by the track nobody is selling anything.

What is needed is clubs and shops to work to promote together. Hold a meeting, show people what these cars can do, but also have a stall full of Madrats and B4.1RTR's to sell.

VincentVisser
05-04-2012, 12:31 PM
It does make sense however to have a junior regional champion for example. I don't imagine this would involve a separate heat at regionals but might encourage younger drivers to higher levels.


I do think it needs to be separate as its more fun for them to have people their own age stand next to them. I think sometimes racing against a adult might feel a bit of a intimidating and this is just because they might have been sworn at or told off before at club lvl or at other events.

Kids should race kids. They have more fun that way. + you donít have the adults getting angered at them. You might just get the over supported father shouting from the sideline but thatís normal in every sport. :)

Jamesk
05-04-2012, 02:54 PM
What is stopping us running at school's when they have summer fete's are on either as a meeting or demo runs and try and get a few shops involved or importers like CML or JE Spare's etc. They all have good RTR's on sale and a few demo's with them could work for all.
When i worked at a model shop in Harrow many years ago we did demo's in schools,shopping centers and the response was very good and we found a lot of new members for the local clubs.

jK

jcb
05-04-2012, 06:31 PM
At Norfolk Buggy Club we have since Christmas now got 6 under 16's all racing 10th off road. All of them have an Ansmann 2wd which is seeming to be a good bit of kit for the new comers that they are. It seems that parts are cheap and easily available, with a decent number of options to make it competitive as ability and funds improve.
They all seem to be enjoying their racing, which I think partly comes about as they are all in one heat together and all have pretty much the same equipment which is making them very competitive. It's also good that it's turning into a family day out with brothers, sisters and Mum coming along for the day which I think helps a lot.

There are far too many options out there for kids from computers, sport, social clubs etc etc to do and model car racing also involves a lot of parent support in helping maintain the car away from the race meeting and more importantly supplying the transport and funds to get them out racing every other week.

I also think a lot comes down to how the club and model shops portray themselves, model car racing needs to be seen as fun and enjoyable for the kid and affordable for the parent who is most likely going to be funding it. I would think at some of the larger clubs I have raced at it's quite a daunting feeling for young lad or lass to turn up with Dad in toe, to see the masses of equipment that the majority of seasoned racers carry. I also feel that some of the youngsters I have seen come and go in the past want to be good straight away and don't have the will to persist and practice, which is eventually what makes you good at RC Racing.

terry.sc
08-04-2012, 11:38 PM
I agree and understand your point here but as the BRCA this is a very Government Body type of response.

You (committee members) create the rule book
You (committee members) create the regional events
You (committee members) set the rules for the clubs to follow.

Instead of pointing the finger and saying the above which is such a "it's not us its you response" you could have looked at it and said these are valid points and as the BRCA we could maybe look into making some changes to the rule book to try and see if we can force clubs to have young driver heats. (I think some clubs might be shocked to only see 1 or 2 people standing there on the rostrum)
I would just like to point out I have no connection with the BRCA committees, I am just an ordinary member like the majority of us here. I have no connection with the running of it at all, but I do know how it is run. I am only a BRCA member because I sometimes race at clubs that require BRCA membership and the insurance cover is useful.

My own club is not BRCA affiliated either.

The rule book is created by the ordinary racers, at the AGM they propose rules and rule changes, and then vote on whether to change the rules or not. The committee can't create any rules without the membership voting them in.

The regional events are created by the ordinary racers, they put in the proposal for them then it is down to the regional reps and the clubs to organise. So for the North east that's Kash Khan and the North east clubs to sort out, not any "BRCA committee" imposing their will.

No one sets rules for the clubs to follow. The ordinary racers create the rules for BRCA sanctioned meetings such as the nationals and regionals. whether a club follows some or all of the rules is entirely down to the clubs themselves. If the club is full of narrow minded pedants who insist on sticking to the BRCA rules over what is better for the club then that is down to them.


We can also look at regional or competition events to have under 13 heats instead of having everybody of all ages in the same heats. We could also have a look at regionalís or competitions where under 13 do not pay entrance fees. You could be doing allot more than "your question really is what are you doing to promote the sport."
Great ideas, but it isn't down to the BRCA committee to impose rules or events onto the clubs, the committee only does what the members tell it to do.
As for what I'm doing, well I went out and spent 3 days of my time running demo cars, letting kids try their hand at rc cars to promote the hobby and telling them about all the local clubs not just my own. My club has around 25% of the racers being the kids you want to attract, this week we had 6 kids out of 23 racers. We also had 4 new racers, 3 newcomers and one returning from racing years ago. What more as an ordinary BRCA member, the same as you, should I be doing?

The BRCA isn't a business with a CEO or board that tells everyone what to do, it's an association and the BRCA can only do what the members of the Association want it to do. If you put in a proposal and you can convince the majority to vote for it at the AGM, then the BRCA adopts whatever changes that have been passed. If you want reduced fees for juniors at the regionals or other BRCA events then go ahead and propose it at the AGM. if you want reduced fees at club meetings that's entirely down to the clubs themselves.

Touring cars already have a 'Young Guns' junior championship, it is just a single event rather than a series but it does exist. It came about because someone wanted it to happen and actually did something about it, rather than complain that someone else didn't do it for them. You want a junior championship run by the BRCA offroad section, then propose one at the AGM and get it voted in, or just either organise it yourself or persuade someone else to organise it. There isn't any rule preventing anyone from doing it.

This is where the problem is. We need to look at clubs as to what you/they do and what can be imroved to try and get more young drivers involved.

I can honestly say I have not been to any of those shows before you mentioned and I am not planning to go because they are pricey so would have not found out about racing rc cars unless I met someone that did it and introduced it to me. (This is where we come in...promote what we do more...I am doing this on a regular bases) That's the point, it's showing r/c racing to groups of people who don't know it exists. I can also pointout that if someone else finds the £10 entry fee to the show I recently demonstrated at as pricey, then they aren't going to be buying an r/c car, especially when it can cost more than £10 in race entry fees at bigger meetings.

As has been said earlier, both Stockport and Bury clubs already attract lots of kids, and we get them to stay. The way this is done is that both clubs treat club days more of a social occasion, with everyone having fun and less serious racing. This attitude tends to scare off the committed racers who are only interested in racing, but then that's no bad thing as the serious racers are the ones that intimidate newcomers with their pit tables full of equipment and spending their time between races either working on their cars or sticking with their small clique of mates. The drivers that help keep new racers and especially newcomers coming back are the ones that between races just put their batteries on charge and go over and chat with the new faces to make them feel part of the club.

At both clubs we also put the kids together whatever they are running, and only when they are fast enough to compete with the adults move them into the most appropriate heats.


We need the info structure in place to make the under 13 kids injoy it when they come to a club and to a regional event and unfortunately it is not up to the normal racer but up to the BRCA to put rules in place so that clubs and race event organisers take action. (Some clubs refuse to change because the BRCA Book they follow does not state that they have to do so.
If you read the BRCA handbook there is nothing in there at all which tells clubs how they must be run, that is entirely down to the clubs themselves.

There are a set of rules for BRCA sanctioned races in each racing class in the handbook, but those have nothing to do with the rules clubs use. Whether the club decides to adopt those rules is down to the individual club. I do know if I had checked over all the 23 cars at my club last night there would be only 2 or 3 that are BRCA legal. If a club is going to stick resolutely to the BRCA rules then I would question the motives of the club members who have decided to run to those rules which will put off new members. What makes kids enjoy club meetings is entirely down to the attitude of the club members, if the regular racers are friendly or not depends on whether the new racers enjoy themselves or not and whether they come back again.

As I pointed out above the BRCA isn't a business, it is an association. It is up to the normal racer what the BRCA does, the BRCA won't put rules in place without the authorisation of the members, the normal racers.
A perfect example of this is the new Mardave circuit racing class. A few racers were shouting on forums about why the BRCA didn't publish any rules specifically for them and how the BRCA should be doing something about it. It was some time before someone actually contacted the appropriate BRCA section and the reply that came back was that there weren't any rules because no one had actually asked for them before. The Mardave racers then went away and wrote their own rules for the class, which then developed into the new class at the 1/12th nationals.
The point is that the class has been created because someone wanted to run it and actually went and created rules for it, rather than just moaned that 'someone' should be doing it for them.

If you think we should have a junior championship or separate junior class races at the regionals to encourage the more experienced kids, then someone put in a proposal at the AGM. If it is voted in then it becomes the BRCAs responsibility to actually run it and promote it.

terry.sc
08-04-2012, 11:49 PM
What is stopping us running at school's when they have summer fete's are on either as a meeting or demo runs and try and get a few shops involved or importers like CML or JE Spare's etc. They all have good RTR's on sale and a few demo's with them could work for all.
When i worked at a model shop in Harrow many years ago we did demo's in schools,shopping centers and the response was very good and we found a lot of new members for the local clubs.

jK
There is nothing to stop anyone doing this. If they have the space spare then school fairs and summer fetes should be happy to allow r/c cars, either as a demonstration area or even letting the kids have a go with cheap detuned cars. All it takes is someone to get out there and organise it. A few racers to demonstrate, timber, rope or hose to lay out a simple track layout and you have your demo area. A few old cars put together to let the kids try it out, charge them a pound or two for 5 minutes running to cover your costs and breakages and you will have people queuing to have a go. If you don't have spare cars and electrics try contacting shops or distributors for help in return for advertising them. A few leaflets about the club to hand out to anyone looking interested and you are doing everything you can to attract new members.

terry.sc
09-04-2012, 12:01 AM
Quite right on the typical BRCA response!

Your "typical BRCA response" has come from an ordinary club racer, someone who has no interest in national or regional racing and someone who has nothing to do with the BRCA.

Yet I still have respect and a high opinion of those volunteers who do actually spend an awful lot of their spare time helping to run the association, organise the BRCA meetings and help promote the hobby.

There are too many BRCA members who would rather sit at home and complain about decisions made by the BRCA instead of going to the AGM and taking part in the decision making themselves. Many complain about BRCA committee members yet never volunteer for the jobs themselves even though they think they could do it better.

If something is a great success... the individuals that represent the BRCA are to be praised. They give up so much of their time etc. etc.

If something is a failure... it's the BRCA membership as a whole that are to be blamed. You vote on the rules etc. etc.
Yes, the BRCA membership is "to blame" when they vote to do something that fails, in the same way the BRCA membership is also "to blame" when everything goes well.

What have "the BRCA" done that's failed in your eyes, should an individual be to blame and be removed from the committee or from an individual clubs committee if they messed up?

If someone goes out of their way to help the hobby then do you not think they should be thanked for their efforts?

stuartw
09-04-2012, 07:34 AM
Touring cars already have a 'Young Guns' junior championship, it is just a single event rather than a series but it does exist. It came about because someone wanted it to happen and actually did something about it, rather than complain that someone else didn't do it for them. You want a junior championship run by the BRCA offroad section, then propose one at the AGM and get it voted in, or just either organise it yourself or persuade someone else to organise it. There isn't any rule preventing anyone from doing it.


The Offroad section have and do organise a Junior National Championship. This has been in place since the early 90's, and is open to Under 13's & Under 16's. This years event will be held in September at Broxtowe.
Anyone who wishes to enter should contact their Regional Rep for details.

Lee24h
09-04-2012, 10:04 AM
I personally think a lack of small level sponsorship
Is missing as well i dont mean anything of large scale
But a little bit of discount here and there a t shirt and decals
Just to keep young drivers racing for a incetive to keep there
Sponsor and then gradly improve.
I personally started when i was 12 seven years ago
Now i can afford to run three cars but back then i had to
Run on a pocket money budget which of course kept me slow
And if had earnt a position i wasn't going to budge to let faster
Cars through and i think thats the problem young driver develop that
Mind set
Plus running a mission back then i had problems i just bodged them which
Ment i couldn't improve its only the the past four years that i have slowly been able to afford to fix things myself.

Tony Long
09-04-2012, 10:45 AM
I race (I am in my dads oOple account) every other week at Tipton St John club in Devon and i am the youngest there (I have just turned 13) there is only two other younger guys there that are about 15 one is realy keen (Tom on page 1 on this forum) and the other does not come very often .It is a small club but you would think there would be more younger people

I really enjoy it and I have just bright some LRP lipos and a charger for £140 and I am going to get a DEX210 soon i have been saving up for 1 1/2 years after getting my B4.1 RTR (Really good for beginners or young people) I have also sprayed my bull dog body (see picture)because it looks better and one of my mates said he would love doing spray and customization.I can only afford this because i have no Xbox and no PS3 but most of my friends do so they could not simply afford it. I try to get my mates to go but they can't see the point of paying minimum of £150 to get a chassis (like a FTX or a mad rat)to race they would much rather just get Xbox or PS3 games no doubt.
The only reason that I don't go to a bigger club is the cost of parts and tires it is just to much.Also my dad does not have the time.

I don't think that a demo would work they are just to engrossed in games.But a club car would be a reallly good idea maybe even 2 so mates can race together.

Every body down the club is very helpful .They set up my car /charger give me advise on cars and set up and give me old tires that don't have the grip for them but are fine for me. Thanks to Paul and Mark field especially!

VincentVisser
09-04-2012, 12:52 PM
I have just turned 13

I try to get my mates to go but they can't see the point of paying minimum of £150 to get a chassis (like a FTX or a mad rat)to race they would much rather just get Xbox or PS3 games no doubt.


Agh I think the point is to try and get kids under 13 involved as soon as possible. As soon as they have PS3 and XBOX360's itís even harder to get kids involved. You want kids to enjoy the racing and itís all about fun not the actual race part they enjoy. Itís more looked at as time with dad or time with friends away from home.

I do understand the PS3 and Xbox Generation. I have a PS3 and the only reason I do racing is to get away from it and this is up to parents that think PS3 is like a babysitter that you switch it on and the kids are taken care of...but when they get older itís the only thing they on and then parents donít understand why kids of today just want to be on the PS3 all the time? (Irony)

VincentVisser
09-04-2012, 01:04 PM
I would just like to point out I have no connection with the BRCA committees, I am just an ordinary member like the majority of us here. I have no connection with the running of it at all, but I do know how it is run. I am only a BRCA member because I sometimes race at clubs that require BRCA membership and the insurance cover is useful.


That’s why I said that it’s not pointed to you as a individual but rather the BRCA in general. + I stated I take my hat off to you for doing the demos and trying to promote it.

What I mean by BRCA in general is that they seem to wait for people to come up with new ideas and that’s very responsive type of thinking. Something gets brought up and then they deal with it.

This seems to be working but you would think that the BRCA must notice that young member counts are dropping. (They get the registration forms every year.) And surely they should have looked at this and gone "hold on our under 13 driver registration numbers are dropping. Maybe we should look into this?"

By reading all of the people’s comments it is clear that we all play a massive part in this.

as a BRCA member
as a Club
as Sponsors
as Manufacturers
as Race Event Organisers

We all play a massive role in promoting what we do as a RC community to young drivers. I don’t think there is one solution to the problem but to advertise what we do more around schools and so on.

The problem is that when people buy into all this RC racing business. You have to have in place a "new person" heat or under 13 heats where younger drivers can come and just have fun with their own age. Yes we will have to fight with PS3 and Xbox but if you don’t at least try and get new young drivers involved then you might as well stop racing now as it will just get to a point that your club slowly gets smaller and smaller and stops functioning as the drivers are all in retirement. (Nothing wrong with retirement drivers...they still beat myself :()

Barry Williams
09-04-2012, 02:11 PM
"On the day there where I think I counted only 4 kids under 13, and the rest where well adults with toy cars and we had 1 woman driver."

Just a quick point, the Woman you mention I believe was my Daughter Natalie who is still only 14, so you can class her as another "young" driver on the day

Barry

Thom
09-04-2012, 03:08 PM
Am I the lucky father? My son is 9 he wanted to start racing without any pushing. For the cost he bought a mad monkey kit out of his birthday money, with a brushed Tamiya race tuned motor with a 104 ESC. Some cheap second hand low powered Lipo batterys for a few pound and a cheap 2.4 wheel from ebay. All in just over £100. Not the fastest car but controllable. The Telstar Racing on the wednesday night on school holidays and the winter series has been great and he always looks forward to his next race. Everybody has been great and understanding even downtown swopping the marshall points to a safer place for him.
For a cheap setup in a good club he has learnt about good control hitting the corner with the right line and that staying on the track saves time. He now holds his own against far faster cars.
When the car gets broken, the price of the parts are cheap. we split the cost with some pocket money and I pay the rest.
What I am trying to say is racing does not need to be expensive, the RC car racers are generally great people and very understanding. Everything is already in place in most clubs for the kids to have a great time. People just don't know what's on there doorsteps. Unless you already race it is not easy to find your local club. After all how many posts are there on here asking where to race in the local area. Maybe it's as simple as a few flyers placed in the right area just for people to come and watch and chat just to see what they are missing out on. its all father son time.

oldboy
09-04-2012, 05:42 PM
I must be another lucky dad as i used to race when i was about 16ish more years ago than i wish to remember but my son last year showed an interest in rc cars as i used to run off-road we looked for a club to go to but only found clubs running on week nights no good for a 7 year old but then i stumbled across aylesbury offroad club (aorrc) only to find that they run touring cars and minis only now ( strange but true) we went to have a look one friday night (hurray no late school night) and was struck by how freindly the racers were with one (Chris Ely) coming over and introducing himself and explaining what was happening and what we would need to race we probably went another 3 or 4 times gleaning information (and yes there are people with expensive kit who tell you thats the best to get but also realistic ones who will tell you whats best to start off with and where to try when buying it, most of my sons and my cars are 2nd hand nobody cares) while we were there looking we met Pete and Mike who run the club and are both top guys but i am now just waffling my point being the racers are freindly and helpfull, there is a good mixture of ages and standards and the race night is right. we only run 2 qualifiers and a final and i often think that i would like another race but then realise that by keeping the number of races down we keep the stress down and have a good fun but competetive nights racing.my son races in the bottom heat against drivers of around the same standard (no juniors heat here) and he loves it, we have maybe 6 fairly regular juniors spread across the heats (not in top heat yet) and i agree with one of the earlier posters talk to them make them feel they are welcome and yes please help them, understand we all start somewhere.
I am probably the most vocal to my son (you understand if you are a dad) but i think some of that is down to the fact it will be me paying and fixing his car, but the rest of the racers have been great to us both and i must thank them for that.

ps slower is faster does not compute with a 7 year old ( well not for a long time anyway)

anyway thanks for reading my waffle i hope you can glean something from it and thanks to aorrc for renewing my passion for rc.:thumbsup:

kartstuffer
10-04-2012, 11:54 AM
Ha ha ,I just had to laugh at that last comment.
My son is now 9 and is going into his 3rd year racing (along with me)and it still rings true but he is now sometimes realizing that slower is faster.
We started off in minis which didnt run this winter so we had to go the buggy route and he now loves it, the main thing is car set up for a young kid who just wants to go flat out all the time.If i set the car ( x6 ) up for me to be quick he just keeps crashing, it has to be set up so it slides around a lot and with slow steering,even if i put new tyres on he will grip roll and with his set up i cant get near his times.
We have tried a few cars Losi BK2,Associated B4,Schumacher Cougar and settled on the X6 as being the most robust and easiest for him to drive.
The guys at the club DMCC have all been very helpful and given loads of advice and encouragement.
He is progressing well and now the problem is that qualifies for the back of the A final and instead af the front of the B ( try telling a 9 year old that it is better to come 3rd or 4th in the A than winning a B or C final)
And now my 11 year old daughter has just started as well !!!
But the main thing is to get young people interested in our hobby and keep their interest as if they dont see any improvement they get fed up very quickly and they are the future.

terry.sc
11-04-2012, 01:04 AM
What I mean by BRCA in general is that they seem to wait for people to come up with new ideas and thatís very responsive type of thinking. Something gets brought up and then they deal with it.That's how the BRCA works though, the constitution states that the committees are set up to "administer for the individual needs for the members racing interests". In other words, the committees can only do what we tell them. To allow the BRCA as an organisation to go ahead and do what the committee wants to do would require a change to the constitution to be voted in at the AGM. If you want to know exactly how it works and how change things, read this (http://www.brca.org/sites/default/files/library_files/BRCAchairman/The%20Structure%20of%20Your%20Sport.pdf) about the structure.

We all play a massive role in promoting what we do as a RC community to young drivers. I donít think there is one solution to the problem but to advertise what we do more around schools and so on.

The problem is that when people buy into all this RC racing business. You have to have in place a "new person" heat or under 13 heats where younger drivers can come and just have fun with their own age. Yes we will have to fight with PS3 and Xbox but if you donít at least try and get new young drivers involved then you might as well stop racing now as it will just get to a point that your club slowly gets smaller and smaller and stops functioning as the drivers are all in retirement.

Definitely. Macclesfield club disappeared because the racers there took everything so seriously, and it frightened off the new racers they needed to replace the old drivers that left. If we don't keep on bringing in new racers then we run out of racers.

terry.sc
11-04-2012, 01:05 AM
Agh I think the point is to try and get kids under 13 involved as soon as possible. As soon as they have PS3 and XBOX360's itís even harder to get kids involved. You want kids to enjoy the racing and itís all about fun not the actual race part they enjoy. Itís more looked at as time with dad or time with friends away from home.I agree, the younger the better. One of our fastest drivers is only 14.

From around age 7 they seem to get a grasp of racing even if they are just concentrating on not hitting the barriers, and if the kids are kept together they are happy to just race against each other and look forwards to meeting all their race mates each week. Get them before they become videogame junkies and the social aspect as well as the racing will keep them coming back.
Even though we know that r/c cars is about as near to full size racing as you can get, once the youngsters have played on consoles when they are a bit older they seem to see r/c as 'toy' cars, while they think they can race a 'real' car in the games, and they don't have to fix them when they crash.

GLYN WARD
14-04-2012, 07:03 PM
i ran a succesfull shop for 10 years we used to go to school summer fairs and put on demos and had 4 mardave cobras to let kids have a go with.we used to charge 50p a go and give funds to school. we where always booked up all through summer. the problem you have now is no local shops we used to have 3 in chesterfield. i blame distributors 1 in particular.
shops lead to more clubs which leads to more sales for shops.Round here when i had my shop mr booth and bailey could race every night of week and not have to drive more than 30min,

Chris56
14-04-2012, 07:43 PM
About 1 year ago I was in Hobbystores in Beeston and there was a family with a youngster interested in getting into an RC hobby. I nearly lynched the shop assistant when I overheard him say "don't bother with RC cars, they're boring". I know that Hobbystores are a Ripmax outlet and tend to be bigger on RC planes etc, however out of the few high street model shops out there in Nottinghamshire I thought that they would be doing more to promote the hobby and not turn potential newbies away from it

tnx king
14-04-2012, 07:58 PM
When i first started our club the most important thing to me was that anyone any car can turn up and have a race,

Young,old,mid life crisis, it didnt matter who or what car.
Last year i really started to notice that the young guns had not been coming through, we have quite a few but not enough.

So that got me thinking, why ?
1 we race on a tuesday night competition can be tight and to a newbie very scarry seeing grown men shouting at marshall:)

2. they would feel that they was getting in the way!

3.they dont know we exist

4.they feel there car is not good enough.

So this year we have set up practice,newbie nights, this happens on a thursday were they can bring anything down we help them and support and give advice like a buddy system really.,.

i have also set up going down to the local carnival with the local shop so we can set a track up and let kids have a go, get them involved...

my next step is to visit local schools have a demonstration show them all the cars that are available let them have a go, let them realise it doesnt cost the earth. and there is life after xbox

Another thing that was mentioned at our regional meeting was to have a regional at a public event, it didnt happen this year but i would champion this to every region in the country to show off and get what we do out there,(we sometimes get to rapped up in what we do that forget we have got to get out and promote!!!

we as a club are really focusing on grass roots and i feel that in a couple of years we should start to see the difference..

justa few thoughts and hopefully productive measures

Sportp4ck
15-04-2012, 06:52 PM
When i first started our club the most important thing to me was that anyone any car can turn up and have a race,

Young,old,mid life crisis, it didnt matter who or what car.
Last year i really started to notice that the young guns had not been coming through, we have quite a few but not enough.

So that got me thinking, why ?
1 we race on a tuesday night competition can be tight and to a newbie very scarry seeing grown men shouting at marshall:)

2. they would feel that they was getting in the way!

3.they dont know we exist

4.they feel there car is not good enough.

So this year we have set up practice,newbie nights, this happens on a thursday were they can bring anything down we help them and support and give advice like a buddy system really.,.

i have also set up going down to the local carnival with the local shop so we can set a track up and let kids have a go, get them involved...

my next step is to visit local schools have a demonstration show them all the cars that are available let them have a go, let them realise it doesnt cost the earth. and there is life after xbox

Another thing that was mentioned at our regional meeting was to have a regional at a public event, it didnt happen this year but i would champion this to every region in the country to show off and get what we do out there,(we sometimes get to rapped up in what we do that forget we have got to get out and promote!!!

we as a club are really focusing on grass roots and i feel that in a couple of years we should start to see the difference..

justa few thoughts and hopefully productive measures
Im 15 and have been getting parts for racing october, I race a Hb cyclone at Cotswold running hobby wing 13.5, First race I was excited got there early set up before I knew it I was sooo out classed in the pits I had not a patch on anythink they had people squeezing around me, Xray t3 2012 etc etc, every car wasn`t over a year old, I signed in a managed to set my transponder up and I wish I never came along I was so out clased on the track by a mile I looked like a total Idoit, big drivers getting a bit anoyyed with me for getting in the way, Theres no novice or starters class, it just seems to be the top drivers who pays thousands a year set the standereds.

Jamesk
15-04-2012, 08:04 PM
What a shame another youngster was put off by the old and wiser (hehe) drivers. I'm sure there are a few good places near you to start off with. As for equipment it's more to do with driving and being consistent than speed. My friend beats me sometimes with his 1994 YZ10 agaist my 201 tamiya. Keep the faith and go again,Speak to people on here to get a few ideas of good start up places near you.

jK

kkrproducts
15-04-2012, 08:59 PM
I think it's rather important to have a novice class for newer racers to start out in. Usually, it's one of the biggest classes at our local track, and it gets people's feet in the door. Most of the clubs we race with allow a class if there's 3 or more entries, and it's not that hard to find another person willing to try it out. There's been times I've ran a car in novice just to help out newer racers with developing race craft and setting up passes.

I think most clubs do a bad job with newer racers or view them differently then they should. They want to race just as bad as we do, they're just nervous to be thrown out there with all of the big cars/classes. One track we compete with always has a strong novice program, even having some vehicles owned by the track just should anything happen to a driver's car and they cant race with it.

Novice drivers are very important, they're the future of R/C racing.

Si Coe
15-04-2012, 09:42 PM
Im 15 and have been getting parts for racing october, I race a Hb cyclone at Cotswold running hobby wing 13.5, First race I was excited got there early set up before I knew it I was sooo out classed in the pits I had not a patch on anythink they had people squeezing around me, Xray t3 2012 etc etc, every car wasn`t over a year old, I signed in a managed to set my transponder up and I wish I never came along I was so out clased on the track by a mile I looked like a total Idoit, big drivers getting a bit anoyyed with me for getting in the way, Theres no novice or starters class, it just seems to be the top drivers who pays thousands a year set the standereds.


I find this more common in onroad than offroad, but I know what you mean. I've seen more than a few potential new racers turn up at the track with a TT01 or similar, still on the standard motor. They normally go home disheartened when they see the other car lap the track in less time than it takes them to get down the straight, use an esc that costs more than their entire setup and are carrying vast amounts of gear around even for a club meet.

Truth is though that its the driver that matters. I know quite a few good drivers insist on using older, cheaper gear because thats all they need to win. One of my clubs top drivers for example still runs a 20 year old 27mhz entry level Futaba Attack radio - it works as well for him as the latest DX3 so why not?
In fact, its worth noting that the clubs I know that have lots of new drivers are the ones that also have a good number of older hands that like to mess about the bargain basement gear (cheap cars, old cars etc).

jrenton
15-04-2012, 10:35 PM
My son is 9 and has just started racing. I got him a second hand B4 and set this up with all my old brushed electrics that were sitting locked away in a drawer.

At the moment he plays rugby at the weekends but in the summer we hope to get out for some more out door racing.

Maybe clubs could ask people to hand in their old electrics and this could be given to the juniors to use. Bet most people have old brush motors and ESCs lying around which will never be used and could not be sold either.

Jamesk
16-04-2012, 08:40 AM
Right people, i have been speaking to some of my work colleges with young children at junior school. There is intrest in running demo's/testing at the school fate's etc. I am in process of writing letter's to there headmasters/Mistress to inquire at the possiblity of running there. I would be intrested to hear from a few people around London to help out?

James K

eyeayen
16-04-2012, 08:52 AM
I find this more common in onroad than offroad, but I know what you mean. I've seen more than a few potential new racers turn up at the track with a TT01 or similar, still on the standard motor. They normally go home disheartened when they see the other car lap the track in less time than it takes them to get down the straight, use an esc that costs more than their entire setup and are carrying vast amounts of gear around even for a club meet.

I've found this a lot too, and yes more in on road. The part you mention about people getting 2nd gear is something that needs to be made aware to people starting up. I've looked around a lot of clubs before settling on what I have and been put off by the gear I've been 'told' to buy and then the realisation of the price when I got home and was in front of the computer.

I hope this high status mentality goes away because at the end of the day we're all here to have fun.

When I started racing a long long time ago it was mardave mini stocks, £40 for the kit and another £40 for the radio, so for £80 plus a lesure battery you could race, everyone had the same gear it was a very even playing field, now it does seem to be who can spend the most money which is such a shame.

I'm not having a pop at people who can afford the best gear, why shouldn't you buy it but if people come to the club asking questions don't tell them to buy what you have explain about the cheaper stuff, explain about how easy it is to pick up used items that aren't that old and still perfectly capable.

Sportp4ck
16-04-2012, 12:19 PM
I find this more common in onroad than offroad, but I know what you mean. I've seen more than a few potential new racers turn up at the track with a TT01 or similar, still on the standard motor. They normally go home disheartened when they see the other car lap the track in less time than it takes them to get down the straight, use an esc that costs more than their entire setup and are carrying vast amounts of gear around even for a club meet.

Truth is though that its the driver that matters. I know quite a few good drivers insist on using older, cheaper gear because thats all they need to win. One of my clubs top drivers for example still runs a 20 year old 27mhz entry level Futaba Attack radio - it works as well for him as the latest DX3 so why not?
In fact, its worth noting that the clubs I know that have lots of new drivers are the ones that also have a good number of older hands that like to mess about the bargain basement gear (cheap cars, old cars etc).
I have every think that I need in the pits to race, and spares wise for the car its just going to take some pratice and learning this year how to drive and set up the car, im capable driving it, Its just over taking with other cars around me:o. Pratice makes perfect:thumbsup:

Sportp4ck
16-04-2012, 12:31 PM
But I went there everyone had the lastest cars, lastest Hudy tools,Wet car and a Dry car, Its just seems to be such an competive field out there now and not alot of kids/teenagers my age 15 and the younger age groups doing it. Meaning no sort of entry leval class/Track day class, im up against top leval stuff not being horrible but there much more charger is worth more than my car alone, Its a bit like entering formular one. Louis

jphillips
16-04-2012, 12:55 PM
We (my son and myself ) race at telford hot trax, he is only 9 and is doing quite well with a Carisma gt16b, all standard kit, apart for a few old lipos i had lying about,

his car is currently setup to approx 30% power and he finished second in his final last week, the club has a good mix of oldies and 30+ and also a few younger kids

all of the races are mixed and there is a good race atmospher with all ages of racers,

luniemiester
16-04-2012, 01:36 PM
My son is almost 5 and RC mad, he was having a play with my buggy at my local track but its to hard for him to control so i luckily managed to pick up a 2nd hand XXX-CR-T for £75 including a Novak ESC and motor and a spektrum Z590 servo. I have put in a cheap (£40) new 2.4ghz system and a second hand lipo battery (£10)

What a difference - the truck is easier for him to learn on, rides obstacles easily if he makes an error and crashes and being a truck the tyres have now been on for about 6 hours running time and are still good enough to race on.

All i have done is turn the radio down to 20% throttle and added a lipo cutoff as the system doesnt have a built in one.

When hes ready i will move him over to buggy again but the trucks are that much fun ive bought a 22T so we can race together in the summer!

Maybe with the advent of some cheaper RTR trucks clubs could be aiming to promote this class for younger drivers - i think from a cost point of view with regards to tyres its cheaper long term and they seem more durable than a buggy plus the bigger shells make them seem more attractive.

Naushad
16-04-2012, 01:40 PM
It's interesting reading all these comments...definitely some positives vibes on bringing the younger generation into line with r/c.

TBH, most kids now run around with a mobile, mp3 player blah blah...so the idea of affording this and that (for a lot of teenagers) isn't such a big factor. Though I think the idea of having some "taste and see" cars would be a great help to encourage others. When I was young, I dreamt of a Tamiya Grasshopper...though in those times the price was phenomenal! My dad bought my a Turbo Blaster which I cherished but I always wanted a Tamiya..

Recently, I was going to a small club in Colwyn Bay close to where I live, but recently it packed up due to poor turn out. It was just indoor bashing where people brought whatever...but it was fun as you could have a good natter and tune your kit.

Sometimes I think with better promotion it could have been a success, but these days people just don't have the time to invest..

sosidge
16-04-2012, 05:33 PM
But I went there everyone had the lastest cars, lastest Hudy tools,Wet car and a Dry car, Its just seems to be such an competive field out there now and not alot of kids/teenagers my age 15 and the younger age groups doing it. Meaning no sort of entry leval class/Track day class, im up against top leval stuff not being horrible but there much more charger is worth more than my car alone, Its a bit like entering formular one. Louis

I assume it was the Cotswold club meeting you went to? If so I was there too.

It was a slightly unusual day in that a lot of the top national drivers were there as a warm-up for the BTCC meeting next week and the full national next month. Understandably these drivers have a lot of gear, but fundamentally they have a lot of talent and it is a valuable experience to just watch their lines and learn.

Most of the gear you see on the pit tables is out of choice. The Much-More charger is nice, but in all honesty it doesn't charge the batteries any better than a £50 charger from your local model shop. I was running my 5-year -old touring car at the meeting with it's 2-year old motor and new battery pack (yes, I have been splashing out), and the car was not a problem on the day at all. I put it in the 13.5 A-final. The track temperature was very low and a lot of us were struggling for grip, especially on the BRCA-spec tyres.

As far as lower-cost racing is concerned, we had a heat of Minis and front-wheel drives there. These cars cost a lot less than a full-fat touring car and we run them with £10 motors. The racing is just as much fun, possibly even more fun at times - the tyres on my Mini actually worked in the conditions!

So don't be disheartened, just focus on bringing a well prepared car to the track, and practicing your driving. We all started somewhere.

If you have any problems, just ask. We race for pleasure, that's why we smile in the pits!

Sportp4ck
17-04-2012, 10:43 AM
I assume it was the Cotswold club meeting you went to? If so I was there too.

It was a slightly unusual day in that a lot of the top national drivers were there as a warm-up for the BTCC meeting next week and the full national next month. Understandably these drivers have a lot of gear, but fundamentally they have a lot of talent and it is a valuable experience to just watch their lines and learn.

Most of the gear you see on the pit tables is out of choice. The Much-More charger is nice, but in all honesty it doesn't charge the batteries any better than a £50 charger from your local model shop. I was running my 5-year -old touring car at the meeting with it's 2-year old motor and new battery pack (yes, I have been splashing out), and the car was not a problem on the day at all. I put it in the 13.5 A-final. The track temperature was very low and a lot of us were struggling for grip, especially on the BRCA-spec tyres.

As far as lower-cost racing is concerned, we had a heat of Minis and front-wheel drives there. These cars cost a lot less than a full-fat touring car and we run them with £10 motors. The racing is just as much fun, possibly even more fun at times - the tyres on my Mini actually worked in the conditions!

So don't be disheartened, just focus on bringing a well prepared car to the track, and practicing your driving. We all started somewhere.

If you have any problems, just ask. We race for pleasure, that's why we smile in the pits! Hi there yes I was at Cotswold on the 15th,
Im getting the car set up properly and learning how to drive it race pace going most weekends there to practice. Then I will fair a good chance racing. Cotswold is an amazing track so is every one in the pits I found out really helpfull.:thumbsup: