How is the Vintage 1/10th off road scene?

[AndyF]

HI,

I'm new to these forums (found it last night)

I used to race at Batley Buggy Club back in the late 80s when i was in my early teens. I haven't driven an rc car since. I came across my old Procat in the loft the other day and in researching the net to find out if it is worth anything i came across this forum.

I was very supprised to find talk on some parts of this site of vintage RC car racing. I'm wondering if anybody is still doing it since all the threads i read were a bit dated.

I left racing because i couldn't afford to keep up. We used to have a standard class that could only use 27 turn motors. But Batley decided to change to allow anything (inline with BRCA i think). With that I couldn't afford to be competitive so gave up.

It wasn't just the cost of motors. Batterys were an issue and to make a modified motor do 5 mins meant very expensive ones, with chargers to match. I was amazed to read that dumping is a thing of the past with your 4200mah cells!

I liked what i read about the standard motor etc that the vintage guys use to keep costs down.

Was also suprised to see shaft drive back in. I thought we had finished laughing about them in the hotshot! And whats with centre diffs, carbon fibre and brushless motors!!!!!!

Sorry, I was being nostalgic.

[Stu]

The vintage-masters series was really something for us to do during the winter, I think we will be doing it again this next winter - hopefully bigger & better. Not that I want summer to end, but I am looking forward to the second season of vintage racing.

[WHITTLER555]

My vote is for 19t motors and either a split between 2WD and 4WD or a 1 lap handicap for 4WD.

New purchase on its way!????;)

[PaulRotheram]

i'd like a vintage car.

[Northy]

I have a new weapon in the pipe line :cool: :cool:

G

[Stu]

My vote is for 19t motors and either a split between 2WD and 4WD or a 1 lap handicap for 4WD.


Sounds about right.

[telboy]

what do you all class as vintage?
does it have to be a certain age?

would a manta ray or top force be classed as vintage? with them being re-released and everything?

Only askin cos this is what I used to run when I started racing...although it ended up being a jamie booth team special in the end.:D

[Stu]

It was pre-1990 last winter.

The rule was only enforced loosely though.

We basically wanted no 'modern' cats, no XX's or B2's - you get the idea.

It was left up to the concience of the individual if they wanted to run something that was borderline.

[Northy]

It was left up to the concience of the individual if they wanted to run something that was borderline.

:o :eh?: :o :eh?: :o :eh?:

[telboy]

so if you want to race one then you'd be looking at an associated, schumacher or yokomo or something similar?

[Stu]

Type of car was not important - as long as the date was pre-1990 (or very close to it) - ;)

[super__dan]

We should probably have a chat sometime (booze fueled) to decide on next years rules. If it is 19t I shall start scouring ebay now.

Personally I would be keen for a 2wd/4wd split as last year it was clear you couldn't keep up with a 2wd even with the stingers, that will become more pronounced with quicker motors.

I must say though it was really good fun and when I got the RC10 dialled in (particularly for the endurance) it was very satisfying. Going up the inside of a new Lazer being a particular highlight :)

[super__dan]

The rule is applied to the chassis conception, so with my RC10 even though itself is a bit later than 1990, the chassis design is 1990. As Stu says, for 2wd defo no XX's or B2's, anything other than that is handicap enough I think.

4wd alledgedly the procat was old enough ;) G's car was proper good, would have put many a more modern 4wd to shame indoors!

[RLGfx]

i want a kyosho maximum ff..... :(

[AndyF]

Looks like I just missed the boat on a nostalgic run. :(

Just charged my Phil Greenwood matched 1700 SCE Batterys for the first time in what must be 15 years and they charged and my Procat lived. After a minute it stoped running. The connecting wire between the saddle packs had come off. Charged my second set and we were away again. I drove it for another 2 mintues and the rear wing flew off. O-rings perished. Then 20 seconds later I hit a lamp post and broke the servo horn. So that was brief!

But, Would an old procat be totally outclassed in todays field?

[Northy]

Just been negotiating the details of my new weapon, its a bit rare to race really, but sod it! :D

G

[RLGfx]

ayk?

[jimarea51]

I think that anyone who had a go at last years Vintage championship was pleased with the way it went, most of the rules are more sence than restricting... Good choice with not allowing Mini-pins:D

It would be nice to have a little more poke (19t sound a bit more like it)...

Jim

[jimmy]

I have a couple of new AYK buggies from 1986/7 - perfect for anyone wanting some vintage racing! 150 quid a pop! bargain! :)

[WHITTLER555]

If we go ahead this year, we need to again know roughly how many people are going to turn up?

I have a Losi JRX2 which I will lend out to suitable candidates, all you will need is radio gear. As long as any breakages are covered!

The MID Optima may also be available, which nearly proved successful against Northy's Procat, if you have Futaba 40Mhz radio gear you only need to bring a radio for that! OH! it needs a new front shock tower if anyone can locate one!

I would rather see more cars out this year with a handicap on 4WD.

Dan ended up very competitive with his RC10 so 2WD could still win overall.

If we run 19t motors, they would need to be supplied for the above cars.

Candidates can form an orderly queue, probably behind Chris Long:D

[super__dan]

I forgot I have the option of the use of an optima mid with all period running gear in exchange for getting my old B4 ready with the stinger in so he can have a go in the 20t class. Now where to find the time to do that???

[Mi Julie]

I can't wait :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:

[andys]

[QUOTE=AndyF;41884]HI,
I used to race at Batley Buggy Club back in the late 80s when i was in my early teens. I haven't driven an rc car since. I came across my old Procat in the loft the other day and in researching the net to find out if it is worth anything i came across this forum.
QUOTE]

Hi there.

I too raced many moons ago at batley when it was at the Hare & Hounds pub. Would be interested to know if I knew you ? I'm Andy shillito by the way, I used to tun a PB, then a Procat back in the day. I've kept racing on and off over the years and follow the North East region racing when I can.

Put your hands in your pockets and get a 2nd hand B4 and come and race, it's still as much fun as it always was, much more competitive though, and expensive if you want it to be !

The procat isn't really competitive i'm afraid. Things really have changed quite a bit in every department as i'm sure you are finding out reading this forum.

Good luck, whatever you decide to do.

Andy.

[WHITTLER555]

No, andy s, the Procat won't be competitive at a regional, BUT it would be at the R/C Vintage Masters this Winter.

Northy proved it to be a winner!

Andy F, come down to a NE Regional this summer, ask about and buy some second hand cells and lets see that Procat on the grid later in the year:D

[telboy]

what year was the manta ray? its got to be around early 90's shirley?

If not, then the car itself is enough of a handicap to be able to run!:D

[AndyF]

Hi Andy S

Your name does ring a bell. I think you were maybe a couple of years older than me and a couple of leagues above me in results! I tended spend my time in the C and D Finals as I recall. I did win a massive trophy for the most improved junior driver once. I think that was because i started from such a low level any improvemment was massive.

If I remeber the PB had a long black plastic spine down the center and they were quite rare? Infact I only recall seeing one racing. Probably yours!

I remember the Hare and Hounds fondly. I actually did my first race indoors at the sport centre. I won the J final on my first time out with a Hornet! I was bitten by the bug and moved on to an Optima and then an Optima Mid before finishing on my Procat.

All this talk of racing again does make me wonder about getting involved with your next vintage championship. I understand these were/will be run at york?

Andy

[RLGfx]

hi tel,

the manta ray was about '91-'92, the car that got me racing... mine was eventually fitted with the RW C/F chassis, ballraced steering, torque splitter, c/f driveshaft... the works... Still wasn't as quick as the optima mid custom special I upgraded to!

[Oscar]

I was thinking about running a bit of a fun day at Batley later in the season, probably September time when all the National and Regionals are out of the way.
How many people would be up for a vintage class? I'll be in with my procat as long as I can get some wheel rims sorted out;) Prob go for 19t plus motors to save the transmissions:)

PS: I used to race at Batley in the late 80's also:cool:

[AndyF]

I would be interested. What am I saying! I came on here to find out if I could make money selling my old Procat and now i'm looking at spending money to go racing with it!

[Medders]

I love my Procat and it went ok indoors over the winter in the vintage racing and at the national indoor finals. Sadly, its just not competitive outdoors - the weight and inefficient transmission make it too slow and it just can handle the terrain like a modern 4wd seems to.

A schumacher day @ batley later in the summer sounds like a great idea.

[WHITTLER555]

An outdoors Vintage race would be great although September is a bit busy:

1/2 Sept BRC Off Road Finals - silverstone

8/9 Sept - Southport Regional

15/16 Sept - F3,4,5's at Coventry

22 Sept - Jim Sykes wedding!!!

29/30 Sept - NOTHING!!!

[Oscar]

22nd Sept looking good then, we could be assured a chuckle brothers free weekend:D

[Welshy40]

So I am guessing my Lazer ZXS isnt classed as a vintage due to it being made in 93/94. Its a prototype so was made well before the 96 version came out

[Stu]

The Laser is definately reto, but not really vintage.

The only car that I was willing to really 'bend' the rules for last year was the Mardave Cobra. Allthought circa 1992/3 it was well out of date before it was even designed.

[WHITTLER555]

Looks like I have just wasted money on a ZXR then:(

[super__dan]

I've got to agree a lazer is retro but not true vintage, cos in which case there are equivilent age yokomos which will be far too competetive. Wasn't the ZXR around same time as XX for example and works 95 dogfighter etc?

[BenG]

Can I ask, is the hare and hightown?

If so, the pub is still there, maybe your retro meet could go very retro by racing there? :confused:

Would be quite cool.... ;)

[AndyF]

I'm not sure if that area was reffered to as hightown. I thought the area was called Ardsley, at the back end of Tingley? I think they were going to remove the track and put a bigger beer garden in. This was 15 years ago!

[WHITTLER555]

I will just have to run the ZXR during the indoor regionals then:(

[Welshy40]

Sorry guys but the Lazer ZX was released in 1988 or 89, as I had one of the first in the UK. Its basically the same as a ZXR but with gear diffs, and a slightly different slipper system. As the ZX is from the 80's then I guess it can be used at this event.

Whittler555
The ZXR car is one of the most competitive cars indoors, so if you need any help with it at the indoor finals just ask, as i am hoping to qualify for it with my Lazer (next years by the way) and see if I can some fun as well. I doubt I will make the top ten again, but will have a lot of fun trying anyway.

[Stu]

Sorry guys but the Lazer ZX was released in 1988 or 89, as I ..........

OK, game on then - :)

[WHITTLER555]

The ZXR I have looks more like my ZX I had back in the 80's, in fact the only thing it has got is a ZXR body! :confused: Apart from that it just looks like a long wheel base MID. ERM with a full graphite saddle pack chassis.

I think it has ball diffs??

I will put it in front of the Vintage scrutineers and see what they say!??:D

[Stu]

You mean Jim?

[super__dan]

http://www.darrynsretrorc.rtox.com/kyoshopics/zxrlazer.htm This is the ZXR and you can see it's 92. I started in 90 and remember this having the most hype at our club ever, it was a good car.

If you get a chance look at the kits this guy has, he's a freaking nutter (in a good way).

[WHITTLER555]

I will buy a Procat then.:yawn:

[Northy]

I will buy a Procat then.:yawn:

I think that may also be borderline :D :D :D :D :D

G

[Welshy40]

the ZXR was later but you can convert to ZX format easily. The gear diffs can still be bought, the ZX bodyshell is still being sold

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Kyosho-Lazer-ZX-reproduction-body-L-K-NICE_W0QQitemZ190117860934QQihZ009QQcategoryZ34063 QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD2VQQcmdZViewItem

The top deck and chassis doesnt really make a difference as the parts were available in 89. I think the ball diffs were as well.

The difference is so small between the zx and zxr (diffs, wheels and top deck), so nothing much to judge. The drivetrain is the same as the internal gearbox gears and belts havent changed at all.

[terry.sc]

The ZXR I have looks more like my ZX I had back in the 80's, in fact the only thing it has got is a ZXR body! :confused: Apart from that it just looks like a long wheel base MID. ERM with a full graphite saddle pack chassis.

I think it has ball diffs??

I will put it in front of the Vintage scrutineers and see what they say!??:D
Well if I was scrutineering I would ban it:D

The Lazer ZX was introduced in December 1989, which makes it VERY borderline, and is a very different beast to the ZX-R. To classify as a ZX it must have gear diffs, a split two piece top deck (so the chassis is really flexible without the centre plastic spine), the centre ball diff (no slipper!), alloy plate shock mounts and short front shocks and with 2 inch Optima Mid wheels. All the chassis plates were grp, not carbon. You could try saying it's a ZX with hop ups but as none of the hop ups (or the one piece top deck) were available until well into the 90s I would say none of them should be allowed.

BTW the Procat was also released late 1989, September I think, so again is marginal but more likely to be allowed as all the ZXS's had the Cougar rear suspension (as used on the Procat) grafted onto them long before then. It was also an evolution of an 80's chassis, rather than the Lazer ZX being the first release of a 90's chassis.

Another alternative is the Yokomo Super Dogfighter, released in 1988 it won the 1989 nationals and dominated the 89 Worlds. You would really need to know what you are looking at to make sure it's a Super Dogfighter and not a Works '91 though.

[Stu]

Blimey - complex stuff that.

Good job it's me that is the 'scrutaineer', or else it could go on all night.

[terry.sc]

Well it should be fairly easy to sort out beforehand, it's easy to come up with a list of what's allowed.

Being a bit pedantic, only RC10s with the original 6 gear gearbox should be allowed as the Stealth gearbox didn't appear until April 1990. I can see that going down well in 2wd, at least it would give other 2wds a fighting chance.:D


Another suggestion if someone is feeling very wealthy, the Tamiya Egress. It'll cost you a fortune every time the front uprights just look at something solid:D

[Welshy40]

[quote=terry.sc;42741]Well if I was scrutineering I would ban it:D

The Lazer ZX was introduced in December 1989, which makes it VERY borderline, and is a very different beast to the ZX-R. To classify as a ZX it must have gear diffs, a split two piece top deck (so the chassis is really flexible without the centre plastic spine), the centre ball diff (no slipper!), alloy plate shock mounts and short front shocks and with 2 inch Optima Mid wheels. All the chassis plates were grp, not carbon. You could try saying it's a ZX with hop ups but as none of the hop ups (or the one piece top deck) were available until well into the 90s I would say none of them should be allowed.


I think you have made a little mistake. The centre diff was complex yes but was also a slipper, and a one way and much better than the hyperclutch when that came out in the late 90's. It could be set to 50/50 or 60/40 so the choice was there for many options. It has a slipper system and you could use with or without the balls in the spur. i know as I ran with this system for six years and my results speak for themselves. Also the ball diffs were available in 89 but the gear diffs were better indoors than the ball diffs, so not a problem using them or getting the parts as they are still available

Also the top deck in CF was available in 89 as well as the chassis as i had one. The two piece was ok as it kept the belt loose, which made the car more efficient and quicker.

The shock towers were also in a grp form and were also available from japan in CF as well as they were being used around 89/90.

But yes the wheels were small but that should not make a problem with 2.2 wheels as there are no tires to fit the zx wheels anymore, and lets be honest here not many peole are very good at cut and shuts.

I guess you guys say vintage to mean cars that are no longer competitive, whereas the zx was and still is a competitive car. Vintage was said to be in the 80's and this car was in the end of the 80's so is a valid car but im guessing the rules are being made up as we go along.

[Welshy40]

The Laser is definately reto, but not really vintage.

The only car that I was willing to really 'bend' the rules for last year was the Mardave Cobra. Allthought circa 1992/3 it was well out of date before it was even designed.


Stu I forgot about this, at the indoor champs in 93/94 Kristien Wiles knocked Craig Harris out of the A final with a Mardave Cobra and finished fourth or fifith I believe. So in the right hands is a very capable car on carpet as well as grass where he also beat harris several times with it. Pretty good car.

[Stu]

Hmmm, yeah. There was a chap raced a Cobra in the NW regionals untill only a few years back. It was ballraced, some home made parts and Losi Shocks (or EA, can't remember exactly). He was a medium ability driver, he regularly put it in regional B finals.

Maybe with enough interest we could run two classes;

Vintage - Pre-1990
Retro - Pre-1995

Ideas?

[AndyF]

As an outside observer, I would make everybody produce their original purchase receipt dated pre-1990 :wtf: !

Failing that. Box standard kits (no upgrades) with a release date pre 1990 and perhaps a seperate class pre 1985 (at a guess) for the likes of the Hornet and Hotshot etc. Could race togeather but have two classifications.

I would be interested in a race or too with my old procat. I'm a bit worried that you guys consider a guy who gets into reginal B finals as a middle ability driver! Maybe u could also have a handicap system for vintage racers who haven't actually raced since 1990 either;)

[Stu]

......... I'm a bit worried that you guys consider a guy who gets into reginal B finals as a middle ability driver!........

That's middle as in half way between a national 'A' driver and a low end club driver.

Sorry, I wan't suggesting that someone who does regional 'C' finals is a spoon, or even a spork.

[HKP]

I think screw all you guys with your faux vintage cars... Bring on the mighty Marui Ninja!! :D

Although I reckon the plastics on mine are now so brittle it might break a wishbone if a marshall sneezes!!!

[AndyF]

I think screw all you guys with your faux vintage cars... Bring on the mighty Marui Ninja!! :D

Although I reckon the plastics on mine are now so brittle it might break a wishbone if a marshall sneezes!!!

I remember wanting one of those Ninjas badly, but the local model shop told me i would be better with an Optima. Thank goodness for Otley Model Sport:) (Do they still exist? Will have to google them)

[terry.sc]

Thank goodness for Otley Model Sport:) (Do they still exist? ):D:D:D Try looking here http://www.modelsport.co.uk (http://www.modelsport.co.uk/) They are a bit bigger than you remember them.

[WHITTLER555]

I love causing controvesy!:D

[AndyF]

Does anybody know if you can still get the little rubber bands that hold the wing onto a Procat? I'm also going to need the rubber bands that hold the crash back system in place.

[Oscar]

Go see your local plumbers merchant/diy shop. Black O-rings are usually only 10 or 20 p each;)

[AndyF]

Thanks,

I have another question. Are all tyres the same diameter in 10th scale buggies? My Procats wheels are what I believe are the old size. Do they still make tyres to fit?

[HKP]

Yes, You can buy 2.0 inch tyres still from Schumacher. Modern tyres are 2.2 inches Diameter. HTH.

[Welshy40]

The other alternative is to buy a new set of tires and cut and shut, as its pretty simple to do.

Stu maybe your idea is the best, maybe we should have a one day eventer where we have pre 1990 in their own races and pre 95 in theirs as well. It will make the event more interesting wouldnt it and also you should get a few more people turning up. At least i know my prototype is pre 95, or are protoypes not allowed?

[telboy]

Just have different classes.

85-89
90-95
and 96-2000

run 2wd and 4wd in the same class.


I'm not that up on the years that cars came out, what year did the procat come out?

[telboy]

ignore that, I've just read the other posts.:rolleyes:

[Welshy40]

Guys,

Here is a good point.

As most of the cars that will be raced are either rare and lets face it bits will be very hard to source, will the event be better suited for an indoor carpet race? or better still an event like at the regionals in nottingham where the surface was a green rubber surface.

Just a though, I mean why would we want to get them dirty?

[Col]

The previous series was indoors, on carpet and wood floor

[Welshy40]

Well in that case im in for this.

Telboy has the right idea and maybe we shoudl go with his idea. Im for it, and the manual on my zxs was in 95 yet the car was made well before that so im in the 90-95 bracket

[HKP]

Me too! I'll be using a Lazer ZXR which I guess is the same era 90 - 95..

[telboy]

the reason i said that is because I'd like to run something like a mantaray or topforce and send me back to my starter days, but they're too new for a pre 90's vintage class.

[AndyF]

I started with a hornet (showing my age). Rubber washes for dampers, 1 cm wide front wheels and the entire gearbox and motor unsprung. I see you can still buy them too.

[Welshy40]

I started with a hornet (showing my age). Rubber washes for dampers, 1 cm wide front wheels and the entire gearbox and motor unsprung. I see you can still buy them too.

Hehehe a hornet, they were fun. I had a Falcon as a starter, but I spent a while driving my mates hornet before getting it. I also had a Lunch Box and that was highly amusing on red gras.

I think it would be a better event if they had at least two categories, and this would be more fun and as these cars are no longer being built and lets face it 1995 is 12 years old and thats very old in rc racing.

[Northy]

Right, are we talking about racing at York indoors on a Saturday night? Racing from 6pm to 11pm?

If so, lets have an idea of who will support the series and what cars they would like to run, as last year we only had enough people to run one heat even though lots of people said they would come. :(

G

[GRIFF55]

Can't remember what my first car was, but i know i have a frog, boomerang, pb mini mustang and maxima, cat xls's and an optima mid turbo at my parents house. There may even be a tub chassied ultima there too. Have to make time too dig them out and do a bit of resto work!! (like to see a vintage meet some time in wales!!)

[AndyF]

Can't remember what my first car was, but i know i have a frog, boomerang, pb mini mustang and maxima, cat xls's and an optima mid turbo at my parents house. There may even be a tub chassied ultima there too. Have to make time too dig them out and do a bit of resto work!! (like to see a vintage meet some time in wales!!)

Sounds like you could run your own meet with all that lot, just need some hired thumbs

[Medders]

I started with a Falcon, still got bits of it, and bits of my old chain drive optima.

I'll be in the vintage series again G, running the Procat. Lets get a sensible rule about motors as well.

[Northy]

19 turns? :confused:

G

[Medders]

14 turns if its a proper vintage motor :cool:

[Northy]

I've just got an LRP 'Pink E' off of EBay :)

G

[Medders]

very cool !


I'll dust down the 1700 sce's again as well, although I seem to remember dumping in one heat last time :D

[HKP]

Arse.. York is a bit far for me at such short notice.. (I'm down in the South East corner with Welshy40). Could we maybe arrange more southerly one in addition to York?

[Northy]

We'll be running a championship at York over the winter.

G

[flick5848]

Does anybody know if you can still get the little rubber bands that hold the wing onto a Procat? I'm also going to need the rubber bands that hold the crash back system in place.

I imagine these are the same

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Schumacher-CAT-2000-3000-elastic-wing-bands-good-spare_W0QQitemZ280126946049QQihZ018QQcategoryZ2565 QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

[AndyF]

Cheers. If I get these I may be persuaded to come out of retirement after 17 years!:p

[niggs98]

it is a long way tom but im thinking of having a go for at least one of them with my new (1986 it was new anyway) toy and you cant get much more south east than me so im sure we can either arange a convoy or all bundle into a car to cut down on costs for allArse.. York is a bit far for me at such short notice.. (I'm down in the South East corner with Welshy40). Could we maybe arrange more southerly one in addition to York?

[terry.sc]

Cheers. If I get these I may be persuaded to come out of retirement after 17 years!:pThe wing O rings are still sold by Schumacher http://www.racing-cars.com/search.asp?searchbox7=Speed+Packs&subcategory=Bosscat&category=Old+Cars+%26+Parts&templateid=12

[Oscar]

14 turns if its a proper vintage motor :cool: turn

Jeez! when I gave up racing, you would dump on a 17 turn :o most guys in modified were running either 21's or 19's.

Does that mean I am officially old:rolleyes:

[Medders]

Jeez! when I gave up racing, you would dump on a 17 turn :o most guys in modified were running either 21's or 19's.

Does that mean I am officially old:rolleyes:


Yep :D

[GRIFF55]

it is a long way tom but im thinking of having a go for at least one of them with my new (1986 it was new anyway) toy and you cant get much more south east than me so im sure we can either arange a convoy or all bundle into a car to cut down on costs for all


Not the Nathan Ralls that used to go racing with dad and brother in a grey type 2 transporter, when i used to race for RCP with peter hex???
Colin Steele was my team mate back in those days. Ahh the good ol days!!!

[HKP]

it is a long way tom but im thinking of having a go for at least one of them with my new (1986 it was new anyway) toy and you cant get much more south east than me so im sure we can either arange a convoy or all bundle into a car to cut down on costs for all

Sounds awesome Nathan.. I'd be up for that, I guess Welshy40 would be too. Maybe we can discuss further via PM or a new topic? Anyone got a 7 seater car?? :eh?:

[terry.sc]

I might be up for the odd one (it's a 5 hour round trip for me!) and have some others that might be persuaded to come. As for what I can run, take your pick from Scorpion, Ultima, Ultima Pro, Frog, Meteor, Cougar, RC10, Hotshot, Optima, Optima Mid, Optima Mid Custom, Radiant, XL, XLS, Procat :D

[trekkerkk]

im going to come up for one off them,
make a weekend off it,
go up on the sat drive back down south sunday night,
all i need now is somthing to drive,


trekkker

[niggs98]

ello griff yes the one and the same mate although dont know ya name as it aint on ya profile lol.
Not the Nathan Ralls that used to go racing with dad and brother in a grey type 2 transporter, when i used to race for RCP with peter hex???
Colin Steele was my team mate back in those days. Ahh the good ol days!!!


ok tom pm will be sent soon for details

Sounds awesome Nathan.. I'd be up for that, I guess Welshy40 would be too. Maybe we can discuss further via PM or a new topic? Anyone got a 7 seater car??

[Welshy40]

Jeez! when I gave up racing, you would dump on a 17 turn :o most guys in modified were running either 21's or 19's.

Does that mean I am officially old:rolleyes:

I ran 1400scrs against scrcs and geared on 9to1 with a corrally 10d and made it until the last lap when i would dump big time, but still managed to finish third in the welsh champs so cant grumble. Good bet tho. hehehe. I may be tempted, when is it?

[HKP]

I know.. we'll all squeeze in your Ford Ka Welshy!! :D

Once we sort out the details we'll start a thread regarding carting all us southern shandys 'oop north for a race..

North V. South.. I know who my money's on ;)

[Welshy40]

hehehe well im more tempted on the worksop events at the mo but the york may come into it, but we need to have a serious chat next week tom on this when we meet up. Hell for you lot here should know that if you can make it at worksop then your set up here will be half decent on carpet.

[Oscar]

im going to come up for one off them,
make a weekend off it,
go up on the sat drive back down south sunday night,
all i need now is somthing to drive,


trekkker

Maybe I could arrange it so the Batley meeting was on a Sunday after the York one on the Saturday? Could be better for those travelling.
When do you expect to start the vintage series guys??

[Col]

First race last year started on 25th Nov. As far as I'm aware York club has not decided on it's calander for the winter yet.

[AndyF]

How is Batley Buggy Club doing? I notice they have no events scheduled on their website. When I used to go 17ish years ago we used to race every two weeks with std finals down to J and K and some modified finals too.

[Medders]

four of us turned up last time :(

and its under water :(

[AndyF]

oh.

Thats not good news. Is it buggy racing in general that as declined or just Batley.

Back in the day youngsters of 8 and 9 would turn up with hornets and frogs and race along side adults and teenagers with better 4wd cars. The cost was low(ish) because we all ran 27turn motors that would last 5 minutes on any old £10 battery pack. We had no special chargers or balancers??. A motor would last a couple of seasons with no maintainance and most people had a couple of sets of tyres that lasted a season.

I got out when the modified class became the std. Motors started to cost £50 instead of £10 - £15, with these you needed £50 battery packs and not just one to charge 5 times a meeting. All of sudden these same motors needed money spent every meeting to true the comm??? The kit prices had risen a little but it was the motors, batteries and ESC prices that turned it from a hobby for the young and young at heart into a specialised activity for the rich and dedicated.

I would like to race in the york vintage series this winter for nostalgic reasons. But with one battery pack and one motor!

[Col]

Last year there was a control motor for vintage. I think it was a 20t saturn? With these you could run most battery's and not worry about dumping. There is talk of another control motor for this years series - something a little hotter.
Most other things are still the same as when you left! Although if you shop about, you can still get stuff cheap.
Batley is usually a very well supported club (indoors especially) and 1/10th is probably the most popular class around.

[Oscar]

How is Batley Buggy Club doing? I notice they have no events scheduled on their website. When I used to go 17ish years ago we used to race every two weeks with std finals down to J and K and some modified finals too.

The club is still "OK" , however due to exceptional circumstances we have had very few club meetings over the last year or so.
Another contributing factor is that the calendar is so full with regional and national events, (which many key club members usually attend) it is difficult to schedule club days. We have had two of our few meetings this year cancelled due to adverse weather, which is once again rather less than helpful.
I do hope that later in the year once the larger events are over, we can get some more regular club days in, and I will organise a vintage/fun day if enough people are interested;)

[AndyF]

It is nice to hear that the club is still going. I guess like all sports the bar keeps getting raised. I don't remember spending time agonising over the shock oil i was using or adjusting the suspension every heat :-). It was enough to have tread on my tyres and a charged battery. Sounds like you guys are much more aware of the science and engineering behind the sport which is a good. Must be much more educational for the kids.

Do you still use 27MHz transmitters or did it all move to 40MHz. I think there was a move to 40MHz as I left the sport.

[Col]

The RTR kits come with 27mhz, but most aftermarket kits are 40mhz. Either can be used, but 40mhz is more popular. 2.4ghz (spektrum) is also becoming more popular

[AndyF]

2.4GHz, Better hope nobody as a wifi laptop on nearby!

[trekkerkk]

i see some people talking about bosscats are they vintage enough,
i cant quite remember what year they came out,
thanks

trekkker

[super__dan]

Not for york vintage, the procat only gets in by the skin of its bell (teeth).

[trekkerkk]

ok thanks,
start looking for an xls or procat then,

trekkker

[trekkerkk]

are all the belts the same from xls to bosscat,
the 2 rears and the 1 to the front,
as ive looked at the schumacher website and theyve got the boss cat belts,
thanks


trekkker

[AndyF]

You chaps have probably already seen this site. But if not and you are interested in old CATs then this is a cracking site

http://www.racing-cars.com/forum/forum_topics.asp?FID=14&PN=1

[Welshy40]

It was pre-1990 last winter.

The rule was only enforced loosely though.

We basically wanted no 'modern' cats, no XX's or B2's - you get the idea.

It was left up to the concience of the individual if they wanted to run something that was borderline.

Ok so if thats the case then, my 1990 RC10 with MIP 4wd belt conversion should be legal as well in the 4wd. If so then im going to have a giggle with this, and see how badly it actually performs.

[Stu]

It's possible we can run two classes, 'Vintage' and 'Retro'.

'Vintage' - up to 1989 - 27t stock motors?
'Retro' - up to 1995 - 19t stock motors?

The 'retro' class can be there for those that want to run Pro/Boss-Cats, Lasers, XX's, Cougars, ......

Two classes will give chance to those travelling a distance to enter both to get more racing in.

No reason a pre-1990 car can't be run in 'retro' with a 19t motor.

It would be nice to get a couple of Sunday meetings in.

All depends on demand.

[super__dan]

I agree potentially on 2 classes but defo got to be 19t motors in both for me, they were just too slow with the stingers in and they were 21turns.

James, it's an RC10 chassis design so it's defo in for vintage. Do you really actually have one???

[Stu]

Im a bit concerned that some of the proper vintage stuff, like the 6-gear's or chain drive stuff will just be ripped to bits with the power of a modern 19t stock.
I'm no expert but I suspect that a good 27t stock will be faster than them things we ran last year.

Time to decide yet.

[Welshy40]

I agree potentially on 2 classes but defo got to be 19t motors in both for me, they were just too slow with the stingers in and they were 21turns.

James, it's an RC10 chassis design so it's defo in for vintage. Do you really actually have one???

Dan,

Yup, MIP 4wd conversion on an RC10. Should be interesting to drive.

Oh yes one more thing, any reason why a 19t motor, as I was using a hell of a lot quicker in 89 and 90.

[VintageRacer]

The A finalists in 1987 Radio Race car series (modified class) were using 16 and 17 triples. All of them were racing CATs

[super__dan]

Stu, had a 19t in the mid which I ran after Batley regional. I can confirm it wasn't exactly fast, but no painfully slow like the stingers. Remember how much fun damo had when he used a 19t in the last round?

Of course this is my opinion and am happy to go with what you, G, jim etc decide

[OldTimer]

It's possible we can run two classes, 'Vintage' and 'Retro'.

'Vintage' - up to 1989 - 27t stock motors?
'Retro' - up to 1995 - 19t stock motors?

If this is what motors are used i can see me coming upto york to have a play ;)

[Stu]

Ok, points taken.

Maybe we should ditch the 'Retro' idea, and apply the Pre-1990 rule loosely as last year, leaving the decision to run something 'borderline' up to the concience of the individual.

Just have 27t & 19t heats.

I'd like to run the JRX-2 in 19t and the 6-gear RC10 in 27t.

[jimmy]

I'd like to run the Tamiya hornet in 35 turn 540 class haha

[Mrs oOple]

I would like to run the Tamiya Sand Scorcher, although I don't know anything about the numbers that go in it. (something slow anyway)

[jimmy]

you could stick somet mad in there and it would still be slow... I'm sure we can make a scorcher for you - but first crash and it will be in bits :o

[Col]

York club is gonna struggle this year I think:

Last year Phil resigned his post and no-one wanted to take the job, so he continued doing it. I've heard that he's called it a day now though (fair play - lots of grief for not alot of thanks if you ask me...)

Thats not all either - Tom and his Dad put alot of time into the club as well, but with Tom going to uni this year we're gonna be missing another 2 key members.

Don't take anything I've said as gospel, but getting regular race meeting going at all might not happen due to no-one being able to tow the trailer (with the track and computer in) to the venue:(

[Stu]

I'm sure there will be somewhere, there is pleny of time yet to sort it out.

Teesside?

[mattym0310]

im sure york will be fine. there is plenty of people to pull the trailor [i think :o] anyway, if the YORK vintage masters moved to Teeside it wouldnt be the YORK vintage masters anymore and teesside vintage masters just doesnt have the same ring to it :D

[Scoobster]

The Retro class sounds good to me i have a nice new built Bosscat Works that would be well at home in that class also why not split it between york and teesside? might be able to run more events that way

[super__dan]

I don't think this will be THAT popular, I think we should walk (and have fun) before we run!

[mattym0310]

so are we not using the sealed can 540 motors anymore??

[super__dan]

God I hope not. I agree with Stu that a decent modern 27T should be quicker than one of those stinger motors though personally am keen for the 19T.

[Col]

there is plenty of people to pull the trailor

We've already had meetings cancelled because no-one could be bothered to pull it...

[chrispattinson]

Can anyone comment on a Tamiya Terra Scorcher's eligibility. I got it for my 11th birthday, back in 1991, but I'm sure it should be a pre 1990 car.

[terry.sc]

Terra Scorcher was released December 1988 - no grey areas over eligibility with that one.

[chrispattinson]

Any ideas how it would go Terry, I havnt ran it since I was around 14 (will it be fairly competitive???). It does have the alloy A5 piece though.

[terry.sc]

As long as A5 has been replaced then it will be reliable. It made a very good club racer, neutral handling makes it easy to drive but it won't have that edge a proper race developed buggy will have. Should make a good runner but wouldn't necessarily be challenging for the overall win.

[Welshy40]

So if there was a retro event as well, and up to 95 would my prototype 93/94 version ZXS be valid, or is it to far advanced compared to the other cars?

Hell I wouldnt know which 4wd to race, RC10 or Lazer if there was an option

[super__dan]

Can of worms, xx4 anyone???

[Stu]

I think the 1995 retro thing was a bit of a bad call, I'm now regreting thinking out-loud.

I think we should stick with 1990 and go with 19t motors, possibly with a seperate 27t class if demand is there from those that don't want to put 19 turns of brute horsepower through pre-war chain drive mids or such stuff. :wtf:

[terry.sc]

Can of worms, xx4 anyone???
Easy answer, it didn't appear until 1997.

next..:D

[jimarea51]

Hi guys...

The way I see it is this...

I personally think that 4WD should run 27T or Stingers that were used last year, whilst the 2WD's can run no lower than a 19T. I feel this would even up things a little, therefore any advantage the 4WD's have in terms of grip and braking are lessened by the 2WD's being a bit quicker on the straights...

If people want to run 27t in their 2WD's then thats fine also...

Just my two peneth...

JImarea51

[Stu]

Sounds reasonable to me,

Dan?

[mattym0310]

i would like to run 20t HPI things like last year in my 6gear RC10, cos i dont really wna be spendin the extra money on brushes etc.

[Stu]

As long as it's less than 19t, that'll be fine.

[Northy]

I think we should be strick on the 1990 rule though ;)

G

[Stu]

Yeah.

[Northy]

So maybe a list of whats not allowed...... :confused:

I'll start:

XX4 :D

[Medders]

Can we also have a rule that cells that were released pre-1990 have to be used??

[Welshy40]

Can we also have a rule that cells that were released pre-1990 have to be used??

How easy is it to find 1700 sce cells? Very hard. I think we should stay with the ones we have now otherwise not many people will turn up to one that stipulates that rule.

[Medders]

I'm not sure it's such a bad idea as you make out.

One of the key features of racing of old was trying to extract maximum performace without dumping.

Instead of having rules on motors, lets have a cell capacity limit instead. There's plenty of 1400 or similar packs/cells available at low cost.

[Medders]

For example:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=160151671204&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=006

[mattym0310]

no, i dont think we should complicate things that much. i think we should stick to our normal cells as this idea would reduce the number of entrants by a long way as some won't have access to the older ones.

[JohnM]

Would a new re-release of the Hotshot be legal? Its 95% the same car as before, so still really a 22 year old car, just not broken yet.

[Stu]

If it's a Hot-Shot then it's legal.

Not important when the actual kit was made, as long as the original design for the car type is pre-1990.

Restricting the cells is gonna be hard work, I think Jim's 19t 2wd & 27t 4wd rule will work well and be enough.

[Medders]

I tried a 27T in my procat during lasts years vintage and I could have walked faster. Its too slow / underpowered for a 4wd.

Perhaps the cell limit idea was not the most practical, but can we at least stick to 19T for both classes?

[Stu]

Depends if there is enough entries to make two seperate classes.

Was it a modern 27 that you tried?

It really is a balancing act to get the most entries, some want 540 silvercans so they can run sand-scorchers without screwing them up, and there are those that want to run 19t in procats.

If enough people want to race we can run 2 classes that cater as best we can for all, but if not then we'll need to go with the middle ground.

Time to decide yet.

[Col]

Does anyone know of the Mardave cobra gearbox is the same as the meteor one? It seems mardave still do parts for the cobra but not the meteor...

[Medders]

Depends if there is enough entries to make two seperate classes.

Was it a modern 27 that you tried?



I wouldn't describe it as modern but is wasn't a standard 540 either.

[super__dan]

I'm all for keeping it simple!

I tried my Mid with a 19t at batley and it really wasn't very quick, I was running 2000mah cells but that's what I'm planning on running at the vintage so a fair trial. It would be painfull with a stock in so my RC10 would have to come back out of retirement.

As I say I'll go with whatever the actual organisers want to do (G, Stu, Jim etc) but I'm keen for any motors up to a 19t to be allowed and we all run together but maybe 2wd and 4wd count in a different overall championship? Anyone running a sandscorcher isn't really going for the "racing" are they? So them chosing to run 540's is their discretion?

I think forcing people to find/buy old cells is a complete no no. I wouldn't touch those 1400 scr's with a barge pole.

Col the gearboxes are COMPLETELY different. The cobra is effectivly a modern std layout nd will handle decent power no probs (though diff balls are shite) A meteor gearbox is HUGE gears and the spur is actually a reducer gear with 2 sets of teeth on it. You have to run 32dp too and a very small pinion.

[Medders]

I think that hits the nail on the head Dan.

I'm all for going with the flow but the CAT just won't go with a 27T.

Good to see the ammount of interest in the vintage, should be ace :cool:

[tjf]

Nothing wrong with 27t in 4wd thats what is used at Faversham and the racing is fast enough and close too. Ok it is a small hall but still fun :D