Go Back   oOple.com Forums > General > 1/10th OFF ROAD

View Poll Results: What is your preference for racing surface indoors
EOS carpet with wooden features 15 23.08%
Recycled astro turf with sand infill and wooden features on a flat surface 2 3.08%
Recycled astro turf with sand infill and wooden features on a profiled surface 20 30.77%
Dirt 12 18.46%
New astro turf without sand infill and wooden features on a flat surface 15 23.08%
None of the above - give us your suggestions in the comments below please 1 1.54%
Voters: 65. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 08-11-2016
shaungooner shaungooner is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Nottinghamshire
Posts: 408
Default Gauging opinion on most popular surface for permanent indoor facility

Hi guys

I'm just trying to gauge opinion on preferences for track surface at a potential new permanent indoor venue in the East Midlands

We are seeing more tracks around the country now with Maritime, Midland Raceway, Silverstone and MB and the dominant surface so far seems to be the EOS carpet and tracks made up on a flat surface with wooden (carpet covered) features with the exception of Maritime who have switched from carpet to astro

These tracks are great and personally I like the way these tracks have been developed

However the EOS carpet surface is very different to that which we use when we go outdoors as the weather and light improves

So with that in mind I'd be grateful to hear of your thoughts on the following options

Option 1 - EOS carpet with wooden (carpet covered) features

Option 2 - Recycled astro turf with sand infill (hockey pitch style astro as used at most outdoor venues around the country), laid on a flat floor with wooden features covered in the same astro

Option 3 - Recycled astro turf with sand infill as in option 2 but laid on top of a profiled track to create undulations and jumps like a 'REAL' offroad track indoors

Option 4 - Dirt, little used these days in the UK but still the dominant surface in the rest of the world

Option 5 - New astro turf with no sand infill (current Maritime surface and previously used by Silverstone)

Option 6 - None of the above, give us your suggestion instead
__________________
Current rides:

Team Associated B6.1

Kyosho RZ7

Kyosho ZX7

All kept going by PBM Racing
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 08-11-2016
richm richm is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 133
Default

EOS carpet has very low tyre wear, which is very welcome for most racers as it makes things a lot more affordable.
I also hear that the EOS carpet is quite cheap. though have no figures, just repeating something I was told.

I don't recommend any astro option with sand in it, as it gets into all the moving parts of your car, and you will spend all the time cleaning it out of other parts of your venue.

Dirt would be awesome, but it may need more infrastructure in your venue to make it work. looking at the american venues, they have a combination of misters and blowers to keep the surface good. And whilst there are many venues that are dirt / clay in the rest of the world, the majority of surfaces over here are astro / grass.

I like the idea of astro over a profiled track, making it more like an outdoor track. but on the other hand, the big advantage of tracks like maritime that has movable jumps on a flat surface is that they can completely change the track fairly easily and quickly without any heavy machinery.

so i guess i am suggesting option 1 or 5

but a permanent indoor dirt / clay track that would be open for practice would be awesome.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 08-11-2016
the dug the dug is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: leicester
Posts: 66
Default

Be different, clay/dirt would be terrific. Storm Valley was unbelievably good before it closed, problem there was the fumes from gas cars. Tyres lasted forever. Track was a bit small and location wasn't good. Be brave get dirt.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 08-11-2016
bigt's Avatar
bigt bigt is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 392
Default

get dirty
__________________
YZ2 sanwa hi-tec Balls out
zx6 Futaba orion sanwa
Need a liner resized ?
Liars run for cover the truth is taking over!!!
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 08-11-2016
danDanEFC's Avatar
danDanEFC danDanEFC is offline
Mad Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Crosby, Merseyside
Posts: 1,022
Send a message via MSN to danDanEFC
Default

Not Dirt
__________________
Aidan Burke - Southport Radio Car Club
#SchumacherFamily #TQmodels #ExtraLapRCpodcast
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 08-11-2016
neallewis's Avatar
neallewis neallewis is offline
*SuPeRsTaR mEmBeR*
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: UK
Posts: 3,368
Default

EOS carpet does wear tyres, certainly as it ages. It's still very good though.
People do dislike it until they find a setup that works for their car, then they get it.

These options are all kind of irrelevant as the track surface will be dictated by your budget and the available space to fill, unless you have a bottomless pit of money, and no requirement to recoup the outlay to get setup. What do the building owners say you can/can't do?

I wouldn't say dirt tracks are dominant now in the rest of the world. Yes in america, but that's changing as they realise the benefits in the shift to a cleaner more car friendly surface.

New astro or carpet laid on a shaped dirt style track would be interesting for sure.

I love racing on Dirt, but many here in the UK don't like it, unfortunately. Mostly due to tyre cost, different setup/driving style needed, and wear and tear on the cars. Other environmental factors decide how good the dirt experience is, e.g. size, cover, is it cold in winter, is pitting outside, etc. We have RHR Dirt, which is the best dirt track in Europe, but when it was open for smaller club run meetings, people wouldn't come, or won't pay for tyres, which made it difficult to justify the work needed to get it race ready. One of my favourite meetings on there was a Yorcc run club meeting when it rained and the track was damp and sticky. The grip was awesome and the tyres didn't wear at all.
You can read and learn from the issues that unfortunately closed Storm Valley.

Sandy astro inside is a crazy idea, why would you do that, unless you had a huge pile of free astro ready to go, and the manpower and machinery needed to lay it.

An issue we've found with a permanent track is people seem to not like the fact that a track isn't changing for every meeting. Elsewhere in the world they lay a track and change it every few months or once a year in the down season. Here we seem to begrudge the fact that locals get more practice therefore must be faster than a visiting racer. I just don't get that argument, when for any "bigger" race meeting the people who build the track before also get lots of practice beforehand as a bonus for helping to build the track. At any meeting someone will always have had a bit more practice, and it doesn't mean they will win.

Is it a club venture, or a track as a business?
__________________
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Team Yokomo - YZ-2CAL3 | YZ-2DTM3 | YZ-4SF2 | YZ-2T | YZ-2DTM Worlds | YZ-2DTM x2 | YRX-12 x2
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
10electric | Batley Buggy Club | YORCC | RHR | MB Models
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Last edited by neallewis; 08-11-2016 at 12:49 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 08-11-2016
andrewc andrewc is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Sussex
Posts: 228
Default

We started 1066 Racing two and half years ago as we wanted somewhere close to home to race; going really well but not a permanent venue. We currently use EOS carpet, we were using a mixture of industrial/office carpet and prima felt. (all for sale on here plug plug!)

Currently I'd say EOS tyre wear is two meetings, compared to one meeting on our old stuff for the really quick boys. The best thing about EOS stuff is not chasing set up all night...you used to start with new tyres and have a tiny bit of understeer, then would be nicely balanced, then move to lack of traction as the night went on, so constantly making small changes to car...but the old carpet was one third the price of EOS so allowed us to start the club, served it's purpose and exactly as Neal says I've not found my set up for EOS yet so currently favour our old stuff!!

We'd love a permanent indoor venue, as it's bloody hard work setting up the track, rolling out 30x18m of carpet etc, and putting it away after the meeting, but put simply we couldn't possibly afford the rent! If you can, and it's a decent size, then go for it and the very best of luck. I do think size matters, great fun racing on a big track, even if it is a pain to set up. Personally I'd go with non sanded astro or EOS carpet if you afford it. Like Neal I love the idea of undulating features, but it does limit track layout.

Here's a pic from our last club night. : )

Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 08-11-2016
mark christopher's Avatar
mark christopher mark christopher is offline
Spends too long on oOple ...
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: haxey, doncaster
Posts: 7,787
Send a message via MSN to mark christopher
Default

I'd say the same as UK outdoor. So astro, either with sand or without
Undulating track like outdoor.

No idea why some we saying that limits layout, every astro track I have been to don't think one has been stuck for layout options
__________________
MBModels - Schumacher Racing - Vapextech.co.uk - MRT - Savox - SMD

Last edited by mark christopher; 08-11-2016 at 05:24 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 08-11-2016
mark christopher's Avatar
mark christopher mark christopher is offline
Spends too long on oOple ...
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: haxey, doncaster
Posts: 7,787
Send a message via MSN to mark christopher
Default

uk is calling out for some where indoors on a surface we run outdoors for over winter
__________________
MBModels - Schumacher Racing - Vapextech.co.uk - MRT - Savox - SMD

Last edited by mark christopher; 08-11-2016 at 05:30 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 08-11-2016
fidspeed's Avatar
fidspeed fidspeed is offline
Mad Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,288
Default

Lots of great opinions here

For my tuppence astro outdoors with sand can be a set of tyres a run at regional level not good for club racing
I dislike sand in cars any way
Carpet is a better option
I really like worksop rubberised floor as you can run tyres till bald disadvantage is grip levels increase during day
Clay may require old school cars which are no linger popular and clay may be difficult to maintain

Big thumbs up is getting opinions first before ploughing in blindly
Can you divulge where exactly the venue may be that may give you a better idea of likely area of draw of drivers/customers

Look at others failures or success to help you determine why they failed and help you avoid similar pitfalls
Good luck Dave

Last edited by fidspeed; 08-11-2016 at 04:23 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 08-11-2016
fidspeed's Avatar
fidspeed fidspeed is offline
Mad Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,288
Default

No idea why some ate saying that limits layout, every astro track I have been to don't think one has been stuck for layout options[/QUOTE]

If features are fixed mark you will only have so many options of approaching/leaving it if its fixed in a corner it makes it even more limited
Regards dave
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 08-11-2016
lee.willows lee.willows is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Castleford
Posts: 347
Smile Track

Ideal would be to put a lid/barn over Robin Hood Raceway, include space for pitting, bingo. Just lots of planning permission, and outlay for who ever does it.

Good luck what ever you decide to do.
__________________
Lee Willows

Moss Models
Garcia Graphix

Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 08-11-2016
/tobys /tobys is offline
Mad Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Leicestershire
Posts: 1,370
Default

Dirt would be awesome. Storms problems were (in order and in my opinion), the nitro's running with electric (stink, noise, different driving styles/lines), limited availability for running (they had to have electric on sat and nitro on Sunday to alleviate the problems of running together - which is a problem for some, me included), not enough race meetings and Finally size.

I never had an issue with tyre wear; I ran 3 meetings on the same set of hole shots and they could probably run another 3.

As cars these days are being designed for high grip Astro and carpet, it would seem for 2wd a low grip chassis layout would be needed which might deter regular drivers who race on Astro normally with a single car.

Flat carpet with wooden jumps would be my least favourite, profiled Astro would be my choice if you didn't go for dirt.

What sort of size is this track going to be?
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 08-11-2016
mark christopher's Avatar
mark christopher mark christopher is offline
Spends too long on oOple ...
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: haxey, doncaster
Posts: 7,787
Send a message via MSN to mark christopher
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by fidspeed View Post
No idea why some ate saying that limits layout, every astro track I have been to don't think one has been stuck for layout options
If features are fixed mark you will only have so many options of approaching/leaving it if its fixed in a corner it makes it even more limited
Regards dave[/QUOTE]

not at all it depends how you make the bumps, id hardly say RHR are stuck for different lay outs
__________________
MBModels - Schumacher Racing - Vapextech.co.uk - MRT - Savox - SMD
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 08-11-2016
mark christopher's Avatar
mark christopher mark christopher is offline
Spends too long on oOple ...
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: haxey, doncaster
Posts: 7,787
Send a message via MSN to mark christopher
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by fidspeed View Post
Carpet is a better option
lets be honest if you want to race on carpet, there are pleanty of "on" road classes to choose from, this is about "off" road
__________________
MBModels - Schumacher Racing - Vapextech.co.uk - MRT - Savox - SMD
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 08-11-2016
fidspeed's Avatar
fidspeed fidspeed is offline
Mad Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,288
Default

not wanting to start anything Mark and hi jacking an excellent idea and thread
but as you mention RHR (which is a fantastic venue and were lucky to have access to )

the banked corner is always the banked corner once its fixed you either use it or you miss it out which reduces options once you fix certain obstacles you either run them change direction or miss them out .which is limiting and reduces track availability

for me a new venture/club has to keep its options open until it finds out which is the most economic and sustainable to operate .fixing obstacles may be great to start with but us RC people are fickle with equipment classes we run and venues e like to visit
Mark you have vast experience and knowledge of all most all r/c classes
and still are racing most of them

but for a venue it may have to be Jack of all trades to survive and compete rather than a master of one

MB models new venue is superb hats off to Micheal,ross and all but Michael trump card is his online shop which is excellent but even Michael realises the more classes that can utilize his venue the more it offers

to the original OP the more info and research you do the more likely success is ,very few venues succedd as a busiess venture alone you need a regular club using it as a home venue to make its best use

good luck and if its near to Lincolnshire the better !!!

Dave Fid
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 09-11-2016
shaungooner shaungooner is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Nottinghamshire
Posts: 408
Default

Wow thanks for the feedback so far guys

Our thinking on asking your opinions on the options for track surface is really just to see what would be the most popular based on the idea that if we actually ask the community what they want and deliver it that we have more chance of success

To answer a few of the points raised and give you some of my own feelings I would say that my own preference would be for recycled astro (with sand) on a profiled surface with the addition of some wooden features that could be placed anywhere on track. The reasoning behind this is that this is the surface that most represents outdoor racing in the UK in 2016 and so would give you guys the opportunity to have a fantastic indoor facility for practice, club racing and perhaps the odd larger event. The USP compared to other venues would be that you could really work on setup for a UK style astro track

Keep your thoughts coming guys

At the moment this is in the very early stages of planning and may not come off, but we have a potential venue, just one or 2 small issues to overcome with the local authority before we can proceed to the next stage
__________________
Current rides:

Team Associated B6.1

Kyosho RZ7

Kyosho ZX7

All kept going by PBM Racing
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 09-11-2016
Dazzieboy's Avatar
Dazzieboy Dazzieboy is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Nottingham
Posts: 248
Default

I would say look to Yatabe arena for inspiration
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 09-11-2016
wezzer's Avatar
wezzer wezzer is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 716
Default dirt!!!!!!!!!

DIRT for my vote! astro/carpet tracks are everywhere and most people can go race/practice on a astro/carpet track at least once a week, so you would build just another indoor carpet track.............. purpose built 10th indoor dirt track! would be friggin amazing :-)

Last edited by wezzer; 09-11-2016 at 03:26 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 09-11-2016
neallewis's Avatar
neallewis neallewis is offline
*SuPeRsTaR mEmBeR*
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: UK
Posts: 3,368
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dazzieboy View Post
I would say look to Yatabe arena for inspiration
yeah, no sand in sight!
__________________
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Team Yokomo - YZ-2CAL3 | YZ-2DTM3 | YZ-4SF2 | YZ-2T | YZ-2DTM Worlds | YZ-2DTM x2 | YRX-12 x2
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
10electric | Batley Buggy Club | YORCC | RHR | MB Models
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 07:07 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
oOple.com