LiPo - things to consider?

[patchfoo]

I am very new to R/C cars. I have a 4WD 1/10th buggy - Tamiya Durga DB01. I built it completely with stock standard (basic) parts which I am now hoping to upgrade. I am looking for an upgrade to get more speed/acceleration and the way I see it I have two options:
1. Upgrade the motor (brushless I assume)
2. Upgrade to a LiPo pack

What approx speed upgrades would I get for each?

I like the idea of upgrade to LiPo packs because I want to get a secondary battery anyway.

What things are there to consider when doing this upgrade? I know I will need to get a new charger because mine is only for NiCd and NiMH. Is that all I will need? I think I read somewhere that you need a better ESC or some other electronic part when switching to LiPo. Also, my buggy has space for traditional 6 cell packs but LiPo doesn't come that way. Is there a specific type of LiPo I will need?

Any help is much appreciated! Thanks!

[emtee]

I am very new to R/C cars. I have a 4WD 1/10th buggy - Tamiya Durga DB01. I built it completely with stock standard (basic) parts which I am now hoping to upgrade. I am looking for an upgrade to get more speed/acceleration and the way I see it I have two options:
1. Upgrade the motor (brushless I assume)
2. Upgrade to a LiPo pack

What approx speed upgrades would I get for each?

I like the idea of upgrade to LiPo packs because I want to get a secondary battery anyway.

What things are there to consider when doing this upgrade? I know I will need to get a new charger because mine is only for NiCd and NiMH. Is that all I will need? I think I read somewhere that you need a better ESC or some other electronic part when switching to LiPo. Also, my buggy has space for traditional 6 cell packs but LiPo doesn't come that way. Is there a specific type of LiPo I will need?

Any help is much appreciated! Thanks!

It really is a toss-up mate... A brushless(BL) motor will need a BL esc and usually this will come with lipo cut-off in the software... you can still use a nimh/nicd(!?) pack with a BL esc/motor combo but you will still have the drop-off/dump associated with these type of cells tho' the initial speed will be higher compared to brushed+nimh/nicd...

HOWEVER... using lipo with your existing brushed combo will give a definite acceleration/top speed improvement but you will need a "stand-alone" lipo alarm which can be bought very cheaply on a well known auction site.. (search for lipo alarm... duh!:thumbsup:) this cut-off alarm is important because if you discharge a lipo cell too low it may become unstable and/or unusable... you can also find chargers that will do all cell types in one unit, and once again these are to be found you know where!! look for one that has lipo "balance leads" built in...

On the Q. of cell shape there are lipo cells with moulded cases that mimic the shape of a traditional (i.e.[][][][][][] )6 cell nimh/nicd(!) so will slip straight in... you can also get lipo cells that looks like the Tamiya type(i.e. === ) cell...

Hope this helps fella!! :rolleyes::blush:

[peetbee]

Any stick pack lipo will fit the DB01 (unless dimensions are silly large!), it doesn't need to have the mouldings to look like nimhs.

[patchfoo]

It really is a toss-up mate... A brushless(BL) motor will need a BL esc and usually this will come with lipo cut-off in the software... you can still use a nimh/nicd(!?) pack with a BL esc/motor combo but you will still have the drop-off/dump associated with these type of cells tho' the initial speed will be higher compared to brushed+nimh/nicd...

HOWEVER... using lipo with your existing brushed combo will give a definite acceleration/top speed improvement but you will need a "stand-alone" lipo alarm which can be bought very cheaply on a well known auction site.. (search for lipo alarm... duh!:thumbsup:) this cut-off alarm is important because if you discharge a lipo cell too low it may become unstable and/or unusable... you can also find chargers that will do all cell types in one unit, and once again these are to be found you know where!! look for one that has lipo "balance leads" built in...

On the Q. of cell shape there are lipo cells with moulded cases that mimic the shape of a traditional (i.e.[][][][][][] )6 cell nimh/nicd(!) so will slip straight in... you can also get lipo cells that looks like the Tamiya type(i.e. === ) cell...

Hope this helps fella!! :rolleyes::blush:

Thanks for all the great info.

Would a BL motor come with an ESC? (As I said, I don't know much yet...) Do you know a website where I could look this stuff up? I've looked around, but I never know whatever everything is referring to or what works with what. It sounds like if I go this route, then I won't need a lipo alarm...

Do the connectors on LiPos fit with what I currently have? Every picture I look at looks different and I don't see how they will be able to work together.

Last question (for now). Do I need a 2S, 3S, 4S, or what? It seems like 2S is standard but 3S might be faster, as long as it fits with my set up?

Thanks again!!

[Bungleaio]

You don't have to go brushless, picking up 2nd hand modified or even stock motors can give you quite a cheap boost in speed.

Brushless and lipo will give you the most speed with minimal maintenance though.

There's combo systems out there a few people have the losi system I'm not sure if they have a lipo cut off, I should imagine they do. http://www.modelsport.co.uk/?CallFunction=ShowSpecification&ItemID=30214

You'll want a 2s lipo, you might be able to pick one up 2nd hand for a reasonable price from the for sale section on here but you will need a lipo compatible charger, trying to charge it on your current charger will definitely end in tears.

The tamiya connectors are poor and will be a fire hazard if you try and run too much power through them. The 4mm bullet connectors are pretty much standard use and can be picked up very cheaply from ebay, i've bought some from this seller and I've not had any issues http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/20xSET-4mm-GOLD-BULLET-Connector-LIPO-Plug-RC-w-GIFT-B_W0QQitemZ180475803152QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_ToysG ames_RadioControlled_JN?hash=item2a05323610

I'm not familiar with the model you've got but have you built it with ballraces/bearings in? If not this is the 1st thing that you need to upgrade, pushing extra power through the car with these in will end up with melted parts.

[emtee]

Thanks for all the great info.

Would a BL motor come with an ESC? (As I said, I don't know much yet...) Do you know a website where I could look this stuff up? I've looked around, but I never know whatever everything is referring to or what works with what. It sounds like if I go this route, then I won't need a lipo alarm...

Do the connectors on LiPos fit with what I currently have? Every picture I look at looks different and I don't see how they will be able to work together.

Last question (for now). Do I need a 2S, 3S, 4S, or what? It seems like 2S is standard but 3S might be faster, as long as it fits with my set up?

Thanks again!!

Glad to help dude... so, OK...


You cannot run a BL motor with anything but a BL esc hence the word "combo"...
BL motors and BL esc's are interchangeable so you can use different manufacturers for each part... HOWEVER... try to stick with same make if poss... it's easier...!
lipo for 1/10th scale (i.e.your durga) is usually 7.4volts so that is 2 lipo cells joined together in the same case...(3.7v each..) if you are gonna join a BRCA affiliated club that is the only voltage lipo they will let you use...
If you are just "bashing" i.e. on the street or a car park you can use any voltage lipo but this will be determined by the working voltage of the esc, the physical size of the motor and the battery holder size in the chassis...
lipo cells come with or without plugs attatched, it is up to you which plug you solder on... I use "Deans" type plugs but anything is an improvement over the Tamiya type plastic plug!!
There are many websites to drool over so just do some surfin'... modelsport uk, timetunnel models, tower hobbies to name but a few...
Have a trip to your local model shoop and be honest with the guys who work there... if you don't know anything tell 'em that... BUT come back here and discuss before you buy owt!!!
If you wanna ask Q's off this forum just click anyones forum name and send a private message to ask what you need to know about...