Remember 9/11

[Chequered Flag Racing]

well tomorrow is 999 (09/09/09)

hope it doesn't happen tommorrow in the UK :woot:

wonder if the country is on high alert

[David Church]

Good point!!!! never even thought of it till I saw this......:(

[Big G]

it won't happen tomorrow as there are no new wars that need to be started so the UK won't fly their own planes into their buildings and blame it on someone else.

but don't get me started on my views and opinions of 9/11 :blush:

[Kopite]

that's quite a conspiracy theory :confused:

[Chequered Flag Racing]

here's what the Home Office have to say


The current terrorism threat level is Substantial
This means that a terrorist attack is a strong possibility.


http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/counter-terrorism/current-threat-level/

[bodgit]

No disrespect to the dead but this is history. The usa dropped the bombs in japan and killed far more people. I,d rather remember the 200+ dead British soldiers that died fighting for the yanks.

[Lee]

it won't happen tomorrow as there are no new wars that need to be started so the UK won't fly their own planes into their buildings and blame it on someone else.

but don't get me started on my views and opinions of 9/11 :blush:


I don't think that even Bush wanted to fight that much :lol:

Have you ever thought about writing a novel :woot:

[NeilD]

I visited ground zero around three years ago. It's quite possibly the bleakest most eerie place i have visited. It's was so quiet and the names of the 4000+ people who died were all listed on a giant plaque. It may be history but it should never be forgotten...

[Nick Goodall]

I visited ground zero around three years ago. It's quite possibly the bleakest most eerie place i have visited. It's was so quiet and the names of the 4000+ people who died were all listed on a giant plaque. It may be history but it should never be forgotten...

I saw all of that too July 07 but went back this Christmas and it's all completely changed now, they've got rid of the big time-line they had up where the Subway used to be, and all general memorium stuff has been moved to another area now.

To be honest it feels much more positive now and there's pics up of the new buildings that have been designed, it looks like it's going to be even more impressive then the original trade centre so fair play to them for that.

I really really don't like all the conspiracy theories that are around, sometimes people just have to accept that bad things happen and it's not always some big Government cover up (as much as you want to believe it)!

When you see those two absolutely massive towers collapsing though, it's actually quite incredible how many people survived compared to the number that sadly lost their lives!

[burgie]

I have been watching the Channel 4 "documentaries" this week regarding 9/11...they have been truly superb and quite a moving reminder of the events of that day.

9/11 can never be forgotton - after all it was the day that truly changed the world...and not for the better, regardless of which conspiracy theory you believe in!

[NeilD]

[quote=Nick Goodall;283900]I saw all of that too July 07 but went back this Christmas and it's all completely changed now, they've got rid of the big time-line they had up where the Subway used to be, and all general memorium stuff has been moved to another area now.

To be honest it feels much more positive now and there's pics up of the new buildings that have been designed, it looks like it's going to be even more impressive then the original trade centre so fair play to them for that.

I really really don't like all the conspiracy theories that are around, sometimes people just have to accept that bad things happen and it's not always some big Government cover up (as much as you want to believe it)!

I would like to see how it looks now because back then it was pretty desperate. The timeline was a an amazing set of photo's showing the chaos. I remember seeing a photo of a NYFD officer pulling someone out of one of the towers, the caption underneath read this officer would be dead ten minutes later. I honestly don't think i will ever forget that guys face. So many truly brave people gave their lives trying to help others.

I also agree with you there wasn't any conspiracy it was a sick terrrorist attack and i hope the new tower stands taller and prouder as a sign of defiance against these terrible people.

[bodgit]

When they do build the new tower how many people do you think will want to work there. It is going to be the number one target for all terrorists worldwide to bring it down. You would spend every day wondering if history would repeat itself.

[footey]

not getting into a debate about the 911 as it should always be rembered but as for a conspiracy then if you watch a documentry ive seen it explanes so much and will defo get u thinking that maybe it wasnt a terrorist attack

[NeilD]

Shane, i've watched endless hours worth of documentaries both for and against the conspiracy theory. I'm 100% certain this was a terrorist attack nothing more.

[burgie]

I think I know the documentary that you mean Shane, is it the one that describes how seemingly the majority of the business/government district of Washington is owned by Arabs?

That is a very interesting documentary indeed and one that strangely seems not to get repeated!

[Nick Goodall]

Shane, i've watched endless hours worth of documentaries both for and against the conspiracy theory. I'm 100% certain this was a terrorist attack nothing more.

Yeah me too, i think there was a film / documentary called Loose Change but i've also seen one that completley dispells any thoughts of it being a Consipriacy. If you think how much time and planning it would take to carry out something like this "from the inside" someone would have cracked by now or slipped up somewhere and the truth would have come out.

It was far to big to have been orchestrated by the US Gov't, there's no way they would have done that to their own people (no matter how low you think they'd go)!

[bodgit]

A pilot would to say the least be a pretty intelligent man. I cant possibly see any such person saying "yes sir mr bush my buddies and I dont mind crashing our airlines jets into the towers and killing ourselves"

[NeilD]

Yeah me too, i think there was a film / documentary called Loose Change but i've also seen one that completley dispells any thoughts of it being a Consipriacy. If you think how much time and planning it would take to carry out something like this "from the inside" someone would have cracked by now or slipped up somewhere and the truth would have come out.

It was far to big to have been orchestrated by the US Gov't, there's no way they would have done that to their own people (no matter how low you think they'd go)!

Exactly right, Bush maybe an idiot but he and his advisors wouldn't kill their own people and if they had it would be impossible to contain it. If you look at America's history it has a few conspiracy theory's, from the moon landings to JFK. Sometimes though you just have to face reality and the reality here is it was a terrible, terrible terrorist attack.

[NeilD]

A pilot would to say the least be a pretty intelligent man. I cant possibly see any such person saying "yes sir mr bush my buddies and I dont mind crashing our airlines jets into the towers and killing ourselves"

The Taliban flew the planes. They removed the pilot and flew it themselves.

[bodgit]

The Taliban flew the planes. They removed the pilot and flew it themselves.

Which is what I said. No us pilots were involved.

[NeilD]

Which is what I said. No us pilots were involved.

Sorry, i read it the wrong way. Yes you did say that.:)

[footey]

the 1 ive seen the first thing that gets said is years before the 9/11 the usa wanted to fly a remote plane into colubia and crash it which means no pilots needed ive got a copy of the docmentry and will defo lend to anyone i know who wants to watch it


it also tells u about the plane that hit the pentogon and shows footage and stuff it is well worth watching


and also tells how the people incharge took the sniffer dogs out the towers aweek before the planes hit { these sniffer dogs sniffed out explosives normally }

[footey]

also says aday after 9/11 binladen was in amercan milatry base having medical treatment

[Nick Goodall]

the 1 ive seen the first thing that gets said is years before the 9/11 the usa wanted to fly a remote plane into colubia and crash it which means no pilots needed ive got a copy of the docmentry and will defo lend to anyone i know who wants to watch it


it also tells u about the plane that hit the pentogon and shows footage and stuff it is well worth watching


and also tells how the people incharge took the sniffer dogs out the towers aweek before the planes hit { these sniffer dogs sniffed out explosives normally }

Yeah but sniffer dogs going in the towers doesn't mean anything - There are always sniffer dogs at Airports but it wouldn't be something you thought back to if suddenly a bomb went off at Heathrow etc....

I've heard all the stories about the Pentagon and how it was missile shaped, but think about it - a Plane is basically missile shaped so it's not really a surprise....

Anyway, i don't really want to get into argueing about it as i think the main purpose of this thread was to remember those that died and just think back to how shocking it was - i too hope we never see anything else like this!

[footey]

i meant the dogs was always in the towers and a week before the incodent they was removed just seems strange

[NeilD]

i meant the dogs was always in the towers and a week before the incodent they was removed just seems strange

Even so mate the dogs wouldn't stop a couple of planes crashing into them.

[bigred5765]

shane do you believe in ufo's too lol

[MatJohnson]

Footey, that documentary is repeated on Thursday at 10pm on Nat Geo int it?

[MRD]

As regards to this kind of attack happening again its extremely unlikely. Now the US is wise to it I bet they could have a rouge plane taken out of the sky in minutes. Any new attack will have to be so out of the ordinary that no one would think it could ever happen.

[footey]

NO i dont belive in ufos but things arnt always as simple as first thought


i also hope nothing happens like this again and im not saying it wasnt terrorist attacks i said in my first post that things make u think :confused:

we will never know the whole truth about everything in this world OR EVEN OUT OF IT IN CARLS CASE { UFOS}

[Big G]

I assume you're talking about Loose Change where it says no other building in the world has ever fallen down after a plane has hit it. Even 1 building similar to the twin towers was on fire for 24hrs and didn't fall down. yet 2 buildings fall down within 10 minutes of being hit.

the damage to the pentagon was all in an area where no personnel were present. and the hole the 'plane' left was a circle not a plane shaped hole. also those massive engines made out of a metal that burns at some stupid temperature with is impossible for aircraft fuel to burn hot enough were never found.

The 'plane' that went down in the forest was never found. just a massive hole of scrap. no other planes that crash end up like that. also there was something about seeing one of the planes involved months later and all the apparent passengers leaving the plane.

another part covers the use of mobile phones being used to call people in 2001, yet in 2004 USA spends millions developing the technology for mobiles phones to work in planes so high up. why when they worked perfectly in 2001.

It's not that I don't care about all the loss of life, but I don't believe it was Bin Laden, etc doing it. A terrorist attack certainly, but from America on itself imo

[ashleyb4]

[quote=Nick Goodall;283900]I saw all of that too July 07 but went back this Christmas and it's all completely changed now, they've got rid of the big time-line they had up where the Subway used to be, and all general memorium stuff has been moved to another area now.

To be honest it feels much more positive now and there's pics up of the new buildings that have been designed, it looks like it's going to be even more impressive then the original trade centre so fair play to them for that.

I really really don't like all the conspiracy theories that are around, sometimes people just have to accept that bad things happen and it's not always some big Government cover up (as much as you want to believe it)!

I would like to see how it looks now because back then it was pretty desperate. The timeline was a an amazing set of photo's showing the chaos. I remember seeing a photo of a NYFD officer pulling someone out of one of the towers, the caption underneath read this officer would be dead ten minutes later. I honestly don't think i will ever forget that guys face. So many truly brave people gave their lives trying to help others.

I also agree with you there wasn't any conspiracy it was a sick terrrorist attack and i hope the new tower stands taller and prouder as a sign of defiance against these terrible people.

Its in most people's human nature. They where truely brave. Ive watched a couple of the documentarys and it is sad. But We learn from ours and others mistakes.

A

[Nick Goodall]

I assume you're talking about Loose Change where it says no other building in the world has ever fallen down after a plane has hit it. Even 1 building similar to the twin towers was on fire for 24hrs and didn't fall down. yet 2 buildings fall down within 10 minutes of being hit.

the damage to the pentagon was all in an area where no personnel were present. and the hole the 'plane' left was a circle not a plane shaped hole. also those massive engines made out of a metal that burns at some stupid temperature with is impossible for aircraft fuel to burn hot enough were never found.

The 'plane' that went down in the forest was never found. just a massive hole of scrap. no other planes that crash end up like that. also there was something about seeing one of the planes involved months later and all the apparent passengers leaving the plane.

another part covers the use of mobile phones being used to call people in 2001, yet in 2004 USA spends millions developing the technology for mobiles phones to work in planes so high up. why when they worked perfectly in 2001.

It's not that I don't care about all the loss of life, but I don't believe it was Bin Laden, etc doing it. A terrorist attack certainly, but from America on itself imo

Believing what you see in a Film though is surely more questionable then the attacks being done by Al Qaeda?

That film was still just a load of theories, no proof about anything. There was another theory about the Pentagon that a Wheel and an Engine were found but were from different planes, so to be honest that shows how much people make sh*t up by one hand saying there was no engine, another saying there was.

The point is that none of the theroies have been proven, and there are so many different ones out there that i would always have to believe what happened was literally a terrorist attack and not some huge evil ploy by the US Gov't to give them an excuse to attack Al Qaeda.......

It's no different to the 07/07 London Bombings, these "fanatics" are deluded idiots convinced by some extremists that they should carry out these awful attacks to give themselves a better after life.

I think any of the people that lost friends / family & loved ones would be absoultely furious at these theories as it really degrades everything those brave men and women did on 9/11.

[NeilD]

I totally agree with you Nick, as i've said before people love a conspiracy theory especially in America. This simply wasnt' an "inside job" it was a terrible act of terrorism by the Taliban to make people aware of their hatred of the US. American security prior to 9/11 was shoddy to say the least and this enabled the fanatics to plan and execute this act quite easily. American security might now seem a little ott however after such a large scale attack, on probably the most famous city in the World, it is fully understandable. Lets respect the dead and their families and end this talk of conspiracy.

[telboy]

Last night I watched the one from monday night, the one with all the 102mins of eyewitness footage. That was pretty good. Very different view of things.

I heard that the one that landed in the field had no 'plane like' remains too. Apparetly there wasn't even seats and stuff like luggage found, which would have been on board. Noramlly these things are found in that sort of crash.

When you watch all the things on tv and the internet and read all the reports, it does make you think.
But I know I deffo wouldn't have wanted to be anywhere near it when it happened.

[DaveG28]

Last night I watched the one from monday night, the one with all the 102mins of eyewitness footage. That was pretty good. Very different view of things.

I heard that the one that landed in the field had no 'plane like' remains too. Apparetly there wasn't even seats and stuff like luggage found, which would have been on board. Noramlly these things are found in that sort of crash.

When you watch all the things on tv and the internet and read all the reports, it does make you think.
But I know I deffo wouldn't have wanted to be anywhere near it when it happened.

I'm not sure too many plane crashes have involved the plane under power accelerating into the ground, that is probaly why so little was found in that instance? Most plane crashes are either stalls or breakups or pilots trying desperately to pull it out, in all those cases the liklihood is impact speed would be much lower.

Sadly I am not convinced security is really that much better now, but we can only hope/pray it is, and try never to forget.

[migsy]

shane do you believe in ufo's too lol

their certainley around, i look after one of them in wales.

[Lee]

I'm not sure too many plane crashes have involved the plane under power accelerating into the ground, that is probaly why so little was found in that instance? Most plane crashes are either stalls or breakups or pilots trying desperately to pull it out, in all those cases the liklihood is impact speed would be much lower.

Sadly I am not convinced security is really that much better now, but we can only hope/pray it is, and try never to forget.

Oh it is Dave I got all my stuff taken off me 2 weeks ago because the clear plastic bag they gave me the week before was too big WTF !

I didn't realise the bigger the bag got the more explosive it was.

[DCM]

I assume you're talking about Loose Change where it says no other building in the world has ever fallen down after a plane has hit it. Even 1 building similar to the twin towers was on fire for 24hrs and didn't fall down. yet 2 buildings fall down within 10 minutes of being hit.

the damage to the pentagon was all in an area where no personnel were present. and the hole the 'plane' left was a circle not a plane shaped hole. also those massive engines made out of a metal that burns at some stupid temperature with is impossible for aircraft fuel to burn hot enough were never found.

The 'plane' that went down in the forest was never found. just a massive hole of scrap. no other planes that crash end up like that. also there was something about seeing one of the planes involved months later and all the apparent passengers leaving the plane.

another part covers the use of mobile phones being used to call people in 2001, yet in 2004 USA spends millions developing the technology for mobiles phones to work in planes so high up. why when they worked perfectly in 2001.

It's not that I don't care about all the loss of life, but I don't believe it was Bin Laden, etc doing it. A terrorist attack certainly, but from America on itself imo

Right, lets get some things straight... the reason why the Tower collapsed, is that the two aircraft were fully laden with Avtar (aviation fuel), so when it hit the tower, the fuel burnt at such an intensity, and the design contruction of the tower, meant that a certain amount of damage could be withstood, but the heat at which the flames burnt, due to the fuel (as the fuel doesn't explode, it burns), it managed to weaked the steel backbone girders of the tower, these weaked, and it then became a house of cards, and once it started, it was just a matter of time.

Right, after spending a few years, working alongside the Millitary Aircraft Recovery Team, whose job is to transport dead airframes, if there is enough fuel, then all that is left, is a mangled mess at the best of times, don't forget, the aircraft that landed into the tree's wasn't a controlled crash landing (nose up, u/c up, throttled back), it was flown in.

Jeez, guys, what happened then, changed the way the world looked at terrorism, and, with America thinking they were all but free from assault from the air, it was a massive shock. You can read conspiracies into most major, world changing situations, but generally, they are the actions of a few, determined, intelligent and rather mad people.

[DCM]

As regards to this kind of attack happening again its extremely unlikely. Now the US is wise to it I bet they could have a rouge plane taken out of the sky in minutes. Any new attack will have to be so out of the ordinary that no one would think it could ever happen.

no, the USA is just as open to attack now, as they were then.

[DaveG28]

Oh it is Dave I got all my stuff taken off me 2 weeks ago because the clear plastic bag they gave me the week before was too big WTF !

I didn't realise the bigger the bag got the more explosive it was.

Thats kind of my point, its arbitrary. For about 2 years after the Richard Reid Shoe smoking incident they were obsessed with shoes and nothing else. Well, not being funny but the terrorists would have probably tried something different by then. Same deal with the liquids issue after this recent plot. Our port security is 100% based on stopping them doing what they've done before, not on thinking about what they could try and do and stopping that!

[DaveG28]

Right, lets get some things straight... the reason why the Tower collapsed, is that the two aircraft were fully laden with Avtar (aviation fuel), so when it hit the tower, the fuel burnt at such an intensity, and the design contruction of the tower, meant that a certain amount of damage could be withstood, but the heat at which the flames burnt, due to the fuel (as the fuel doesn't explode, it burns), it managed to weaked the steel backbone girders of the tower, these weaked, and it then became a house of cards, and once it started, it was just a matter of time.

Right, after spending a few years, working alongside the Millitary Aircraft Recovery Team, whose job is to transport dead airframes, if there is enough fuel, then all that is left, is a mangled mess at the best of times, don't forget, the aircraft that landed into the tree's wasn't a controlled crash landing (nose up, u/c up, throttled back), it was flown in.

Jeez, guys, what happened then, changed the way the world looked at terrorism, and, with America thinking they were all but free from assault from the air, it was a massive shock. You can read conspiracies into most major, world changing situations, but generally, they are the actions of a few, determined, intelligent and rather mad people.

On your first point, I think I remember reading that a key problem was the plane going through the tower blew all the fire walls out, so the fuel then spilt across the whole width of the building, and as you say, it burns hot enough to damage the inegrity of the steel.

[DaveG28]

no, the USA is just as open to attack now, as they were then.

As are we, the only reason the other effort to blow up the tube failed was because the bombs didnt work, it was still easy for them to do it.

[DCM]

As are we, the only reason the other effort to blow up the tube failed was because the bombs didnt work, it was still easy for them to do it.

Actually, fighting terrorism, is mostly about luck, chancing on some information, and working from that. You will never be able to fight terrorism, just minimise it's impact. Just remember, for a terrorist to be succesfull, they don't have to damage anything, just the matter of disrupting our daily routine, and affecting the community, can sometimes be enough.

I remember working on a Base, and we had a disgruntled ex-builder, phoning bomb threats, cost, tens of thousands in lost production, and was very scary.