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  #41  
Old 04-06-2018
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Originally Posted by tyreman View Post
I don't think thats the issue Mark, I personally think it's the amount of power available to us now is the biggest factor with tyre wear. Back in the day we used to run a 13/14x2 in 2wd and 11x2 in 4wd. Would be interesting to see what the motors back then relate to current motors.
And the only reason we get away with using all this extra power is that, with the change from grass & dirt tracks to carpet & astro all the cars are now designed to generate more and more grip which comes at a cost.
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  #42  
Old 04-06-2018
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I think you are all being a bit selfish.

COME ON !!

Think of Robins Bentley Continental, with crushed velvet curtains, Bar, Cream leather, Cream carpet and driver. Oh and Bar man.

I'm doing my bit.

I'm just gluing up 6 pairs of rear Darts and 6 pairs of cut stagger fronts for this coming club meeting.

Come on do your bit !!
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  #43  
Old 04-06-2018
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This does need bringing up at the AGM.

It's clearly unsustainable. If I was doing nationals I'd have found this pretty shocking.

Do Schumacher run a recycling scheme?
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  #44  
Old 04-06-2018
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Quote:
Originally Posted by daz75 View Post
Thanks damo will give those a try as running 3 cars is a expensive

Is z3 the compound ?
It certainly is at Bury Metro, they work a treat and they are in my opinion better than Darts on that track.
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  #45  
Old 04-06-2018
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cjm_2008 View Post
This does need bringing up at the AGM.

It's clearly unsustainable. If I was doing nationals I'd have found this pretty shocking.

Do Schumacher run a recycling scheme?
Don't do the Nationals then! Come and race at an oople round where you get nearly three hours practice on a Saturday instead of 6 minutes at a National, you usually get five qualifiers plus three leg finals for all!

Blatant plug!
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  #46  
Old 04-06-2018
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As has been said in a few posts, Lipo brushless power, mega high grip astro consistent high speed tracks and cars being designed to work on these surfaces = great racing for people who want to race to win, if there is a tyre out there that gives 100% grip if only for one run they will want it. The dart is a successful tyre for both racers and schumacher, it works well and sells by the box load. But is it good for the hobby...no not really but who cares it wins and sells. Ive raced RC for 30 years and its always been the same motors or batterys or tyres
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Last edited by racingdwarf; 04-06-2018 at 09:52 PM.
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  #47  
Old 04-06-2018
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BuggyRacer View Post
So, entirely open to discussion. I race outdoors on astroturf and Schumacher Minis-spikes have been brilliant for years, they've been lasting 4 meetings without too much trouble (so 20 races, 4x qualifiers and a final at each meeting).

I got back from club racing yesterday and EVERYONE is finding the need to use the newer, faster Schumacher Dart tyre. Yes it seems to offer a fantastic level of grip but people are using TWO sets per meeting seeing as the lose their peak after the 3rd race (on astro turf).

Is buggy racing the new cheque-book racing? It seems to of just got a little stupid...

Thoughts?
I can't remember ever getting 4 meetings from spikes in 2wd....!
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  #48  
Old 04-06-2018
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In the grand scheme of all things racing the cost isnít too high IMO

Go and buy a pair of slicks for a super bike at £250 a pair that you can roast in 1 -2 races or 4 x track day/slicks for a full size car at £500+

Just look at other racing hobbies/formulas and itís not too bad
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  #49  
Old 05-06-2018
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MHeadling View Post
In the grand scheme of all things racing the cost isnít too high IMO

Go and buy a pair of slicks for a super bike at £250 a pair that you can roast in 1 -2 races or 4 x track day/slicks for a full size car at £500+

Just look at other racing hobbies/formulas and itís not too bad
very true, but its all relative if you had the budget to race a super bike but decided to go race 10th buggy instead at top level it would be cheep as chips
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  #50  
Old 05-06-2018
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Well I think coming from tc it's still cheap but maybe at regionals limit the sets so it's fair for everyone not who has the biggest pockets.
At least it's all lipos and brushless for all so no need for that special motor or battery like it used to be,but now we are all going faster so tyres have to give a little
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  #51  
Old 05-06-2018
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I think the current rear tyre situation works fine. What you maybe dont see, from the guys putting new tyres on every run at nationals, is that it isn't the last time the tyres will be used.

Personally:

Darts.
1 run per set in 2wd @ Nats
Then 2nd run on the set in 4wd.
Then a whole club night (maybe 2 or 3 club nights if the track hasn't got as much carpet).

(For club racing, worn darts are more than enough, they don't fall off a cliff so much that you can't have fun at the local club).

It's not that bad, it works out I'm getting more than 2 meetings out of a set of rears .
Fronts (2wd) I get a lot more out of.

I would hate to see me needing different tyres for club and BRCA events, and the best tyre for our club at the moment is Darts.

The environmental impact is more concerning, which James highlighted in a recycling suggestion recently.
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Last edited by chrispattinson; 05-06-2018 at 07:59 AM.
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  #52  
Old 05-06-2018
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if you want to be competitive then darts are the key, Prolines are good but require a different set up so can be a pain as most competitions don't allow them.

On club nights we can run really what we want but depends on how competitive you want to be vs tyre wear so the choice is yours.

Fast people will generally always be quick no matter what tyres they're on but if someone does win with new tyres just tell them they bought that win and it doesn't really count
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  #53  
Old 05-06-2018
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Wow I wasn't expecting such a huge response from everyone, glad I'm not the only one that feels this way. A few people have mentioned how much faster the cars are now, this is slightly irrelevant as even with these quicker cars, the duration of Schumacher Mini-spikes was much better but you are simply not competitive up against the Dart tyre.

Nationals, regionals and oOoos aside. People are still getting through a lot of the Dart tyres even at club level. You're simply uncompetitive even at club racing without the large wallet.

Good suggestion by HarlowS though, if people want to continue running the Dart tyre at clubs, I wonder if clubs would implement a 'stock' style class where the control tyre would be a Schumacher Mini-spike instead and a motor like a 10.5/13.5t to help prevent wear? You would then still have your 'mod' class to consist of fast motors and wallet-eating-tyres?

Last edited by BuggyRacer; 05-06-2018 at 09:30 AM.
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  #54  
Old 05-06-2018
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As has been mentioned, the Proline Pinpoint is a viable alternative to the Dart. No it doesn't have quite as much grip but it lasts a lot longer.

The problem is the top drivers will always use the fastest tyre. At the moment from the control options that is the Dart. And if they wear then they will replace them every round. So to be competitive the guys who would make the B/C final will do the same as they want to (and are prepared to spend) be in with a chance of the A final.

And that filters down through the rest of the finals until the mind set of the guys in the lower finals is 'I can't compete unless I put new tyres on'.

I'm known for being tight with my tyres and will accept what ever result comes along for the amount of money i'm prepared to spend - I just want to enjoy the day.
For example at the Kidderminster 2wd regional I changed to Pin points during qualifying and still manged an 8th in round - leading to great fun battling at the front of the B final. At Coventry the top guys were on a set a run but I used the same set of Darts all day. Made it into the middle/back of the A and had fun running round with the people that were the same pace as me.
Used tyres can work - but expectations need to be managed on what can be achieved.
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  #55  
Old 05-06-2018
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Has anyone tried the proline pyramids? They look like they could work well too.
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  #56  
Old 05-06-2018
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I was wondering about the pyramids too, they are supposed to be the astro tyre.
What compound were you using with the pinpoints KRob?
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  #57  
Old 05-06-2018
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At the Kiddy regional it was Z3. I actually has the Wedge squared on the front too but they were Z4 (as I can make anything understeer).
Was a good dry day. Yes the lap time was about a third of a second slower out outright fastest lap but the tyres were a lot less 'grabby' so less tendency to grip roll and made it easier to drive. Less stressful to drive with.

I've used Z4 at Kiddy too but only on a vintage 2wd. Great grip and last a fair while but obviously it a lot less demanding.

Not tried the Pyramids.
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  #58  
Old 05-06-2018
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Thanks Keith
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  #59  
Old 05-06-2018
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Do you think the Pin Points are or would be quicker than a yellow mini spike.
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  #60  
Old 05-06-2018
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I bet if everyone started using Prolines etc and the Nationals mentioned they may follow suit, I bet Schumacher would release a updated Dart style tyre that suddenly lasts twice as long e.g. Mini Pins vs Cactus...

Makes no business sense currently as people buy loads of them! Win win.
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