Electric active rollcentres

[Rebelrc]

Would this be classed as active suspension in the brca rulebook ?
Would it be beneficial on track?
Cheers

[DCM]

Schumacher used to have SACS on the front of the 'blade', so unless things have changed, it should be ok (as long as it isn't externally adjustable).

[MHeadling]

Sounds cool!

Good to see Rebels workshop is open for business again !

[Rebelrc]

Sorry I should have explained further
Roll centres that move (powered) when car is steering, then alter for the straight .

[mark christopher]

serpent did this for thier on road cars http://www.serpent.com/news/13127/US...LS-system.html

not sure if it would work for off road

[Ant]

If it is changing the suspension points then, i think, it would be classed as 'active'

[Rebelrc]

Cheers guys
Isn't active suspension classed as reacting it's self ,to change on track

[Rebelrc]

That's cool Mark
I didn't know of this serpent kit
That's the system I've been campaigning for years lol
It's actually a system called camber compensation designed and <patented> by Dax sports cars lol
Should work very well in offroad low grip conditions, do you think?

[DCM]

I think the rule that people are chatting about is this

23.12 The use of sensors fitted to wheels, lay-shafts or suspension units to aid traction control or active
suspension is prohibited. The use of the third channel parameter on a receiver is limited to external power
supply only (no signal circuitry allowed).

So, unless you are using sensors to control damping or suspension geometry and it is a passive system, like SACS on the Fireblade, then ok, the rule was brought in after the 1991 Basildon worlds, with LRP's system which used a gyro and rpm sensors to control wheelspin and steering angle of the servo.

[Rebelrc]

Cheers DCM
So no sensors, no extra servo = legal
Perfect , should be very simple
Many thanks

[DCM]

The way I read it, as long as it is passive, and can not be controlled externally or 'programmed'.

[Rebelrc]

Cheers Steve
By that do you meen, once on track cannot be altered?
Thanks for you help on this mate

[DCM]

Well, you can adjust all your suspension off the track, on the track you can't.

[metalmickey0]

Originally Posted by mark christopher

serpent did this for thier on road cars http://www.serpent.com/news/13127/US...LS-system.html

not sure if it would work for off road

Going by those pics. I dont think it`ll be effective. From what i can see is if the outside wheel raises up it then pushes down on the inside wheel. Which in turn will lean the car even more to the outside of the corner. In my opinion not what you want..That is unless i`m missing something i wont be doing anything like it on mine.

[mark christopher]

Originally Posted by Rebelrc

That's cool Mark
I didn't know of this serpent kit
That's the system I've been campaigning for years lol
It's actually a system called camber compensation designed and <patented> by Dax sports cars lol
Should work very well in offroad low grip conditions, do you think?

Originally Posted by metalmickey0

Going by those pics. I dont think it`ll be effective. From what i can see is if the outside wheel raises up it then pushes down on the inside wheel. Which in turn will lean the car even more to the outside of the corner. In my opinion not what you want..That is unless i`m missing something i wont be doing anything like it on mine.

in the damp/wet it gave amazing grip (i had a version for my xray from Arena rc)
yup dax and there are some vids on youtube of it working on rc

metal, not quite, it does not push the chassis, imagine your wheels are on the flat suface, pic up the front on car and roll to left and right, the wheels will both remain upright with your 1 degree on them, its does not effect shocks/springs (though set up can be changed) simply camber links, it worked so well in the damp with ic as it car max contact patch on any chassis roll.
if you put the car on a flat surface and pushe the chassis up and down its as any conventional suspension, where the wheels do what they do without, its only on chassis roll and on one wheel deflection, in ic on road you remove any roll bars too of it numbs the effect!

these may help

http://youtu.be/5qtu--vh5wc

http://youtu.be/DYjfUyddUkQ

http://youtu.be/VYDuSdeKn-8

[terry.sc]

Originally Posted by metalmickey0

Going by those pics. I dont think it`ll be effective. From what i can see is if the outside wheel raises up it then pushes down on the inside wheel. Which in turn will lean the car even more to the outside of the corner. In my opinion not what you want..That is unless i`m missing something i wont be doing anything like it on mine.

It doesn't push down at all. There is a link attached to each wishbone, but they aren't connected to each other in any way. As the outer suspension compresses when cornering the link pushes the pivot arm the opposite upper link is attached to, which pushes the upper link outwards causing the inner wheel to stay upright as the chassis rolls, or even lean into the corner. At the same time as the inner wishbone drops due to chassis roll it will pull the upper link of the outside wheel inwards, increasing the camber of the outside wheel. It keeps both tyres flatter to the track surface compared with a normal setup.
It means you can run longer/straighter upper links for more traction, but when cornering the links pull both wheels into the corner for more grip.

Useful on road with a fairly constant ride height, but would lead to some very odd handling off road as each time a wheel hits a bump it will push the top of the opposite wheel outwards leading to rapidly changing camber angles.

[terry.sc]

Originally Posted by Rebelrc

Cheers DCM
So no sensors, no extra servo = legal
Perfect , should be very simple
Many thanks

The receiver should only be used to supply power for the third channel, usually this is for your transponder. If your system can work off a battery without being connected to any of the radio gear then it would be legal.

[mro_racing aka Doorbell]

the tekin rc10 mid motor car had this

[Rebelrc]

Cheers Dave
I've never seen that car before
Very interesting

[terry.sc]

The Tekin chassis was also the first race buggy mid motor conversion as well - over 20 years ago. It shows just about everything was tried years ago.

The Tekin system is different to the Serpent one. The Tekin has both upper links attached to a single sliding mount so as the suspension moves straight up and down it has no effect on the upper links, while the Serpent design will move the wheels in and out. The Tekin design has less effect when wheels go over bumps, but will still pull the wheels upright when cornering.