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Old 04-06-2018
BuggyRacer BuggyRacer is offline
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Default Has buggy racing got stupid?!

So, entirely open to discussion. I race outdoors on astroturf and Schumacher Minis-spikes have been brilliant for years, they've been lasting 4 meetings without too much trouble (so 20 races, 4x qualifiers and a final at each meeting).

I got back from club racing yesterday and EVERYONE is finding the need to use the newer, faster Schumacher Dart tyre. Yes it seems to offer a fantastic level of grip but people are using TWO sets per meeting seeing as the lose their peak after the 3rd race (on astro turf).

Is buggy racing the new cheque-book racing? It seems to of just got a little stupid...

Thoughts?
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  #2  
Old 04-06-2018
jamie5974 jamie5974 is offline
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without a control tyre, people wanting to win will use the fastest possible tyre to try and make it happen.
if you can rock up with spikes, have fun and leave with a smile on your face then that should be the main goal.
yes most of us turn up to win, but as long as you have fun!
that's my moto anyway
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Old 04-06-2018
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I've packed it in due to spiralling tyre costs even to be competitive in a club series. I just cant justify it on a personal level - others have their own views but from past experience the current tyres are just not up to the job.
The new darts just don't last - 2 sets of rears are a minimum. Mini-spikes last longer but they don't give enough grip as the darts do. I feel a set of tyres should last a meeting to keep the hobby balanced - the tyres used to degrade, but currently they just fall off the cliff.

Going to a harder compound could of helped the situation maybe - but then everyone would have to do that to not make it a two tier race.
I feel the dart is different - I was convinced the compound has been altered, but it could just be the profile and the cars characteristics of being able to rotate up their own arse.

Electrics, spares and other areas of the hobby are the best they have ever been - things last, dont cost stupid amounts if youre careful and you can get away with having cheaper motors / escs. However the hop up band wagon is frustrating. You know you don't NEED them, but we all know it makes us feel better with them!

Darts were meant to be a solution, however you still see spikes being trimmed and even more new sets getting bolted on.
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Old 04-06-2018
Cosworth Cosworth is offline
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Yup tyre costs have gone through the roof with the use of darts. At the Kidderminster regional (tyre wear not helped by the inclusion of all the tarmac parts of the circuit) I was getting just over 1 run out of a set of Tyres. Have way through the second run you could feel them going off. Coventry regional wasnt much better either with a full astro track.

Someone started a discussion on Facebook about limiting the amount of sets you can run in one meeting like at touring car nationals and was met with mostly negative replies from let's say the high tier drivers and positive ones from the non A finalists.

I've personally never known tyre wear be so bad as it has been lately and something needs to be done about the spiralling costs on tyres.
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  #5  
Old 04-06-2018
jamie5974 jamie5974 is offline
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you mention limiting sets, only problem with that i see is, are the darts weaing too fast to even be able to limit them?
With the touring cars running a used set vs brand new dosnt mean you are instantly the slowest on the track.
if the darts are wearing to the point of undriveable after say 3 runs then its clearly the wrong tyre at the moment.
spikes worked well and gave a good balance of wear vs grip
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  #6  
Old 04-06-2018
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Danosborne6661 Danosborne6661 is offline
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It makes sense for clubs to have the Schumacher Mini-spikes as their nominated control tyre if they feel that the Dart's are taking the enjoyment out of club racing, which they certainly seem to be.

I've seen that Dart's are the nominated tyre at Mendips oOoos round this year which could remove a lot of fun for some people £££!
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  #7  
Old 04-06-2018
jamie5974 jamie5974 is offline
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i will be buying 2 sets for that event, 1 set per day. if i need more i shall find the trackside shop lol.
seems silly to me to be buying more sets of tyres for a buggy meeting than i do buy for a touring car meeting

Quote:
Originally Posted by Danosborne6661 View Post
It makes sense for clubs to have the Schumacher Mini-spikes nominated as their control tyre if they feel that the Dart's are taking the enjoyment out of club racing in my opinion?

I've seen that Dart's are the nominated tyre at Mendips oOoos round this year which could remove a lot of fun from that meeting £££!
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  #8  
Old 04-06-2018
Brighton27 Brighton27 is offline
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Is buggy racing really getting that expensive? I cry at the thought of spending £50 on 2 sets of tyres for an outdoor touring car meeting. Don’t think I could handle doing that with buggies too
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  #9  
Old 04-06-2018
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Yup gone crazy hence why rc in our country will never be massive. They would charge for air if it wasnt free already. Tyres should last more than two rounds, one event should be set as a rule by the BRCA to tyre makers so they redesign again and get the mix right.
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  #10  
Old 04-06-2018
CHEVY CHEVY is offline
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A bit like aire valley back in the day when yokomo's were tires of choices 3 sets for one day
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  #11  
Old 04-06-2018
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This is one of the reasons I packed up 1/8th off road racing due to tyre,wheel and insert cost, and returned to 1/10th.

Now its getting as bad with the amount you need per meeting.

How is this going to encouraged new people in to the sport when you tell them the tyre cost.
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  #12  
Old 04-06-2018
Yorkiebar Yorkiebar is offline
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Me and my 11 year old lad both race on an absolute shoestring budget, he's had a set of yellow minispikes on the rear of his 2WD since March, and just swapped them for a pair of darts for a regional a couple of weeks ago (control tyre) - but got him blue compound to try and make them last. He loves how it drives with those on so going to stick with them. Even with brand new lo-pro yellow cut staggers it's still a bit front end pushy and safe so it's not like the blue compound is letting go at the back.

A round earlier in the year I could only afford tyres for him, so I was racing on bald spikes in the wet. Still didn't care as it was fun for us both. A chap at our club had a good laugh at my car and took pity on me, lending me a set of BB greens for the final (Ta Neil!).

We'll both never be A final material and we know it, we both simply enjoy a day's racing
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  #13  
Old 04-06-2018
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Zippy G Zippy G is offline
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Default Tyres!!!

Ok so here it is.
We ran our yz2 indoors on carpet on yellow mini darts, they lasted 2 rounds (10 minutes)of qualifying and needed replacing to stay competitive, we ran the same car on the same carpet with the same driver with proline pin points, they were a bit loose for the first 5 minutes but then lasted 3 full meetings!!! (60 minutes) before they went off.
BUT proline pin points are never a controlled tire

Not sure of other peoples experience but that was mine.

Our recent regional at Herts on a hot day was a fresh pair of rears every run, controlled tyre, Schumacher mini dart
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Old 04-06-2018
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HarlowS HarlowS is offline
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I wonder if meetings ran a Mod class (as we are now) and a Sport class with sport being a controlled low wearing tyre how far the numbers would spread.....
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  #15  
Old 04-06-2018
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cjm_2008 cjm_2008 is offline
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I did a practice day at mendip a couple of months ago, running worn yellow minispikes on the back of my YZ-2 DT.

It felt like it had plenty of grip to me. I have a set of darts still in the packet that I've yet to try; they remind me of mini-pins in a way, which are my least favourite tyre ever!

Indoors on carpet it's cactus for me every time.

Going through 2 sets a day sounds like lunacy. It can't be sustainable.
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  #16  
Old 04-06-2018
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HarlowS HarlowS is offline
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National meetings are getting to a stage where you can easily need a set per run to stay on pace.
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Old 04-06-2018
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I was talking to a mate today who did both National days the weekend.

He used 12 pairs over both days.......
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  #18  
Old 04-06-2018
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xfactor View Post
I was talking to a mate today who did both National days the weekend.

He used 12 pairs over both days.......
Assuming he bought loads of spare rims with him, that's £96 just for tyres.

Lunacy.
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  #19  
Old 04-06-2018
jamie5974 jamie5974 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xfactor View Post
I was talking to a mate today who did both National days the weekend.

He used 12 pairs over both days.......
thats stupid numbers.... £96 on tyres is beyond sustainable
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  #20  
Old 04-06-2018
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WHITTLER555 WHITTLER555 is offline
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Hi, just to put a few things straight:

The oOple Off Road Open Series has chosen Schumacher Darts AND Proline Pinpoints.

We have successfully run Pinpoints at all the venues, Ulverston, Broxtowe and Oswestry. A number of the oOple team have run them as their chosen tyre at all three venues so far.

I have run the Harder Z3 compound at two Bury Club meetings and a Southport meeting as well as trying them at all the oOple meetings above and I'm still on the same pair. In fact yesterday at Bury, they were giving so much rear drive and grip I was struggling with quite a bit of understeer!

You can now get a front Proline called a Wedge Squared which looks very much like a Schumacher cut stagger and it works very well, in fact it has grip and hardly any grip roll.

Whilst the Prolines are somewhat more expensive to buy in the first place they last a heck of a lot longer with in my opinion not much drop in performance. I tried them back to back with Darts at Bury yesterday and the Pinpoints were way quicker.

They won't work at every club but for the average club driver and if rules allow, i would invest in a set of Z3 rear Pinpoints and Z3 front Wedge Squared and try them out. You might find you have to alter your cars setup in 2WD as the Pinpoints provide a lot of forward drive.
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