TLR 22 2.0

[Flauschi215]

Nice News from TLR (seen on Facebook)


Making it's debut this week at the 2013 ROAR Electric Off-Road Nationals is the new Team Losi Racing™ 22™ 2.0 buggy.

Go to TLRacing.com for all the info, specs, images and video.



https://www.facebook.com/pages/Team-Losi-Racing/167713576594021?hc_location=stream

[AfroP]

"Go to TLRacing.com for all the info, specs, images and video."

theres no mention of it on the site :P


found stuff here

http://www.redrc.net/2013/08/tlr-22-v2-0-2wd-buggy-kit/

[absolute alignment]

The 2.0 sounds like a std 22 but with most hop up parts from tlr. I wonder what the revised front geometry is? Maybe 5deg caster blocks. Or is there something I'm missing on this? Have they changed something major to get us back on the pace with the good old tank 22

[Gnarly Old Dog]

Finally I can speak about this :-)

There are a lot of small detail changes that have gone into the 22 2.0 It's easy, at first glance, to miss them but they all add up in different ways to making the 2.0 easier to drive and easier to push with.

First up, the most obvious is perhaps the inclusion of several hop up items as standard (threaded hinge pins, alloy front bulkhead, alloy washers etc). The shocks now feature 2 hole 1.6mm machined pistons as standard along with machined shock spacers and X-ring seals and all hinge pins and shock shafts now have that uber sexy dark TiCN coating that the 8ight 3.0 series also has.

The Steering Rack has been tweaked to enable the Ackermann angle to be changed (the inner ball stud is now horizontal and can be shimmed forward / backward) and mid motor owners can now choose to retain their batteries with a new hinge plate that can double up as a Rx or ESC plate.

One of my personal favourites (thanks Frank) is the inclusion of a small retaining screw that now holds the forward rear wishbone pivot block and anti squat shim in place so you can remove the mid car gearbox without the rear suspension falling apart.

The new 6.5inch rear wing is made from ultra thick lexan and there have been subtle revisions to the 22 bodyshape to accommodate the revised battery mounting system (rear motor users can now use a battery brace and thumbscrews as opposed to velcro). Interestingly, there is also mention of a new Cab Forward bodyshell on the options list and my understanding is that the US team have some pre-production versions of these to run at this weekend's US ROAR nationals.

The revised front geometry does indeed feature 5 degree caster blocks along with 4mm trailing axles but it must be noted that these are NEW items and the geometry is significantly different from the older original car.
We've tested this new front geometry for quite some time ;) and the difference is quite startling. Its best summed up as saying that it accommodates a more aggressive driving style and allows the driver to push harder without fear of the car snatching or hooking with the resultant loss of rear traction. This makes the car feel much easier to drive without making it numb or non-reactive. It also affects the way that the car loads up during the corner so again, you benefit from a more consistent feel through longer turns without robbing yourself of any initial sharpness or feel.

I could go on but I think the pictures probably speak more than I can. You can check out more details and look at the pictures here (http://www.horizonhobby.co.uk/autoonline/j29_tlr/j29_kits/j29-tlr03002/j29-22-2.html).

Enjoy :-)

[Cremegg]

the thing that i am most interested in is that mid motor esc mounting brace

im persuming that this part could be bought to fit on the standard tlr 22?

thanks

[Gnarly Old Dog]

I should imagine so. I think you'd need to look at part number TLR232014 primarily although you'd then need some fasteners (it uses the front king pins as the hinge pivot fasteners) and possibly you might have to drill a couple of holes in the old v1 chassis to accommodate the front battery stop moulding. I'm unclear on the last point though - that would be worst case. It could be that the new moulding will use the same holes as the front battery stop on the v1 kits do.

[Danosborne6661]

Shame the gearbox hasn't been altered so it's a bit closer to the rear driveshafts! Some nice changes though

[Cremegg]

thanks for that

if thats the case that would be ideal...as im not a low pro servo fan, my esc is mounted on the slant just above the motor and has a bad habit of coming loose once in a while

so is the new v2 chassis drilled out different from the v1 chassis?

and...is there a price annouced yet for the 2.0?

cheers

[Delves]

thanks for that

if thats the case that would be ideal...as im not a low pro servo fan, my esc is mounted on the slant just above the motor and has a bad habit of coming loose once in a while

so is the new v2 chassis drilled out different from the v1 chassis?

and...is there a price annouced yet for the 2.0?

cheers

The RRP is 278.99.

The chassis is pretty much the same all baring one small detail which is the inclusion of a small hole to hold the suspension carrier (the front one where the anti-squat is adjusted) to make maintenance easier and obviously holes to mount the new battery brace systems for Rear and Mid Motor configurations. Everything else is pretty much the same on the chassis dimension wise.

[Moose]

The revised means that we dont have to dremel the steering parts to get the right hub position now right?
I guess the ackermann plate is great, I tried to make this mod on my own with the old rack but it has very little space for the screws, very nice to get a better solution now :).
Cant wait to get my hands on the machined shock parts. The old shock shaft were the worst I ever had (One run and deep scratches in the shafts) and I hope they are comparable with associated shafts now.
But a few questions:
I saw the differences between the SCT diff outdrives the old 22 ones. Can you explain why they changed the diff outdrives?
Stock springs? Not the new linear ones?
New ball cups? The sct had the ones with HD on them are those stock here too?

[Cremegg]

ah ok thanks

regarding the new mid motor battery/ esc mount TLR232014

thats what im most interested in (so i can actually mount the esc in a decent place)

would this fit straight onto the V1 chassis?

[Gnarly Old Dog]

@Moose.

Not sure what you've been dremelling so can't answer definitively (sorry).
This is not the same as the long camber link that some of the team used if that's what you are referring to?

As for the Ackermann - agreed - there's little room on the existing slider to achieve much in the way of inner ball stud movement. I understand from Frank Root's post that the new rack sees the ball stud mounted higher up than the old one as well as being able to be shimmed. I expect it will be a good tuning aid.

As I understand it, the outdrives were changed to accommodate a final machining op to ensure that the plates were a flat as possible when mounted. For sure, the revised outdrives make for a smooth diff but with care, I've not had a problem with the older, non-machined outdrives.

Springs - yes they are the new LF springs included in the kit as standard (one set for front and one set for rear)

Ball Cups - According to the instructions, ball cups are TLR6018 - so the originals as far as I know.

[Gnarly Old Dog]

ah ok thanks

regarding the new mid motor battery/ esc mount TLR232014

thats what im most interested in (so i can actually mount the esc in a decent place)

would this fit straight onto the V1 chassis?

Can't say for certain until we actually see the v2.0 chassis plate. There is a possibility that the forward battery moulding / battery stop mounting holes are in a different position with the new hinge plate. If this is the case then you would need to re-drill the original chassis to accommodate the new forward stop moulding. Geometry-wise, the chassis is the same though

[diago999]

So is there anything to stop us buying the new 2.0 changed geometry bits (steering/ trailing spindles) and adding them to the standard car?

[Delves]

So is there anything to stop us buying the new 2.0 changed geometry bits (steering/ trailing spindles) and adding them to the standard car?

The new front spindle/caster blocks will fit straight onto the V1 platform if you don't want to buy the new kit, as will the wishbones.

HTH

[Moose]

chassis should be different:
http://www.horizonhobby.co.uk/autoonline/j29_tlr/j29_kits/j29-tlr03002/j29-22-2-image/j29-twentytwo-two-13.jpg
They took a stock chassis and drilled the holes I think. So all shiny holes should be new :)
BTW what is: Adjustable CVA Offset, and thx I looked at the hubs and understand it now. thought the hole hub would be more located downwards.

[Cremegg]

yer looks to be a extra set of holes drilled with the additional hole holding the pivot block in too

so.....touch wood..... that mid motor battery/esc strap should fit on

but only time will tell i guess

Have all the part numbers for the v2.0 be uploaded yet?

i cant seem to find out when this kit is out?

thanks again guys

[Delves]

yer looks to be a extra set of holes drilled with the additional hole holding the pivot block in too

so.....touch wood..... that mid motor battery/esc strap should fit on

but only time will tell i guess

Have all the part numbers for the v2.0 be uploaded yet?

i cant seem to find out when this kit is out?

thanks again guys

Kit should be in the country around September, probably more towards the end of the month.

Here is a link to the manual that will have a spares list in it;

http://www.tlracing.com/ProdInfo/Files/TLR03002_manual.pdf

[Flauschi215]

Front Pivot, HRC, Aluminum: 22/2.0/T/SCT

http://www.tlracing.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=TLR334015


22 2.0 Cab Forward Body and Wing Set, w/Stickers

http://www.tlracing.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=TLR330000


Rear Arm Set: 22/2.0

http://www.tlracing.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=TLR234005


Front Arm Set: 22/2.0

http://www.tlracing.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=TLR234004


Battery Strap, Rear Mtr Carbon Fiber: 22/2.0/T/SCT

http://www.tlracing.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=TLR331010

[diago999]

Delves, what does the tiny little grub screw (TLR6289) that goes into the aluminum front pivot block on page 17 do?

also congratulations on the new layout, (rear motor and then mid motor) much easier to read through :)

Question, can anyone see any issues with using saddles side by side with this new motor brace/battery compartment/flap bit and just using some foam to pad out the end, or modifying it so the post is moved closer?

[Flauschi215]

the new cab forward body
http://www.redrc.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/TLR22-2_0-CabForwardShell.jpg

[Delves]

Delves, what does the tiny little grub screw (TLR6289) that goes into the aluminum front pivot block on page 17 do?

also congratulations on the new layout, (rear motor and then mid motor) much easier to read through :)

Question, can anyone see any issues with using saddles side by side with this new motor brace/battery compartment/flap bit and just using some foam to pad out the end, or modifying it so the post is moved closer?

This screw holds the block in position when you take the gearbox out. With the current car when you remove the gearbox in mid configuration the front suspension carrier moves about and inevitably the wishbones pop out. So this screw will eliminate that happening. Not performance enhancing but certainly makes working on the car easier.

[vrooom]

Look good but i like some part of it...

those ackerman steering rank look strange, it not adjustable for toward to front suspesion but toward to rear of car? it going to be strange. unless im missing something.

Im using exotek steering rank and this has changed my car big time.

I like those slipper clutch and new revised rear brace on mid motor

good jobs losi 22 team! :thumbsup:

[Flauschi215]

http://www.horizonhobby.co.uk/autoonline/j29_tlr/j29_kits/j29-tlr03002/j29-22-2.html#medialink

[Cremegg]

looking through the 2.0 manual

looking like ill need to buy the 2.0 mid motor rear chassis brace (as oppsoed to the TLR4162 Rear Chassis Brace - mid motor from the v1.0) as the new type have the hinges on for the new type esc/battery strap/flap

so hopefully these parts should be able to be bought separatly...

it should slot right into the v1.0 chassis...hopefully

[diago999]

This screw holds the block in position when you take the gearbox out. With the current car when you remove the gearbox in mid configuration the front suspension carrier moves about and inevitably the wishbones pop out. So this screw will eliminate that happening. Not performance enhancing but certainly makes working on the car easier.

I think you misunderstood what I meant,

but I figured it out anyway, its for the new hingepins that hold the front suspension on, there's a corresponding groove which must relate to the grub screw position to stop the hingepins falling out :)

[Frecklychimp]

I think you misunderstood what I meant,

but I figured it out anyway, its for the new hingepins that hold the front suspension on, there's a corresponding groove which must relate to the grub screw position to stop the hingepins falling out :)

They have always been on 22 models, on plastic blocks too ;)

[diago999]

They have always been on 22 models, on plastic blocks too ;)

Don't I feel like a retard :thumbsup:

[Origineelreclamebord]

Sounds and looks good - it's not that different, but to be fair the 22 didn't need a revolution... Some may not like the motor position in mid-motor, or it's sliding steering rack, but I think these are two features that characterize the car - I'm happy to see the car still has these :) and I think the tweaked steering rack may be an indication TLR team drivers have still found a sliding rack better than a bellcrank one with the right adjustments...

The car forward shell is really bad though: They must've been inspired by the bonnet of a car after a collision with a wall... Neither are a pretty sight!

[johnboy]

http://youtu.be/u1UH-oOUUtM. Good video about the car even if alittle long

[Lee24h]

my only gripe with the car is the electronics placement

[Dr Fly]

A couple of thoughts,

How hard and how much do you think it will cost to convert an original 22, not completely, but with some of the nicer features. like the front end geometry and steering. not too bothered about the chassis changers and bleeder shocks.

And does anybody else think the new slipper is a little OTT, kind of like it was designed with a 4wd platform in mind!!

[Moose]

you can just look up all the part numbers you want in the manual and check the local dealer. Our dealer already has all the parts in his list with prices.
Whats special about the slipper? Its just a copy of the old associated 2wd slipper and slipper pads. Dont see why this is a 4WD part...

[Cremegg]

A couple of thoughts,

How hard and how much do you think it will cost to convert an original 22, not completely, but with some of the nicer features. like the front end geometry and steering. not too bothered about the chassis changers and bleeder shocks.

And does anybody else think the new slipper is a little OTT, kind of like it was designed with a 4wd platform in mind!!

I have the same idea...don't want to get a new kit, just some of the parts to upgrade it to a near enough 2.0

How much do you think it would be?

[freddie]

Looks great mine is on order !!

[Flauschi215]

The New Steering Rack with Ackermann Adjustment
https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/1150997_612649388767102_1191723480_n.jpg

Dustin´s Steering Rack @ROAR Nats
https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/1157538_612698865428821_1534752898_n.jpg

[Dr Fly]

I am completely missing something here, The new steering rack the steering turnbuckle balljoint faces backwards, as in the thread is towards the front of the car. But in the picture of Dustins car the balljoint is facing forwards, with some sort of bell assembly, is this the expensive third party steering? Becasue it definatly aint the new one from the v2

Also Dustins car has the Velcro battery straps and not the new plastic holder.

The New Steering Rack with Ackermann Adjustment
https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/1150997_612649388767102_1191723480_n.jpg

Dustin´s Steering Rack @ROAR Nats
https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/1157538_612698865428821_1534752898_n.jpg

[Robby]

I am completely missing something here, The new steering rack the steering turnbuckle balljoint faces backwards, as in the thread is towards the front of the car. But in the picture of Dustins car the balljoint is facing forwards, with some sort of bell assembly, is this the expensive third party steering? Becasue it definatly aint the new one from the v2

Also Dustins car has the Velcro battery straps and not the new plastic holder.

You didn't miss anything,but whatever steering rack Dustin is running you can see it's not the "expensive third party steering" as you can see (BELOW) it's plastic instead of alloy.

According to Todd Hodge - "Now onto the rack versus the bell cranks. During our initial testing we found that the rack was fine. It gave the appropriate Ackerman we were looking for, which is why we included it on the 22 2.0. After the worlds warmup we tested bell cranks, which actually give the car less Ackerman. Less Ackerman is when the outside turning tire turns close to the same rate as the inside tire. More Ackerman is when the inside tire turns at a faster rate than the outside. Less Ackerman actually gives the car a better balance on high grip tracks, such as the worlds track we are racing on this weekend. When I say better balance I mean that the less Ackerman actually gives us less steering compared to the rack. Now on lower bite tracks the rack will most likely be better because it will provide more steering. We discovered all of this entirely too late in the project and couldn't design, tool and include it in the vehicle quick enough. We are looking at the design right now and will start soon. We are still learning about this and collecting data on the 22 2.0."

As you noted, Dustin's car also has the velcro batter strap - along with the original battery stop. He's also got the gen-1 chassis, as you can see there's no milling of the servo mount area to get the servo lower in the chassis like in the 2.0
According to the U.S. forums the team drivers have just been updating their original cars with updated parts as they've become available, and word has it that he was satisfied with the older battery straps and/or hadn't received the updated parts in time and/or didn't feel comfortable using them for the ROAR Nats this week. He has been using the new cab-forward body and new rear-end geometry (3-hole shock tower and rear arms, driveshafts/axles).

The 2.0 also include adjustable off-set rear axle where the axle can be mounted 1mm further into the rear hubs, which causes a less supported rear end and increased forward drive out of turns. For higher grip surfaces, a 1mm spacer is included in the kit to allow the axle to be mounting in the same location as the original 22 for a more supported rear end feel which is also the kit setup.

[Robby]

A couple of thoughts,

How hard and how much do you think it will cost to convert an original 22, not completely, but with some of the nicer features. like the front end geometry and steering. not too bothered about the chassis changers and bleeder shocks.

And does anybody else think the new slipper is a little OTT, kind of like it was designed with a 4wd platform in mind!!

I have the same idea...don't want to get a new kit, just some of the parts to upgrade it to a near enough 2.0

How much do you think it would be?


Here's two 1.0 - 2.0 updates lists I've found - the first being everything (thereby showing it's cheaper just to buy the kit), and the second being just the geometry changed items (what most are probably looking for).
- U.S. Dollar prices, so take exchange rate into consideration -

[Dr Fly]

One final thought then i promise i will stop asking questions. In the video they talk about a new post-heat treating machined outdrive with flatter surface. However looking at the part number in the instruction manual (TLR2955), it is the same as the original. Any thoughts on this?

[Frecklychimp]

One final thought then i promise i will stop asking questions. In the video they talk about a new post-heat treating machined outdrive with flatter surface. However looking at the part number in the instruction manual (TLR2955), it is the same as the original. Any thoughts on this?

it's a running update, Was introduced in 22SCT kit so they have been available since last August/September

same outdrive, just face where drive ring sits has been machined so it's perfectly flat

[Gnarly Old Dog]

The machined plates have been available as part of the complete ball diff kit TLR232000 but if the manual is stating TLR2955 for the outdrives alone then I suspect it's been introduced as an interchangeable running change which means there will be mixed stocks of the old and new versions for a while.

Functionally there is little difference - I've not noticed any performance difference between the machined and non-machined outdrives but theoretically the new ones will be flatter.

I'm happy using either - I have one of the 'new' diffs and one of the old (i always carry a spare) and I can't feel any difference once they're both run in and adjusted correctly but maybe I'm just getting old ;-)

[Robby]

Dakotah Phend takes the 2013 2wd Modified Buggy ROAR U.S. National Championship with new 22 2.0!

[stegger]

Rear motored too on the Worlds track !

[Robby]

Rear motored too on the Worlds track !


Dustin Evans finished 3rd, running a mid-motored 22 2.0 :thumbsup:

[cunawarit]

One of my personal favourites (thanks Frank) is the inclusion of a small retaining screw that now holds the forward rear wishbone pivot block and anti squat shim in place so you can remove the mid car gearbox without the rear suspension falling apart.

That alone makes it worth buying the V2.0! Needing 4 hands when removing the mid-motor gearbox is really the only thing that's made me swear repeatedly with the 22. :)

[MikePimlott]

So they tested bell cranks and they was better on high grip but it was too late to include it in the kit!!!

Will it be an option part ?

[PaulRotheram]

Such a shame theyre releasing this new update and have completely ignored the european market with pretty much every person whos rsn this car have all said the motor needs to be nearer to the outdrives rarther than the country mile it currently is.

[Frecklychimp]

Such a shame theyre releasing this new update and have completely ignored the european market with pretty much every person whos rsn this car have all said the motor needs to be nearer to the outdrives rarther than the country mile it currently is.

The motor position is a myth and an excuse for drivers not being able to set up weight balance in a car using suspension or ballast... when 22 was released it was a noticable difference to other available cars so blamed for the cars handling quirks... all of which come from front end geometry.

Rudebits DB1, Team C TM2 and the 2/4WD Hybrids used at last national... how far away are their motors from outdrives?

what would you wish to achieve by having motor sat next to outdrives?

bellcranks is the key for making this model more driveable on high grip tracks with spikes and fake grass and glad TLR have at least acknowledged it and got bits in the works

[MikePimlott]

bellcranks is the key for making this model more driveable on high grip tracks with spikes and fake grass and glad TLR have at least acknowledged it and got bits in the works

Yep, lets hope the 22 V2.0 EU is here soon lol

[cunawarit]

Such a shame theyre releasing this new update and have completely ignored the european market with pretty much every person whos rsn this car have all said the motor needs to be nearer to the outdrives rarther than the country mile it currently is.

I run a 22 and I am happy to attribute handling issues to my own inability to drive well as well and my set-up ineptitude. You'd never catch me pretending to know more than the Losi technical team. I'd rather judge a car by how it performs in the hands of the pros than my own hands.

[PaulRotheram]

I've never ran the car, nor wish to.. im expressing opinions of most people I know who have ran one and own one.
As already said, its a shame its not been taken on board as its a well known complaint - and off putting to others as its the first thing that's said about the car when spoken about.

[cunawarit]

If Frecklychimp is right and it is merely a myth, then I think there's a good chance that Losi did take it into account and concluded that the European public didn't know best.

[Robby]

I've never ran the car, nor wish to.. im expressing opinions of most people I know who have ran one and own one.
As already said, its a shame its not been taken on board as its a well known complaint - and off putting to others as its the first thing that's said about the car when spoken about.

That was just the talk of those that are looking to "Buy Speed."
They weren't fast with their previous buggy, they weren't fast with the 22, and they weren't fast with their next buggy.

They're the same chaps that come on forums like this looking for set-ups. They don't spend the time working with their cars, trying things so they know how the car reacts - and instead try and rely on others' set-ups, regardless the fact they're not racing on the exact same surface, and regardless the fact their driving style isn't the same as those they're copying.


The motor position is a myth and an excuse for drivers not being able to set up weight balance in a car using suspension or ballast... when 22 was released it was a noticable difference to other available cars so blamed for the cars handling quirks... all of which come from front end geometry.

:thumbsup:

[Robby]

Yep, lets hope the 22 V2.0 EU is here soon lol

But that is precisely what many of the geometry changes in the 2.0 addressed - higher grip surfaces - while maintaining the adjustability to lower traction surfaces that 90% of the rest of the world races on. ;)

[PaulRotheram]

Hopefully it will help, USA are slowly coming to the mid cars now! At the last few ROAR nats a lot were running mid cars, especially the AE team with the centro!

[Robby]

Hopefully it will help, USA are slowly coming to the mid cars now! At the last few ROAR nats a lot were running mid cars, especially the AE team with the centro!

The flip side of this whole argument, you should take a read of any of the U.S. forums. Most of the club level racers, whose tracks aren't high traction, and all pitching a fit over the (sugared) nats track.

Interesting fact, the lad that won the 2wd mod class was running a sort of "in-between" or hybrid car - rear motored, but using most of the other 2.0 upgrades.
As you can see (below) he'd brought a mid-motored car with him, and ran it during practice, and finally settled on his rear-motored car for the race because he said he was more consistent and could be more aggressive driving it.
As Cavalieri and Evans showed with the Centro 4.2 and Mid 22 2.0, they could get in faster flyer laps but it was hard to drive them lap after lap that way.


End of the day, no car is perfect out of the box. Never have been, never will. I've appreciated the running changes they've made over the last 2+ years, from 4mm steering knuckles to fixing the diff, and the 2.0 is just the next step in this progression. :D

[Razer]

That alone makes it worth buying the V2.0! Needing 4 hands when removing the mid-motor gearbox is really the only thing that's made me swear repeatedly with the 22. :)

I did that mod over a year ago with a drill bit, countersink tool and a 3mm tap:P

It so nice to see that TLR have taken all the small details we all automatically alter for the better, and just done it for us! Love it!

[millser]

so all these changes :) will it work for us normal mortals ???????? that is the question

[Gnarly Old Dog]

so all these changes :) will it work for us normal mortals ???????? that is the question

Oh yes for sure.

I can't comment for the entire 2.0 package but for sure, the revised front geometry has a very positive effect on the driveability of the car - making it easier to push with and making it easier to go faster with.

Some of the changes are aimed at making it easier to work on and whilst the shock upgrades will improve the shock performance, it is the front end changes that will make the most significant feeling change over the 1.0

[stegger]

Wished I had stayed with my 22. Loved how strong the car was ! Must admit I did jump to early and should have stuck it out. Other than forward drive which people contributed to the motor position , I thought it was more to do with the slipper. I thought It had a very narrow window of adjustment. Glad they have changed this.

[Gnarly Old Dog]

I think a lot of people wanted the 22 soo badly that it was easy to overlook that as a new platform, it was always going to take time to understand it and to develop a good set up understanding to work from.

The 22 has always been that - a 22 and it drives like a 22 - not like anything else and it is only natural that during it's early development people would focus on what it didn't do comapred to their old rides as opposed to focussing on what it could do that the others couldn't.

The motor position debate has been rumbling on forever but for all those people who want it moved, I'd just like to point out that for every action, there is an equal but opposite reaction and having a design that creates so much forward drive on power is also going to exhibit those same characteristics every time you hit the throttle - even mid way through a sweeper - is that what you really want? Really??.
I can't stop the debate but I'm more than happy that I understand the 22 platform well enough for me to set my car up and for it to be a competitive overall balance that enables me to race to the best of my ability. I'm also confident that I understand it far more now than I did 3 years ago when we first turned some practice laps in the Autumn of 2010 over here.

The 2.0 changes do make that adjustment window wider though - our testing has demonstrated this and Darren has been running part of the new geometry for longer than most people realise;) So if the original was a little too difficult to get right for all conditions then I'm sure that the 2.0 changes will make it more forgiving and easier.

Remember though, they're all only as fast as the driver...

[Frecklychimp]

The 22 had a serious impact on 2WD class when released and gets overlooked IMO...

sudden shock announcement had the definite wow,"want" factor, it was a good slimline looker, cheap, mid & rear config in same box, sexy big bore shocks, ti-nitride bits, aluminium chassis and pivot blocks, lots of tuning options included, brought shorty LiPo's and low profile servo's into mainstream class use, lwb as standard and it came at a time when nothing else was fresh released as such so was definitely the trend to jump on it!

This new updated version looks awesome, when you consider all the upgrades and improvements it's virtually a brand new car with the established TLR high quality and robust strength.

With the recently rumoured 4WD platform i think TLR's time has come, really hope it brings in some more UK top drivers to the team as this speeds up development and helps everyone with the cars to improve.

I'm in :thumbsup:

[cunawarit]

If the most crucial updates are on the front suspension then perhaps a way to achieve most of the gains from the V2 platform is to just buy the front end upgrades? Thoughts? Losi 22 1.5?

[Frecklychimp]

Rear wishbones are recommended, extra inside mounting hole is a past DIY mod that is a good tuning aid,

The new battery brace is only thing i don't like look of as not a fan of mounting speedo up high but i'm pretty sure it will help brace motor guard/gearbox... since i've bent top gearbox screw in past through chassis flex on heavy landing it is a bonus and could offer pointer to future flex tuning hop ups... although velcro is ultra light and simple to use... not carbon fibre bling but not exactly offensive to eyes IMO!

rear hubs will offer different settings too.

tbh getting the full kit has far more advantages overall than just partial upgrades and works out a lot cheaper in long run when you factor in reduced wear rates on new components.

Can already rate the diff upgrades with a big thumbs up from use in 22SCT, silky smooth tungsten balls and much better wear rates on drive rings.

[Robby]

Rear wishbones are recommended, extra inside mounting hole is a past DIY mod that is a good tuning aid

I think I saw on one of the U.S. forums that the team drivers was saying that it's pointless adding the new front end parts (steering knuckles, caster blocks and wishbones) without taking advantage of the new (3-hole) rear wishbones.

I've experimented greatly on ESC mounting, whether it be on the waterfall/tranny brace or flat on the chassis, until I saw someone's modification of the RM ESC mount. While it is high in the car I didn't notice it hurting the handling, and in fact it being amidship in the car I found it better balanced. So perhaps the 2.0 battery hold-down will work out similarly.

I think one of the other biggest changes will be the new shock o-rings and machined spacers. Supposedly they make not only improve the performance of the shocks but also make them leakproof.

But you are right, in the greater scheme of things buying the entire 2.0 kit will prove out more cost effective in the long run.

[mikeyscott]

I was in the process of pretty much selling up 2WD cars and then just thinking of running my existing 4WD car. However I'm sat here thinking maybe give the updated TLR22 2.0 a go and see how I feel.

Reality is I think I only truely enjoy 4WD these days, so equally may leave the TLR22 2.0 until (if) a 4WD arrives.

I never tried a TLR22 and sort of wish I had as they were very good value for money. I suppose too many comments from people saying it's bad etc. As Andy C correctly points out 1) Time to adapt 2) The car is only as good as the driver (which is my downfall). Which is why I think value for money is more important these days for me. I've contacted a shop and they're going to be pricing it at £249.99. Some may argue that it's increased in price too much. Personally I don't know what the pricing of the upgrade parts are, but I'm sure if you got a MK1 22 at the original price and added these parts it'd be more. Some of the current cars in both 2 & 4WD markets are an eye watering amount.

Two cars that I enjoyed over the recent years, Cougar SV and Kyosho RudeBits DB1. Others have just left me thinking, what am I doing this for. Another point from Andy, I think the purchase of these for me and indeed many others will be for the long term. I've been running Kyosho now for circa 2 years before anyone jumps at me.

TBH I'm on the verge of getting my Losi XXCR Kinwald which I ran at the F345s at Coventry running again until the dust has settled, but either way the TLR brand has made me sit up and think.. Currently I've lost what racing is about and in reality not fussed these days.

[Frecklychimp]

I was in the process of pretty much selling up 2WD cars and then just thinking of running my existing 4WD car. However I'm sat here thinking maybe give the updated TLR22 2.0 a go and see how I feel.

Reality is I think I only truely enjoy 4WD these days, so equally may leave the TLR22 2.0 until (if) a 4WD arrives.

I never tried a TLR22 and sort of wish I had as they were very good value for money. I suppose too many comments from people saying it's bad etc. As Andy C correctly points out 1) Time to adapt 2) The car is only as good as the driver (which is my downfall). Which is why I think value for money is more important these days for me. I've contacted a shop and they're going to be pricing it at £249.99. Some may argue that it's increased in price too much. Personally I don't know what the pricing of the upgrade parts are, but I'm sure if you got a MK1 22 at the original price and added these parts it'd be more. Some of the current cars in both 2 & 4WD markets are an eye watering amount.

Two cars that I enjoyed over the recent years, Cougar SV and Kyosho RudeBits DB1. Others have just left me thinking, what am I doing this for. Another point from Andy, I think the purchase of these for me and indeed many others will be for the long term. I've been running Kyosho now for circa 2 years before anyone jumps at me.

TBH I'm on the verge of getting my Losi XXCR Kinwald which I ran at the F345s at Coventry running again until the dust has settled, but either way the TLR brand has made me sit up and think.. Currently I've lost what racing is about and in reality not fussed these days.

I would scratch the itch matey and give it a go if you are tempted.

The extra new upgrades still make this a top spec car for price

I've worked on other brands helping others at tracks and in a mates model shop and component quality wise there is a noticable difference, they are so strong and durable in comparison too, parts are reasonable price wise also.

with this you don't need alloy pin braces, to upgrade diff/thrust balls or ti-nitride pins/shafts, buy extra pistons etc out of the box which suddenly bumps up price of others considerably, you'll have a rear motor car to run if wanted too.

22 in rear motor on a wet/damp grass track is a lot of fun!

[Robby]

:thumbsup:

[Delves]

That's awesome :thumbsup:

[mikeyscott]

I would scratch the itch matey and give it a go if you are tempted.

The extra new upgrades still make this a top spec car for price

I've worked on other brands helping others at tracks and in a mates model shop and component quality wise there is a noticable difference, they are so strong and durable in comparison too, parts are reasonable price wise also.

with this you don't need alloy pin braces, to upgrade diff/thrust balls or ti-nitride pins/shafts, buy extra pistons etc out of the box which suddenly bumps up price of others considerably, you'll have a rear motor car to run if wanted too.

22 in rear motor on a wet/damp grass track is a lot of fun!

V true :)

Rear motor, got my XXCR kinwald for that :) with a TP 7.5 in it!

[Gnarly Old Dog]

I was in the process of pretty much selling up 2WD cars and then just thinking of running my existing 4WD car. However I'm sat here thinking maybe give the updated TLR22 2.0 a go and see how I feel.

Reality is I think I only truely enjoy 4WD these days, so equally may leave the TLR22 2.0 until (if) a 4WD arrives.

I never tried a TLR22 and sort of wish I had as they were very good value for money. I suppose too many comments from people saying it's bad etc. As Andy C correctly points out 1) Time to adapt 2) The car is only as good as the driver (which is my downfall). Which is why I think value for money is more important these days for me. I've contacted a shop and they're going to be pricing it at £249.99. Some may argue that it's increased in price too much. Personally I don't know what the pricing of the upgrade parts are, but I'm sure if you got a MK1 22 at the original price and added these parts it'd be more. Some of the current cars in both 2 & 4WD markets are an eye watering amount.

Two cars that I enjoyed over the recent years, Cougar SV and Kyosho RudeBits DB1. Others have just left me thinking, what am I doing this for. Another point from Andy, I think the purchase of these for me and indeed many others will be for the long term. I've been running Kyosho now for circa 2 years before anyone jumps at me.

TBH I'm on the verge of getting my Losi XXCR Kinwald which I ran at the F345s at Coventry running again until the dust has settled, but either way the TLR brand has made me sit up and think.. Currently I've lost what racing is about and in reality not fussed these days.

There's no way I could promise you that the 22 2.0 will be the answer to your prayers - nor would I try. I think you have some other questions that you need to find answers to before you commit to anything further.
That said, I like driving my 22 - it's responsive and feels alive. I can change a washer and feel the difference. It's not numb and probably not the easiest car to drive but I find it very rewarding every time I put it on the track and it enables me to feel through the Tx how it is reacting to the track - every corner, every bump etc. I've enjoyed the challenge of finding a good setup and I enjoy trying different things and understanding what they do.

I've long since given up racing to win - that doesn't mean to say that I don't try or I don't want to win but I still enjoy the sheer phenomenon of driving a toy car around a circuit connected only through the miracle of radio waves. Challenging my understanding and seeing if I can record MY perfect lap. It still hurts when I lose but win, lose or draw, the feeling I get from my 22 always puts a smile on my face.

[mikeyscott]

All very valid point. I'm in no rush as won't be racing for a while. F2s at TORCH, no racing as hosting etc.

Add work and other factors

[MikePimlott]

Any idea when ?

[Gnarly Old Dog]

They're expected to be here mid/late September. Probably 4-5 weeks from now.

[PaulUpton]

They're expected to be here mid/late September. Probably 4-5 weeks from now.

Cant wait :thumbsup:

are the 4wd's on the same boat :p

[CARB]

I am new to the Losi brand and must say I was very impressed by the Horizon (US) video on YouTube intro for the 2.0.
where is the best place to get a car in the uk and spares back up?
regards

Carb

[cunawarit]

Usually order my Losi stuff from modelsport, wheelspinmodels and ebay. Depending what is cheaper.

[PaulUpton]

DMS Racing as always will have full complement of spares and parts etc :)

[absolute alignment]

I have just ordered all the 2.0 up grade parts from axex models, as I have most of the alloy parts on the car already it was only £35 to get all the geometry bits. Just got to wait for the order to arrive from the states now.

[Gayo]

I still enjoy the sheer phenomenon of driving a toy car around a circuit connected only through the miracle of radio waves. Challenging my understanding and seeing if I can record MY perfect lap. It still hurts when I lose but win, lose or draw, the feeling I get from my 22 always puts a smile on my face.

Well spoken :thumbsup:

[Garry Spice]

I've just seen on fb....the kits are in the uk!

[gijoe64]

22 2.0 kits are shipping now!!!

[vwbjorn]

I just got mine.
Going to start building it now!
They fixed everything i disliked about the 1.0 version.
The 1.0 is great, this new 2.0 is even better than in my dreams.
Can't wait 2 test it :)

[PaulUpton]

Going together like a dream so far.

shocks and gearbox to do :)

[Cremegg]

Going together like a dream so far.

shocks and gearbox to do :)

Where in the uk can I get one from? Most model shops vie contacted said there not out until end of sept still?

Even though horizon hobby uk commented on fb saying there out now

Confused :confused:

[PaulUpton]

Model shops that have ordered should them have them monday. :)

[Gnarly Old Dog]

Where in the uk can I get one from? Most model shops vie contacted said there not out until end of sept still?

Even though horizon hobby uk commented on fb saying there out now

Confused :confused:

Apologies if there's been any confusion.

It's true that when the 22 2.0 was announced, we weren't expecting them to be here in the UK before mid-late September. For a variety of reasons, actual delivery dates are almost impossible to accurately state and so we've tended to err on the side of caution rather than make promises that then can't be fulfilled.

In this instance, some of our order has been received ahead of the main delivery and globally, it was determined that we could get these awesome kits out there and into the hands of the retailers and end-customers ASAP.

If you had one on pre-order with your retailer then I should imagine you should receive it from them shortly. If you talk to your retailer, I'm sure they'll in turn talk to us and we'll dispatch any order from them ASAP.

We're still waiting for the spares (before anyone asks) so we don't have the unique 2.0 parts yet but the kits are here and, as Paul mentions, they go together a dream. I've never built shocks as free as these ones :-)

Either way -they're here - a little earlier than expected and again, if it's caused confusion then I apologise.

[Robby]

:thumbsup:

[Cremegg]

Apologies if there's been any confusion.

It's true that when the 22 2.0 was announced, we weren't expecting them to be here in the UK before mid-late September. For a variety of reasons, actual delivery dates are almost impossible to accurately state and so we've tended to err on the side of caution rather than make promises that then can't be fulfilled.

In this instance, some of our order has been received ahead of the main delivery and globally, it was determined that we could get these awesome kits out there and into the hands of the retailers and end-customers ASAP.

If you had one on pre-order with your retailer then I should imagine you should receive it from them shortly. If you talk to your retailer, I'm sure they'll in turn talk to us and we'll dispatch any order from them ASAP.

We're still waiting for the spares (before anyone asks) so we don't have the unique 2.0 parts yet but the kits are here and, as Paul mentions, they go together a dream. I've never built shocks as free as these ones :-)

Either way -they're here - a little earlier than expected and again, if it's caused confusion then I apologise.

No probs, just ordered mine from apex models

Can't wait :)

I guess you get a few spares with the kit?

[PaulUpton]

https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/1175443_10151761081433449_609660751_n.jpg

[Cremegg]

https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/1175443_10151761081433449_609660751_n.jpg

Very nice Paul

Can't wait for mine.

I'm just excited to use a std shell on the new battery brace lol

Sick of the mid motor brace. My esc kept fallen off

Good build :)

[Cremegg]

I think tlr should of also supplied European kits with an ally mid motor rear camber block as that's what most of us run

My 2 pence lol

[PaulUpton]

I think tlr should of also supplied European kits with an ally mid motor rear camber block as that's what most of us run

My 2 pence lol


I asked Frank from TLR if it was included.

Reason not included, obvious one is would push the cost up and the car is mainly run by people in rear motor around the world.

Paul

[ste_lazzaro]

Any guesses on when the 2.0 spares will be also available?:confused:
I want to make a few mods to my 22T.. starting from the mid motor battery brace (hate the velcro strips)

[cryer-evo]

So it doesn't come with the alloy rear block for mid motor ? That's flipping stupid

[Frecklychimp]

So it doesn't come with the alloy rear block for mid motor ? That's flipping stupid

not really, it's not a vital part, more bling than performance enhancing, plastic one is adequate enough and it keeps kit price more reasonable.

A UK spec car would have been nice but unlikely with size of our market in comparison to USA and other more clay/dirt racing markets

sell the rear motor one included to someone abroad and use proceeds to buy a mid motor one, simples!

[Cremegg]

As spares are not available yet

Do you get any with the kit?

[stretch76]

Anyone know if there will be a conversion kit for a 1.0 to a 2.0. I presume you can convert? Or will it just be a case of buying the parts separately?

[cryer-evo]

not really, it's not a vital part, more bling than performance enhancing, plastic one is adequate enough and it keeps kit price more reasonable.

A UK spec car would have been nice but unlikely with size of our market in comparison to USA and other more clay/dirt racing markets

sell the rear motor one included to someone abroad and use proceeds to buy a mid motor one, simples!

In my experience it is a vital part as its the only thing I have managed to brake and 3 times on my car it's the only week link ��

[Frecklychimp]

In my experience it is a vital part as its the only thing I have managed to brake and 3 times on my car it's the only week link ��

If you used the kit 22 short ball studs with 2mm spacers then they could pull out of plastic block under heavy crashing but that was commonly found early on with the car and replacing with longer TLR ball studs when using thicker shims cured any issues there, same with front camber block.

certainly not a weak spot or design flaw with plastic parts, aluminium option does strengthen this as long as you dry threadlock the ball studs as they can loosen if not checked regular :thumbsup:

[absolute alignment]

Anyone know if there will be a conversion kit for a 1.0 to a 2.0. I presume you can convert? Or will it just be a case of buying the parts separately?

Only Page 2 of this chat there is a parts list to do just that. If you have the hop up parts already on your 22 you only need about £45 worth of spares to get the 2.0 spec on your current car.

[Frecklychimp]

Only Page 2 of this chat there is a parts list to do just that. If you have the hop up parts already on your 22 you only need about £45 worth of spares to get the 2.0 spec on your current car.

Which parts are you choosing for this '2.0 conversion' for £45?

IMO you need the whole list of different 2.0 parts to get the benefit as a package.

Buying just wishbones, hubs, steering rack etc to get the geometry changes isn't going to get you the improved shock action, diff action, slipper action, smoother suspension movement or chassis balance as full 2.0 kit which will make the car a more competitive package.

[millser]

Hi the car sounds and looks good compared to the old, hope it's easier to drive for us mortals :) lol

May have to treat myself when business picks up( have some spare money ) anyone want any business cards flyers etc ;) lol

[absolute alignment]

Which parts are you choosing for this '2.0 conversion' for £45?

IMO you need the whole list of different 2.0 parts to get the benefit as a package.

Buying just wishbones, hubs, steering rack etc to get the geometry changes isn't going to get you the improved shock action, diff action, slipper action, smoother suspension movement or chassis balance as full 2.0 kit which will make the car a more competitive package.

Mr CHimp's, I have just gone for the arms etc as I have host of the hop up parts already, I didn't go for the slipper as mine performs fine or the new bodyas I will wait for mine to be damaged before I get the new one. My car can be viewed as a tlr 22 1.7 maybe!

[xfactor]

Hi All,

Are the bodies available yet,if so who stocks them.

Thanks Mark.

[paulj]

Hi All,

Are the bodies available yet,if so who stocks them.

Thanks Mark.

I was informed that no spares have been shipped from Losi for the 2.0 and I've not seen any advertised. Kits yes, parts no. Apparently there was a chance to get some kits shipped over early before the 27th release date so that is why there are kits around but no spares.

[Robby]

Mr CHimp's, I have just gone for the arms etc as I have host of the hop up parts already, I didn't go for the slipper as mine performs fine or the new bodyas I will wait for mine to be damaged before I get the new one. My car can be viewed as a tlr 22 1.7 maybe!

Before getting my hands on the new 2.0 today I'd have said the same but on closer inspection there are lots of changes all over the car. The new shocks look superb, the chassis is now fully milled out below the servo so it sits lower, there seems to be so many tweaks around the car that very little is left untouched from the original 22!

Has there been changes made to the 2.0 version of the car? Absolutely.
Has there been "very little is left untouched from the original 22"? That's highly exaggerated.

The reality is that many if not most owners have kept up with the running changes that have been made for the car, or upgraded items themselves with aftermarket parts, that many people are going to find the major changes in suspension geometry the only changes necessary.
I don't understand how you can say that the "shocks look superb," since they're visually essentially the same as the old shocks. Other than the bleeder caps, that most people changed out a long time ago (or others find unnecessary), and the new shock shaft coating, they look exactly the same as the original shocks. Otherwise, the major change in the shocks was the internals: pistons, spacers, and x-rings - but many owners have previously addressed these on their own as well.

Yes, the chassis has been milled in the servo area to lower it a millimeter or so - but let's not get carried away suggesting major changes have been made over the entire vehicle as this is far from the truth. ;)

[Robby]

So it doesn't come with the alloy rear block for mid motor ? That's flipping stupid

:rolleyes:
What's "flipping stupid" is to think additional alloy parts wouldn't drastically increase the retail price.
And if price is no object, just buy the flipping thing.

not really, it's not a vital part, more bling than performance enhancing, plastic one is adequate enough and it keeps kit price more reasonable.

A UK spec car would have been nice but unlikely with size of our market in comparison to USA and other more clay/dirt racing markets

sell the rear motor one included to someone abroad and use proceeds to buy a mid motor one, simples!
:thumbsup:

In my experience it is a vital part as its the only thing I have managed to brake and 3 times on my car it's the only week link ��
:thumbdown:
Your "experience" must have been in crashing heavily, very often, because I think you're the only person that I've ever heard of that's broken a mid-motor camber block. So my advice would be in stop blaming the car for the actual weak link, your driving.

[Robby]

Hi All,

Are the bodies available yet,if so who stocks them.

Thanks Mark.

Word has it on the U.S. forums that the cab-fwd body won't be available until next month (maybe even later, following after the spares).
The team drivers are not using it as an end-all, but instead as a "tuning option" depending on the track you're running.

[paulj]

".."

[Razer]

This reminds me of a fantastic discussion with a customer not willing to understand why someone would bother paying a lot more for a Spektrum DX18 QQ radio than a DX18. My response is quite simple.

If you don't know why you should buy it, you have no need to buy it.

All of the changes to the 22 are for me major improvements. One side of things are the option parts and design changes, another is build quality. Even though the shocks look the same, the fact that the coating is better, the o-rings are better, the pistons and bushings are machined and they come with the bleeder caps, should make these shocks able to not just feel ok for a day, but maybe even feel great like Kyosho-shocks, and maybe even outlast them. Back in the day I remember buying Unobtanium shock shafts for my AE, and they outlasted the car, staying supershiny and smooth. With the current TLR-shafts, I change them a lot more often, and they wear pretty bad.

It's just how many small streams make a river. All the improvements and mods we've done over the years, better finish, and even more changes and options, all in one neat package for those buying a 22 now, and for those of us whose 22 is both old, worn and ready for replacement.

I have been urging to clean mine up and putting it on the shelf next to all the trophies it has gotten me, and now I can finally do it.

[xfactor]

Thanks guys for response on body, :( shame its gonna be that late but worth the wait.

[Robby]

This reminds me of a fantastic discussion with a customer willing to pay a lot more for a Spektrum DX18 QQ than a DX18 radio. My response is quite simple.

Who do you think you are Darren Bloomfield or Martin Sørlie?

[Robby]

Ok so I'm not telling the truth then...

Quote from Frank Root of TLR when discussing modifying a 22 to 2.0 spec

"Since the chassis, shocks, diff, hinge pins, axles, body and wing all changed, not to mention half the plastics, it's going to be way cheaper to get a kit."

What I took offense to was in you saying there has been "very little is left untouched from the original 22"?
I said it was highly exaggerated. If you want to interpret that as not telling the truth, then so be it.

But before you start quoting facts and figures stop putting your own spin on what others have said, and check it out yourself. ;)

Frank has openly admitted on the U.S. forums that "the shocks (except for the internals) are essentially the same." Most people that have 22's have long ago addressed the leakage issues, and gone to other brands of 2-hole pistons. People have been upgrading their diffs since this car came out. The wing is essentially the JConcepts 6.5 wing that's been out a year or so, while the body, other than a little larger sidepods, is essentially the same as the original.

If you feel lowering the servo in your car 1mm makes you feel better, then go for it. If you think the change in coating to the shock shafts and hingepins are going to make you faster, good.
Again, this is not a complete redesign here, Frank also said that as well too. Even the cars the team drivers used at the U.S. Nats were NOT complete 2.0 versions, and instead modified 1.0's.
Nothing against Frank here, but he's a project manager, a salesman of sorts. His job is to convince us to buy the new car. Did you think he'd do otherwise?

If you're going to compare the XXX-CR to the original 22 - then yes, very little was left untouched.
But this is more like the change the AE lads went through when going from the B4.1 to the 4.2. Changes, yes - but the absolute need to buy a completely new car, or suggest it'd been completely redesigned, I think is a bit much.


Sure, there are going to be chaps that have completely worn out their 1.0's - but there's also a great number that have kept theirs fresh (or have nearly new ones) in which case the investment in a complete 2.0 isn't a wise choice. And instead they're going to make the more frugal choice of just upgrading the basic geometry pieces, and spend the extra £75-100 on something else.
Is the 2.0 going to be great? Sure it is. But if you were a C-Finals driver with your 1.0 is the 2.0 going to get you into the A-Finals? I don't see it happening.

[Razer]

This reminds me of a fantastic discussion with a customer willing to pay a lot more for a Spektrum DX18 QQ than a DX18 radio. My response is quite simple.

Who do you think you are Darren Bloomfield or Martin Sørlie?

Whoa, easy there. And please copy/paste the quote without leaving out half the sentence.

I'm definitely no Darren Bloomfield, but I do have near 20 years of racing experience and some understanding of the devil in the details. But as with all others, this is just my opinion.

[Robby]

Whoa, easy there. And please copy/paste the quote without leaving out half the sentence.

I'm definitely no Darren Bloomfield, but I do have near 20 years of racing experience and some understanding of the devil in the details. But as with all others, this is just my opinion.

I didn't leave out half the sentence, I fixed it so you could see the ironies. ;)

Yeah, yeah, yeah - everybody's got 20 years of racing experience. So let's keep it to the facts so to not confuse the newbies.

[cryer-evo]

I personally have never Brocken a thing on my car but my girl friend has evon with the long ball studs in it and yes she dose crash often

[Razer]

I didn't leave out half the sentence, I fixed it so you could see the ironies. ;)

Yeah, yeah, yeah - everybody's got 20 years of racing experience. So let's keep it to the facts so to not confuse the newbies.

I'm not exactly sure where you are going with this, but of course, freedom of speech and blah blah:-p

It's still plenty of little improvements on the 2.0 that would be worth it for anyone considering a new car.

[Robby]

I personally have never Brocken a thing on my car but my girl friend has evon with the long ball studs in it and yes she dose crash often

There's an old expression in driving cars, both 1:1 and RC:
"If you crash, it's not the car's fault it breaks. If you crash often, expect to repair just as often."

[paulj]

I'm just wondering if anybody has seen Losi comment about raising the rear chassis under the gearbox?
I know raising the gearbox by 1mm was used as a tuning aid but comparing my old 22 chassis to the 2.0 the rear step is different it certainly looks to be raised up more than the previous 22 chassis. I have seen Frank Root comment in response to a question that raising the gearbox by 1mm is not needed on the 2.0 but nothing about a chassis change at the rear?

[Cremegg]

What does raising the transmission do?

And Paul, can I ask what pistons, spring and oil you are running in the 22 2.0?

Thanks

[paulj]

Hi Cremegg,

raising the transmission improves side bite and traction on corner exit. See here http://losiracing.blogspot.co.uk/2012/01/raising-transmission-in-tlr22-and-22t.html

I've not got my shocks built yet and the few set ups I've seen are split between 2 hole 1.6 and 4 hole #55.
The only mid motor set up posted so far is Dustin Evans ROAR Nationals 3rd place with 4 hole #55's but this is for a sugared in super high grip dirt track - the same one for the worlds - not sure how that transfers to astro or grass?
The strange thing was despite the high grip Dakotah Phend won from 3 with the only rear motor car in the A final! So big win No.1 for the 22 2.0 first time out, but it looks like Losi is testing for a standard steering set up as Dakotah was running what seems to be modified RB6 steering bellcranks.

[Cremegg]

Thanks for that link Paul, explains it very well

I ran 55 40 holes pistons, 25 wt in rear and 30 wt in front and bury yesterday and the car went round very well. This is the setup I had in my old 22

I was asking about the shock setup because there are no setup sheets for astro as of yet...I'm sure there will be soon :)

[Razer]

Finally ready for the worlds:)

[paulj]

Thanks for that link Paul, explains it very well

I ran 55 40 holes pistons, 25 wt in rear and 30 wt in front and bury yesterday and the car went round very well. This is the setup I had in my old 22

I was asking about the shock setup because there are no setup sheets for astro as of yet...I'm sure there will be soon :)

How did you find it compared to the old 22?

Oh and just a heads up I had a quick look at Martin's blog (Razer) might be worth addressing questions about shocks to Martin as he runs on grippy bumpy astro plus he has been running 2 hole 1.6mm pistons for a while now. Hi Razer :thumbsup:

[PaulUpton]

https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/535892_10151782228298449_37548642_n.jpg

mine ready to go :thumbsup:

[Cremegg]

It's was very good to be honest....a lot better than the old one

Going to run it at southport next weekend and see how it handles the bumps on the back section

Here's my 22 2.0 :thumbsup:

[Cremegg]

Can anyone tell me if the exotek steering rack will still fit in the 22 2.0?

Never mind.....just seen the price haha

[Razer]

How did you find it compared to the old 22?

Oh and just a heads up I had a quick look at Martin's blog (Razer) might be worth addressing questions about shocks to Martin as he runs on grippy bumpy astro plus he has been running 2 hole 1.6mm pistons for a while now. Hi Razer :thumbsup:

I've love the 1.6 pistons. I feel the car is less sensitive to the small bumps, yet still lands the big ones well, and has enough pop on the jumps. I stopped testing with four hole pistons quite quickly though, and I'm not really one to test a lot of shock stuff if I feel comfy with what I got. I'm really looking forward to trying the car now, with the new geometry, o-rings and shafts. Just the LF springs helped the handling a lot, so it should be superplush and easy to drive now.

I'm off to the worlds soon though, so there won't be any astro testing until maybe a sunny october day, unless the snow has fallen already.

I'll try to keep my blog more updated again in the following months:-)

[Cremegg]

Cool, thanks man

Can I ask a quick question too
Regarding the HRC & LRC toe plate

What do the degrees mean on them?

Eg 3.5 deg LRC

Thanks

[Razer]

Cool, thanks man

Can I ask a quick question too
Regarding the HRC & LRC toe plate

What do the degrees mean on them?

Eg 3.5 deg LRC

Thanks

That is the amount of toe in you get;-)

[Razer]

My car is ready for the Silver Dollar Raceway:)

http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3783/9714836375_6fb5216ce0_c.jpg
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7381/9709011931_ebd57034b6_c.jpg

[CARB]

3 degrees toe in and low roll centre, check out roll centre on google

[paulj]

I'm just wondering if anybody has seen Losi comment about raising the rear chassis under the gearbox?
I know raising the gearbox by 1mm was used as a tuning aid but comparing my old 22 chassis to the 2.0 the rear step is different it certainly looks to be raised up more than the previous 22 chassis. I have seen Frank Root comment in response to a question that raising the gearbox by 1mm is not needed on the 2.0 but nothing about a chassis change at the rear?

Well I can now confirm that the rear of the chassis has been raised higher than the V1 Losi 22 chassis by aprox 1mm. Anybody wanting to use the old Cream mid motor weight will now need to run at least 2 degrees of anti squat, possibly as much as 2.5 degrees before the weight will clear the revised rear kick up. I've PM'ed Cream about the issue so no doubt a revised block will be sorted soon.

[Cream]

Well I can now confirm that the rear of the chassis has been raised higher than the V1 Losi 22 chassis by aprox 1mm. Anybody wanting to use the old Cream mid motor weight will now need to run at least 2 degrees of anti squat, possibly as much as 2.5 degrees before the weight will clear the revised rear kick up. I've PM'ed Cream about the issue so no doubt a revised block will be sorted soon.


Yep V2 will be ready soon, along with the added m2 holding screw.

[Jaune]

Frank's response on the 2.0 chassis (from RCTECH) So I guess its just a clearance issue.
I was reading on another forum, and someone posted that the 2.0 chassis has an additional 1mm of step-up compared to the 1.0
Can Frank or someone attest to this, or is just another rumor?


This is not correct. The new chassis has ONLY the following changes:

1. Additional pocketing under the servo.
2. 2 additional holes for the new battery tray in the shorty location.
3. 1 additional hole for the M2 x 8mm Front Anti-Squat pivot block.
4. Added TLR laser etching behind servo pocketing.

Everything else is unchanged.

[jaydits]

i have an higher chassis of the 1.0 version
last year
i could not get the chassis to work either there was to much tension when i put it together in the back
just bought a new one and that was fine
my 2.0 chassis are both the same as the 1.0 rear
i tried to lower it but its to hard
https://www.dropbox.com/s/sm6nwxtxanp9011/2013-04-27%2011.30.35.jpg

[paulj]

i have an higher chassis of the 1.0 version
last year
i could not get the chassis to work either there was to much tension when i put it together in the back
just bought a new one and that was fine
my 2.0 chassis are both the same as the 1.0 rear
i tried to lower it but its to hard
https://www.dropbox.com/s/sm6nwxtxanp9011/2013-04-27%2011.30.35.jpg

My V1 chassis is the same as the one to the right in your picture with a lower step, in fact I have had two other V1 chassis and both were the lower type. Until I bought my 2.0 I had not seen that version of the chassis - the one on the left in your picture - so thought it was a change coming with the 2.0 but it sounds like it may have been a running change to the V1?

[Ron Burgundy]

Is the new cab forward body available yet?

[PaulUpton]

original estimate was mid October for cab forward shell, but I have just checked the TLR website and it says available so maybe on the way

[PaulUpton]

Just found out 6-8 weeks for cab forward shell I'm afraid

[Cremegg]

Hello, I have 2 questions

1. Are the 2.0 spares available yet?

2. Does anyone have any astro setups yet as I can't see to find any?

Thanks :)

[PaulUpton]

Think most plastic parts are avaliable now

[Ron Burgundy]

Thanks paul, ill continue with Pro-Line bulldog in the meantime :) cheers!