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#81
02-10-2012
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Apricot Slice, that is one neat build! As for the points raised on legality...
This car is eligible for GT12.1. It does not come as a kit so it is not subject to the price limit. It has "additional parts not supplied in the rolling chassis kit" as is allowed. It has no diff but it does have "replacements for other parts." Whether we think it is a VRX with a Supastox front end, or vice-versa, is not relevant to its inclusion. One can argue that it is not in the spirit of "This class is based on the principals of close, fair and low cost racing." (as it has cost a lot more than buying just one of those kits) but that is not a rule, just an overall description of what the class is for. I also agree that the chances of something like that beating the pants off the competition are low. With 930g of weight, a fixed camber at both ends and effectively cart axle suspension at both ends, the handling is almost totally reliant on the tyre contact patch, and that's the same for everyone. As for motive power, so far we find that they are all pretty much on a par once geared for a good lap time, and not just top speed. However, we will not be seeing that car in any National any time soon, since as far as I can make our neither the motor or the speedo are on any BRCA approved list.  Sorry Slice, couldn't resist!!Seriously, it is still an impressive build... 
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#83
03-10-2012
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I can tell you how much it cost. Apart from bits from Mardave, Schumacher and electrics, approximately £15 for some 2.4mm and 3.2mm grp. Not exactly beyond the realms of low cost.
__________________
All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.
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#85
12-10-2012
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6.1.1 The material of the chassis component must be available from the manufacturer in a kit available at or below the price limit in Rule 6.7 (Intent – that the material used for the chassis must be included as the chassis in a rolling chassis kit, not solely as upgrades to a rolling chassis kit).
__________________
MBModels - Schumacher Racing - Vapextech.co.uk - MRT - Savox - SMD
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#86
12-10-2012
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mardave sell a carbon kit under the price limit so that would be legal so long as carbon was used as the kit material then its fine u can not run a supastock with a carbon chassis as shue dont put it in a kit for under £100 but mardave do so u can run a mardave with a carbon chassis if you sold that kit as a full car with wheels like it states in the rules for under £100 with carbon chassis then it will be legal.
i do think this rule is a bit stupid the whole point of the gt12 class is to have a class of racing that is cheap so that rule sounds good as it would stop people going out and spending loads of money getting one off carbon parts made but you can spend as much money as you like on hot ups witch in the supastocks case can cost more than the car cost making it cost the same price as a full blown 12th scale and it dose seem unfair that madave can run a carbon chassis and no one else can may the rule should of band carbon full stop. people will always find a way round the rules like mardave have done to make carbon chassis legal for there drivers and no one else
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#87
12-10-2012
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Joker, here's the situation...
There is a class for cars that does not allow any hop-ups, and the cars must be run without a diff - GT12.2. This class is catered for at the Nationals. It is there to allow Clubs to run a lower-cost class and still have drivers able to enter racing at National level. GT12.1 allows hop-ups, so you can choose not to be in a class where you have to pay for hop-ups... or not. Mardave's carbon car was there before the Rules were set, and before there was a Supastox available. This car was developed because it handles much better than a Mardave with a GRP chassis. Before the Rules came out a carbon chassis was an option at about £30, and after the Rules the carbon car was sold at £10 more than the GRP car. Lower costs to us, I think! When Rules were formulated, both cars were then available. Both manufacturers were consulted before the Rules were set to make sure that both were happy with what was proposed and that we would not exclude any car on the market. In response to their comments, some changes were made to ensure that both cars were eligible, but the Rules did not favour one or the other. There was no question of things being unfair. As history relates, both cars are competitive, and one has a GRP chassis and one a carbon chassis. We feel the Rules have succeeded, and with the GT12.2 class the option to run in a class where spending money on hop-ups is not allowed is available to anyone. HTH 
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#88
12-10-2012
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it is unfair allowing one car to use something that the other can not its like saying you can run a diff but i carnt we all know carbon is better than grp and my supastox is so much faster with a carbon chassis than the stock one but as i carnt use it cos it dont come in the kit. all i was trying to say was that the car that Apricot Slice has made could be raced with carbon chassis so long as it was sold as a full kit and not just a hot up
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#89
12-10-2012
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It's not unfair, it is the choice of the manufacturer. Schumacher can put a CF-chassied car on the market if they choose to. Unfair would be if the Rules prevented them doing what Mardave are doing - they don't.
If you want a CF-chassied car from Schumacher, ask them why you can't have one. It's not the Rules at fault, it's the manufacturer not supplying what you want! You're right about the carbon chassis. Why don't you make one and sell it commercially through the shops as a complete kit, then you'd get what you want!! 
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#90
12-10-2012
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I thought the Mardave was made from CSC (Carbon Silca Composite) rather than full on Carbon. Schumacher could go this route if they could get the price under the class limit.
__________________
o0ple Trader Feedback NE Venue's New & Old my space on YouTube CFR RCTV Channel Glenn Atterton BRCA 2005 1/10th Off-Road Veterans Champion LMP12 National Champion 2003/2004 / F3 class
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#91
12-10-2012
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shue wont do it as it would take the cost well over the £100 limit so it would be pointless them doing it. and you couldnt sell it as a hot up as its alegal to run carbon on a supastock. you have missd the point i was making in the first place.
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#92
12-10-2012
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#93
12-10-2012
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yes thats rite so long as it comes in a kit for under the price limit the chassis can be made out of anything alloy, grp, carbon. so you could mod a carbon mardave chassis to take the schue front end and that would be fine but if you wanted to make your own chassis youd have to sell it as a full kit for under £100 and it can be made out of what ever you like
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#94
15-10-2012
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I made 2 of these... 'Super-Dave's'. Both had their first proper race last night at Lochgelly. I got a 2nd in the C final coz i'm rubbish and Paul got a 2nd in the A.
Busy working on a Mk2 at the moment which will be a proper new car not just a half dozen of one a 6 of the other job. It wont just be different but has features that eliminate the comedy steering at both ends and some other built in tuning options. Also... unless rigidity somehow gives you an edge, there is little if no advantage in fancy laminates. My model made out of plain old grp was spot on the weight limit rtr.
__________________
All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.
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#96
15-10-2012
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Never even bothered trying the SS as the back end is silly and the esc hangs over the edge. Dont know if the car is technically any quicker or slower around a bend or on the straight but bet I'm getting quicker lap times because its easier to drive.
__________________
All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.
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#98
01-11-2012
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__________________
Martyn Kyosho | Team Orion | Sanwa | Rudebits | Proline
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#99
02-11-2012
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When you got it sorted I dont think you will want to use a Mardave front end.
__________________
All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.
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#100
02-11-2012
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instead of tape use heatshrink
__________________
MBModels - Schumacher Racing - Vapextech.co.uk - MRT - Savox - SMD
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