B4 Vega Setup

[grelland]

Hi there.

My B4.1 Vega arrived a couple of weeks ago, but I am still waiting for some diff parts since I had the non-.1 version of B4, so I have not been able to run the car yet.

However, I still find no info on setups. I was kind of expecting some setup info with the kit, but as it turned out, there was no, absolutely no, info included in the kit, so I have done my best to guess how it all comes together, as there were not even assembly instructions...

So... Does anybody have any setup info to share? I run on a quite bumpy astro-track.

Roy, Norway

[Rebelrc]

the kit needs no instructions Roy
children have made them:thumbsup:

[grelland]

I agree it went together nicely, but still... ;)

[MHeadling]

I agree with Rebel, customers who buy this type of racing product should know there way round a race car and a 2wd, anyway they drop together!

As for set ups speak to nicVegachild on this forum, he will help.

It's early days for the car so set ups will come through no doubt!

I would go with your STD B4 set up and go from there. Maybe take a look at the Vega Kyosho set ups and compare set ups with the B4, there are spring comparison charts Petit Rc so you can get a set up similar to the Kyosho shocks

[Roel]

If you don't want to wait for the parts to arrive, like me, with a creative solution, you can run the Vega with a b4 diff.

I also have a Vega 4.1 and a B4 donor car, with 2 shock o-rings and a metal shim on the outdrive before the bearing it fits the 4.1 gearbox quite nicely.

I ran a few nights now and it still holds up.

I have ordered the b4.1 outdrives and will change them once they arrive but for time being this works.

For our clay track I run piston 2 + 30wt all round, silver springs on the front, as we have dust on the track I swapped silver in the rear for a softer green spring.
It runs pretty good on our track, much more rear traction than a b4.

[grelland]

thanks for the input, even though I have no particular credentials to speak about, I will also post my setups and experiences as I move forward :)

[nicVEGAchildJR]

I agree with Rebel, customers who buy this type of racing product should know there way round a race car and a 2wd, anyway they drop together!

As for set ups speak to nicVegachild on this forum, he will help.

It's early days for the car so set ups will come through no doubt!

I would go with your STD B4 set up and go from there. Maybe take a look at the Vega Kyosho set ups and compare set ups with the B4, there are spring comparison charts Petit Rc so you can get a set up similar to the Kyosho shocks

i allready have setups for two different types of carpet, high grip astro, astro and tarmac mixed and many more.
it is easier for me to email a set up sheet than it is to write it all out on here so PM me if you need a setup

[grelland]

I already have your setup, I just wanted to know if there are more people out there than you and I that run this car, and what experiences they might have at this time :)

[nicVEGAchildJR]

I already have your setup, I just wanted to know if there are more people out there than you and I that run this car, and what experiences they might have at this time :)

The setup I have now has about 7 changes all making it better

[grelland]

the kit needs no instructions Roy
children have made them:thumbsup:

And looking at pictures of nicVEGAchildJR's car, I realised that I put the rear A-arms on backwards... So I guess some instructions would come in handy afterall...

[grelland]

The setup I have now has about 7 changes all making it better

pls send me the updated one, then :D

[Rebelrc]

Instructions especially for your lol
How did you mount the shocks then?
Maybe you should stop typing and look at Rc cars a bit lol!:lol:

[grelland]

hehe, well I had the rear A-arms the wrong way around (well actually the right way, when looking at a B4), so I simply mounted the shocks in front of the A-arms. Like on a B4...

[nicVEGAchildJR]

hehe, well I had the rear A-arms the wrong way around (well actually the right way, when looking at a B4), so I simply mounted the shocks in front of the A-arms. Like on a B4...

You need to put the right hub on da right and da left on da left

[grelland]

NOW I know that, but I have built an X6, and there it is the other way around, so I guess my questions about instructions are not THAT stupid afterall...

[grelland]

And yesterday when I finally received the last few parts for my gearbox, I found out that I need to heavily dremel the rear a-arms to clear the outdrives...

So an instruction sheet is still a lousy idea???

man, I am starting to have some bad feelings for this car, even before I have tried it. Let's hope it runs as well as it looks...

[RudeTony]

Grelland
What level of racing are you at??

[grelland]

What can I say... I started out with rc-racing in 1982, and have been on and off ever since. I have worked on quite a few different cars, and even have a couple of podium placements in the Norwegian Championships over the years. So I am not a novice... And don't get me wrong, I do know how to put this car together, but why is there so much opposition of the general idea of some simple instructions????

Look at X-factory, they make excellent instructions for their conversion kits...

But back to the topic, which is setup sheets, of which I have only seen two so far. From a guy who does not want to share his racing credentials with the rest of us...

[RudeTony]

If Imay give you some simple advice on the Vega B4.
Run your normal set up as you would normally have your car but slighly softer rear and slightly harder front.
You will find this is the most simple way to get the Vega to work real good.
This is what we have done on the Kysho RB5 versions and they are great - The B4 is not much different car.
If the car is nervous then add weight
All the best and i think you will find you will really enjoy the Vega.
I don't know anyone that has not liked it.

Lastly - I say if you have a Vega you don't need instruction - LOL

[Scotty]

General Setup*
Vega Elite B4.1

Running with 3.0 Degree toe block and 0.5 hubs.
Also running 1 anti squat.

Front Sus
2 Pistons
Associated 35w
Middle Top*
Inner Bottom
Blue Springs

Rear Sus
1 Pistons
Associated 30w
Middle Top
Inner Bottom
Silver springs

Orca Version 2 Pro
Orion 7.5 81/24

Tyres
Front
Shumacher Staggers
Slim Rim No inserts

Rear*
Shumacher Minispikes Yellow
Medium Answer Inserts

Under Servo Weight
28g Rudebits

Under Speedo Weight
92g Rudebits

Under Lipo Weight
62g Rudebits
( Put in to smoothen on ruff tracks or make car less twitchy )

Move shock positions for more or less grip*
Also shorten or lengthen camber links front and rear to generate more or less grip

Try this for a start seems to work for me.

[grelland]

thanks, this was pretty close to my current setup. I will have a chance to test it on our new track tomorrow I hope, then I will let you know how it works.

This is an astro track wiith a couple of quite bumpy sections, and a couple of not so big jumps.

[grelland]

Hi guys, I see from the other threads that more and more people are getting their b4 vegas, and that is good :)

Meanwhile, I have had a chance to test the car at my local track, and so far I am really pleased.

I am aware that not so many have tested the b4 vega that much yet, but maybe someone with a more general knowledge can help me in the right direction.

As mentioned, the track I run on is an astro-track, where parts of the track is quite bumpy.

I have more or less used the setup that nick posted on petitRC, and in the rear I have green springs, 35 oil and ghea tapered pistons (#2, I think).

I am a little confused on the rear shocks, as on my B4s I have mostly used silver springs and lighter oil (30 or even 25), now the "PetitRC" setup suggest softer springs and stiffer oil... ) I see scotty suggest 30 oil and silver springs, so that might be the direction to move then?

Now the question is that on the bumpy section, the rear end does not seem too settled, I started out with the ground clearance a bit too low, so the chassis bottomed a lot, but today I was slightly above "arms level", and it seems the chassis is not hitting the ground, but I "lose" the rear end in the high speed bumpy parts.

I compare with my sons' b4s, and they are a lot better in that section (but the vega is much faster in the sharp turns :) ), and they both run silver springs and 25 oil.

So what direction shoud I go? Lighter oil, or stiffer springs (as I feel the b4s works better..) I currently have no weights under the lipo. Would that help the issue?

I see that I also have tendencies of traction roll at the end of the straight, especially as I raised the rear.

Looking forward to even further improve the handling of this nice car :)

[nicVEGAchildJR]

grelland.
and some anti squat to the car but it will also increase steering

[Scotty]

After running on a local farely flat but more bumpy track on sunday, i ran the vega with silver springs front 35w AE 2 pistons and green springs rear 30w AE 1 pistons with FULL RUDEBITS weight kit ( 28g Servo, 92G Speedo and 62g Lipo ) with 1 anti squat. I found this settles the car alot more, ableing to drive into and around the corners alot harder and push on more. Tryed without under lipo weight found the car not settling well after jumps.
Running the wishbones just below level at the front with the driveshafts level at the back. It was a fairly high grip track so on the front running middle top and outter bottom with slim rims and stagger tyres and rear running middle top and inner bottom with yellow part worn spikes with meduim answer inserts.

[MHeadling]

Cheers for the set up info, I'm pretty close to that but silver all round.

What toe in block? I'm going to try 3 deg

What rear camber link position?

[nicVEGAchildJR]

If you run0.0 deg hubs there is a mod that can be done and it will improve the handling of the car

[grelland]

Thanks guys, I have ordered the lipo weights, at that seems to be a vital part of the setup. I already had 1 mm anti-squat, do you recommend even more?

Will give it a try again later this week :)

[Scotty]

I'm running a 3.0 Degree toe block with 0.5 Degree Hubs. But have been advised to try more will test this weekend. Hope this helps.

[MHeadling]

Thats what I'm running Scotty, 3 deg and 0.5 rear ali hubs.

Any idea on a camber link position for the rear??

[Scotty]

Hub 3rd one out and shock tower top 2nd one in with 1 degree of camber. Hope this helps. Scott

[MHeadling]

Cheers mate

[grelland]

I had a chance to try a couple of packs again tonight (the advantage of building a new track 5 minutes from my house :) ), and since I have not received the under-lipo weights yet, I only changed the shocks; now I tried 30 oil and silver springs, and it certainly helped a lot. Cant wait until the weight arrives :)

And here is a shot of the car after two back-to-back packs:
http://i101.photobucket.com/albums/m68/grelland/218798_2012238475783_1538405523_4018825_3257577_o. jpg
That is the reason why I love astro :) We had buckets of rain yesterday, and the track was really nice and dry, and as you can see the car is spotless :)

[grelland]

Lipo weight arrived, and yesterday I had another go, and I changed to blue springs up front in order to minimse grip roll midways in corners, and kept the silver/30wt in the back. And as people have said; this really settled the rear end down :)

I can now push a lot harder in the corners, and I am sad to say, that from here onwards, it will most likely be my driving skills that limit me :)

One more question, My personal feeling is that the staggered ribs have a very "aggressive" feel to them; is there a front tire with slightly less grip available, or are there other changes to the setup I can do to calm the front down a little; especially entering corners? I have some toe-in already

[RudeTony]

Lipo weight arrived, and yesterday I had another go, and I changed to blue springs up front in order to minimse grip roll midways in corners, and kept the silver/30wt in the back. And as people have said; this really settled the rear end down :)

Happy the weight arrived and yes it makes the car so much easier to drive.

[InsideLineModels]

One more question, My personal feeling is that the staggered ribs have a very "aggressive" feel to them; is there a front tire with slightly less grip available, or are there other changes to the setup I can do to calm the front down a little; especially entering corners? I have some toe-in already

If you raise the inner front link that will chill the car out on turn in and give a little more mid and exit. As a starting point on high grip I'd be long on hub, short on tower with 3 (maybe 4) washers and on low grip go to 1 washer. I've not driven the b4 vega but lm just carrying what I know over from the x6.

I'm assuming you are using the standard staggers and not the cut ones?

Also, what caster blocks do you have on there?

Kev

[InsideLineModels]

Also, do you have the front shocks in the inner or outer hole on the wishbone?

[grelland]

Also, do you have the front shocks in the inner or outer hole on the wishbone?

inner

[grelland]

If you raise the inner front link that will chill the car out on turn in and give a little more mid and exit. As a starting point on high grip I'd be long on hub, short on tower with 3 (maybe 4) washers and on low grip go to 1 washer. I've not driven the b4 vega but lm just carrying what I know over from the x6.

I'm assuming you are using the standard staggers and not the cut ones?

Also, what caster blocks do you have on there?

Kev

thanks, today I have the link in the positions you say, but only 1 washer
standard staggers
25° caster blocks, trailing axle spindle

[InsideLineModels]

Putting the shock outer on the wishbone will help, and also it might be worth thinking about 30 degree caster blocks as they will make the car less pointy.

Definately try raising the link though if the grip is high.

[grelland]

great, thanks a lot

[grelland]

I raised the inner links as suggested, and that also helped. Now I really like the feel of the car, and cant wait to try at some races.

One more thing, not really related to the setup, but more a general tip; Three of the screws that hold the rear shock tower came loose, and fell out. Well, I guess they came out one by one, but when the third one came out, the rear end started behaving quite strangely, as the entire shock tower pivoted around the last remaining bolt. So threadlock is definately a good idea...

[bigred5765]

ok quick question for a friend,
ive been asked to convert a b4 into a vega for a friend, he has ordered vega kit and already has a b4 not 4.1 what else will he need ive read he needs the diff but what else bearing for diff drive shafts etc

[MHeadling]

The conversion comes with bearings in the box so just B4.1 diff outdrives and your there, the rest will all bolt on just fine!

[grelland]

My kit Did not have the bearings included

[MHeadling]

Ah ha, add bearings to your list, my B4 kit had bearings in it, but the 4.1 Vega kit must come with out them.

You get an extra idler gear too, so 4.1 outdrives and bearings and your good to go.

Dont forget to dremel the rear arms to give diff out drive clearence and also a 45 deg on the rear hinge pin holder to give the motor clearence. Only a 5 mins job.

There are pics on Vega thread of where to take the material from

[bigred5765]

what wing mounts does he need>?and defo no bearings in the kit?

[Andyp]

The 4.1 conversion comes with wing mounts ...... Mine did!

Yeah no outdrive bearings in the kit , only two for the extra idler.

[bigred5765]

to be honest theres very little in the conversion gearbox, chasisis, bttery strap and shock tower,motor mount no wing mounts no bearings

[spenner]

As far as i am aware you will get the following:

Chassis
Motor mount
Gearbox
Rear shock tower
Extra idler
Body shell
And i am pretty sure the X11 wing mounts.

None of the conversions come with bearings. If the wing mounts are not there then just give Team Xtreme a call and they will be more than willing to send them.

[Andyp]

As I said my 4.1 conversion DID come with wing mounts!

As for the bearings I didn't need any extra as I converted a 4.1 !

I think you can buy a non 4.1 conversion that gets round having to buy new outdrives/ bearings not 100% sure on that ! Maybe you friend should have bought that one !

[bigred5765]

As far as i am aware you will get the following:

Chassis
Motor mount
Gearbox
Rear shock tower
Extra idler
Body shell
And i am pretty sure the X11 wing mounts.

None of the conversions come with bearings. If the wing mounts are not there then just give Team Xtreme a call and they will be more than willing to send them.
no worries spence its conner cockers not mine ive messaged him about them

[bigred5765]

sorted

[uijui]

Any suggestions for clay..?? My b4.1 vega has setup like the general setup + weights as rudebits (servo, speedo, under lipo). Car steers well with holeshots on rear and jc grooves on front, but tends to loose rear grip too easily exiting corners?? Motor nosram 8.5

[MHeadling]

Try more rear anti squat, I race my one on low grip and have 4 deg spacers under toe in link.

You could try more rear toe in or lower the rear link on shock tower??

[InsideLineModels]

Try removing some of the weight from the front and/or add some at the back. It sounds like you may have too much up front. On my rb5 version in low grip I often remove all of the under speedo weight to shift the distribution back.

Lowing the front inner ballsud will let the car come out of the turn straighter and help it get into the turn also.

The Inner shock position on the rear wishbone will also give more drive.

[uijui]

Thanks guys! Removed under speedo weight. Removed the inner spacers under front camber links. Pos. Outer: inner, inner: inner. Rear: outer: 3rd from out, inner 2nd from in, pos low. Now 20g under servo, 82g under lipo. Front shocks ae piston 1 + sch 35wt, blue spring, top middle, lower outer, height 24mm. Rear ae piston 1 + sch 30wt, silver spring, top outer, lower outer, height 24mm. Camber -1 both ends. Toe: front 0, rear 3 + 0.5 hubs. anti squat 0. Caster front 25. Nosram bl 8,5, nosram istc v2 boost 1, feel 1, no auto brake. Tires: proline holeshot 2 rear, jc barcode front.

Car is quite good now, anymore suggestions???

[MHeadling]

Are there any astro set ups for the Vega B4.1 around??

Quick question on weight in the car, I have a Trish bits brass bulkhead fitted and noticed the Kyosho Vega lads don't tend to run these in their cars, would this be the same in the B4.1 car??

[RudeTony]

Are there any astro set ups for the Vega B4.1 around??

Quick question on weight in the car, I have a Trish bits brass bulkhead fitted and noticed the Kyosho Vega lads don't tend to run these in their cars, would this be the same in the B4.1 car??

Front axle weight slows the reaction time

[Trish]

Nice one Tony :lol:

[MHeadling]

Ah ok, thanks Tony. Slow reaction is good for me! lol

Any other Vega B4 owners running much weight an where??

[nicVEGAchildJR]

Ah ok, thanks Tony. Slow reaction is good for me! lol

Any other Vega B4 owners running much weight an where??

PM sent

[MHeadling]

nicVEGAchildJR

PM sent


No PM I am afraid mate?

[grelland]

I run under lipo (94g iirc), and under speedo.

and the front bulkkhead. I just received a pair of 30 deg front caster blocks, asI still feel it is a little twitchy with staggered ribs up front. really nice and stable over the bumps.

[uijui]

Just went back to ae b4.1 std. Better car for very low grip clay than mid motor vega. I will race vega at our winter series were it's definately faster (very high grip).

[uijui]

Now it's winter :p I'm converting my b4.1 back to vega. Setup for high traction carpet floor with minipins or spikes?

[Toyman]

Couple of setup questions:
a) am I right that Vega has "built-in" antisquat of ~2 degree? Unlike original B4, Vega has a small "ledge" under toe-in block.
b) what shall I do to overcome off-power understeer? I am running short front link, RB weights under servo and under speedo (28 and 92 g respectively) + additional 15 g weight over bulkhead

[RudeTony]

Couple of setup questions:
a) am I right that Vega has "built-in" antisquat of ~2 degree? Unlike original B4, Vega has a small "ledge" under toe-in block.
b) what shall I do to overcome off-power understeer? I am running short front link, RB weights under servo and under speedo (28 and 92 g respectively) + additional 15 g weight over bulkhead

I had this conversation with Lewis only the other day - the B4 Vega chassis is exackly the same measurements as the original car. - If you look at the kick up rear plate on the B4 and B4.1 then compare you will see.

Run more anti-squat to solve your problem as well as a short rear link.
Also the rear tow-in should be reduced if you are still having issues - hope it helps you

[Toyman]

Run more anti-squat to solve your problem as well as a short rear link.
Also the rear tow-in should be reduced if you are still having issues - hope it helps you

2 degree antisquat helped a bit, but not much. What are the standard front and rear links positions to start from on med-to-high grip astro?
Currently, I am at
Front: in on tower, 1 washer, A on hub
Rear: 4 on tower (outer hole, upper row), C on hub.
Btw, I didn't manage to shorten rear link any further as the thread is already full into the rod ends.
any suggestions are very appreciated!!

[uijui]

My B4.1 vega seems to have too much rear toe, even if I have AE alu hubs 0 degrees and 3.0 toe block. Much more than std b4.1 with same setup. What's wrong???

[uijui]

Well no I have found eligible setup for our track (felt carpet/cartong machine wire (more slippery)) Key was x-factory weight on slipper. Anyone using one?

I will post setup later if someone is interested....

[InsideLineModels]

Well no I have found eligible setup for our track (felt carpet/cartong machine wire (more slippery)) Key was x-factory weight on slipper. Anyone using one?

I will post setup later if someone is interested....

I assume you used this to get more on power steering?

[uijui]

.....uuuhm. This weight was more of a try or die....Track is really tight. And with that weight car isn't so twicthy (more relaxed) and the it steers also better...I drive really aggressive, it's my trademark :woot: but I'll post setup later.

[uijui]

Anyone setup for carpet (b4.1), we have a race on carpet, and no place to test :thumbdown:

[MHeadling]

I am running this at the moment:

Springs: Silver front and rear.
Ride height: arms level
Front brass bulk head ( trishbits one)
No 2 piston front 35wt losi oil, rear Ghea no 2, 30 wt losi oil.

Shock position Front, middle on tower , inner on arm,

Rear, Middle on tower, outer on arm.

Long wheel base, 0.5 deg hub but going to try 0 deg next time.

2 deg anti squat, 3 deg rear toe in block.

Camber link, front 2 spacers under shock tower ball stud, inner on tower, inner on hub.

Rear, Shock tower upper row one hole in from gear box and middle on rear hub.

Tyres, Mini pins on rear, Stagger ribs on front

Hope this helps

[uijui]

Thanks!

No other weights??

How long front shafts....B4 (0.7 shaft) or B4.1 (0.8) front shocks?

[MHeadling]

No weight apart from bulk head indoors, outdoors I put an under lipo in the car.

Yes B4.1 front shocks/shafts

[Toyman]

Mark, what b4.1 shafts will do? Less weight transfer when braking?

[MHeadling]

Erm....... They came with my car when I built the Vega up.

More droop on the front, as for what this does to the handling, im not 100% sure, I just know my Vega B4.1 goes very well!

[uijui]

Hello and Mark! Thanks for setup. Used it, modified a bit. Car was impressive, very safe to drive, and fast. Qualified 4 at Finnish winterjumps series, and finished 3!

Link to setup (sorry messy writing): http://img266.imageshack.us/img266/3571/imagepin.jpg

http://img507.imageshack.us/img507/9951/imageapn.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/507/imageapn.jpg/)

Uploaded with ImageShack.us (http://imageshack.us)

[Ekis]

I have searched for Blank setup sheets to the Vega B4.1 but no luck..
I have now made one so feel free to use this one.

Vega Elite B4.1 Setup Sheet (http://shares.eklinds.se/s#758ae5b6-be7c-4dcb-b877-8e4f74cfc3c3/eklindsse.clouddrive.eklinds.se/VegaElite%20B4.1%20Editable%20Setup%20Sheet.pdf)

Now the sheet is avalible at petitrc.com (http://www.petitrc.com/setup/teamxtreme/setupvegaeliteb4/B4.1VE_EditableSetupSheetv2.pdf)

[grelland]

great, I started making one, but never finished; now I dont need to :)

[Toyman]

Hello and Mark! Thanks for setup. Used it, modified a bit. Car was impressive, very safe to drive, and fast. Qualified 4 at Finnish winterjumps series, and finished 3!

Very unusual setup, but I'm sure you had valid reasons for it.
2 questions:
- why blue rear springs?
-why so long rear camber link?

[uijui]

Very unusual setup, but I'm sure you had valid reasons for it.
2 questions:
- why blue rear springs?
-why so long rear camber link?

On that track it was good to have rear traction -> long link
There was also sharp bumps (very narrow length) and they tend to bottom rear and bounce it to air -> blue springs to hold the rear better..

in reality, I have driven on carpet last time something like year ago with 4wd...so I was quite "out" of the setup, used what Mark suggested....made some modifications. But car was fast, Finnish winterjumps is quite fast series.