Tamiya F104 Pro v 3Racing F1-09

[Chequered Flag Racing]

Originally Posted by RobW

struggling to see any real bad points about car especially considering the price.

The Diff
Each time you change the rear foams you need to reset the diff each time

King Pins
e-clips are easily lost and then you lose the spring also

a fix for the above

[boultspeed]

Originally Posted by RobW

Cheers -thanks for info - struggling to see any real bad points about car especially considering the price.

Maybe I'll leave reading the 98 page thread until I get home though

Rob

hey Rob F1's are racing at Ardent raceway this Sunday if youre anywhere nearby it would be worth a look

[watfordtrackwarrior]

Originally Posted by RobW

Thinking about getting a couple of F109s for my son and I to run at the BRCA F1/GT championships.

They look cheap - what hop ups do I really need? Going to be on carpet and probably going to be in the slower brushed motor class (as it is too wide for the brushless class) so hoping the FRP chassis will cope. From above front uprights need replacing plus not keen on friction dampers so probably look at replacing that plus some aluminum motor mounts but these are available fairly cheap.

Assume kit tyres are useless? They usually are.

Anyone run one on carpet with any advice.

Thanks

Rob

change the spur for a tamiya 103 64dp one and use a bearing insteaad of the pathetic plastic spacer in the kit stock spur is rubbish in my opinion rest of car is gr8

[ch!3f]

alittle off subject but i have an f103 second hand was ballraced and a trf shock fitted and can not knock it grips well on tarmac had some high speed crashes and not broken it yet and 1 was full on in to a curb at full pelt.

if you can get a tamiya get 1 less bits to brake as the f109 is well loaded with bits n bobs to tune it. which can get bent broken or knocked off in a crash.

the diff on the f103 is easy to set just do it tight and loosen half a turn and is smashing.

[terry.sc]

Originally Posted by Chequered Flag Racing

The Diff
Each time you change the rear foams you need to reset the diff each time

King Pins
e-clips are easily lost and then you lose the spring also

It depends on what you do the most.
Running the F109 kit diff you can adjust the diff settings easily, but you have to adjust the diff settings each time you swap tyres. The better option if you aren't replacing tyres all the time, fit the Tamiya one piece thrust bearing (part number 53136) and you'll struggle to get the F104 diff as smooth. It's also a lot easier and quicker to adjust, to tighten a slipping diff takes a couple of seconds pulling over at the side of the track, with the F104 style it's back to the pits.
The F104 or F109 externally adjustable diffs mean you can change tyres without having to reset your diff settings, but you do have to remove the wheel and end cap if you want to adjust the diff settings so you can't tweak the diff settings in practice by just pulling in and turning the nut.

And considering the most often reason most people go near the diff is to change the spur gear the F103/F109 style is much quicker to replace and much simpler to reset the diff again.

The F104 style diff is only necessary if you change your tyres every race or two, or you run at several clubs and have to run different tyres at each club.
I've run the kit diff, the external adjustable diff and the Tamiya F104 diff. I've gone back to the kit diff with the Tamiya thrust race as I find it more user friendly, the only downside is if I have to take the wheel off to set gear mesh I have to reset the diff, but as it can be checked and adjusted while warming up for the next race I've never found it a problem.



E clips are also a problem, they fly off the kingpin at the slightest knock. If you use Tamiya steering knuckles grub screw them to the kingpin so you don't lose anything when the top E clip comes off, which seems to happen much more often than the lower one. When the top e clip comes off if the kingpin is held by the steering block you can usually complete the race as there isn't enough clearance for the upper arm to come off the kingpin. Replacing the E clips with Tamiya ones also seems to keep them on for longer.



Nothing wrong with the kit FRP chassis, in fact it's tougher than the carbon upgrade while generating more grip by being a little bit flexible. The only reason I can think of to fit the carbon chassis is to save weight, although you will usually want to add weight rather than take it off.

Build an F109 as in the kit and use the kit tyres is a good starting setup for carpet, stiffer side springs and front springs sharpen up the handling. The front castor mount really wants to be replaced with the alloy upgrade although there are plenty still running fine with the kit one so it's not absolutely necessary and the alloy version seems virtually impossible to find these days.

[Chequered Flag Racing]

Originally Posted by watfordtrackwarrior

change the spur for a tamiya 103 64dp one and use a bearing insteaad of the pathetic plastic spacer in the kit stock spur is rubbish in my opinion rest of car is gr8

I've seen 48dp which take the bearing on ebay a while back. They may have been made by RW Racing.

[terry.sc]

Originally Posted by Chequered Flag Racing

I've seen 48dp which take the bearing on ebay a while back. They may have been made by RW Racing.

Yes, RW Racing have made them. Don't know if they are a readily available production item but I do know Dez Chand has recently been running them in his F109 and I think he got them direct from RW.

[ch!3f]

Originally Posted by terry.sc

Yes, RW Racing have made them. Don't know if they are a readily available production item but I do know Dez Chand has recently been running them in his F109 and I think he got them direct from RW.

demon power products stock them just search rw racing delrin spur gear on google

[Chequered Flag Racing]

Originally Posted by ch!3f

demon power products stock them just search rw racing delrin spur gear on google

which one is it as non are listed for the F109?

[ch!3f]

Originally Posted by Chequered Flag Racing

which one is it as non are listed for the F109?

my apologise they dont stock what the f109 or f103 need but if you look on ebay for kawada spur gear ansmann spur gear or 3racing the sell multi fit 1s which will fit


http://inzaneracing.com/bilder/diff4.jpg

also if you search for kawada on demons website it brings up all kawada products they have if you look at the description of the spur gears it tells you if there for pan cars

[dale]

Originally Posted by Chequered Flag Racing

I've seen 48dp which take the bearing on ebay a while back. They may have been made by RW Racing.

They were mine. I bought up all of RWs old stock (they'd been on their shelves since the 90s!), but then sold most of them when the F1 class died at my local track.

RW will make them to order, but they will want a minimum order size (think it might have been 10).

[Chequered Flag Racing]

Originally Posted by dale

They were mine. I bought up all of RWs old stock (they'd been on their shelves since the 90s!), but then sold most of them when the F1 class died at my local track.

RW will make them to order, but they will want a minimum order size (think it might have been 10).

thanks Dale

do you what teeth size for 48dp would be popular?

any other spurs that fit the F109 and take the centre bearing?

what's the bearing size again?

[Chequered Flag Racing]

Originally Posted by Chequered Flag Racing

what's the bearing size again?

hopefully this correct

Bearing in mm is 8x12x3.5

http://www.tamiya-store.com/shop/tamiya/1280/sealed/bearing/3piece-p-4305.html

Are the kawada / Ansmann spurs metric hole centres or do they use 12th pan car bearing size?

[dale]

Originally Posted by Chequered Flag Racing

hopefully this correct

Bearing in mm is 8x12x3.5

http://www.tamiya-store.com/shop/tamiya/1280/sealed/bearing/3piece-p-4305.html

Are the kawada / Ansmann spurs metric hole centres or do they use 12th pan car bearing size?

That's the correct bearing. My spurs were all 70t; that gave a really good range of gearings.

Most other spurs (apart from tamiya ones) have the imperial centre hole so won't take a bearing.

[ch!3f]

you can always try 1 of these if you cant get the right size spur gear.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/3RACING-64Pitc...item588c8e86d9

rather then fitting a bearing its smaller so allows the use of other spur gears.

[Chequered Flag Racing]

RW Spur Gears / F109

Just spoken to RW and they'll need an order of 10 minimum for one size, ie 70 teeth

I'll get them cut if there's enough folk want them and probably go for 48dp / 70 teeth as mentioned by Dale earlier.

Spur Gear only £6.50 posted you'll need to find your own bearing 8mm*12mm*3.5mm

Spur Gear + bearing £7.50 posted

payment can cash, paypal, cheque etc

names below please
1.
2.
3.
4.
5.
6.
7.
8.
9.
10.

going to need at last 6 on the list before I place an order

[Chequered Flag Racing]

Looks very likely I'll be getting some 48dp ones cut as I have a request for 17 just from my club.

Getting 48dp rather than 64dp as the drivers at TRCC treat there F1's like Mardave's

Will leave it till the weekend to see if any more want one and then I'll be in touch with RW to get them machined up