The 22 Mid Motor Solution

[SHY]

Is it that much of a disadvatage? The good'ol S2 works great, and the driveshafts are quite angled on it...

-what effect does it have?

[Razer]

Originally Posted by SHY

Is it that much of a disadvatage? The good'ol S2 works great, and the driveshafts are quite angled on it...

-what effect does it have?

It can have a binding effect under power, making the suspension act a bit stiffer, and by that loose some grip and make it twitchy over bumps. But that's just the theory crap:P

I'm gonna try the rossmods short chassis today, but I think I'm gonna try this with the stock chassis as well

[Razer]

So, now I've tried the short Rossmods chassis, the stock setup, and stock chassis with arms turned.

With the Rossmods, the car felt quite nimble, but in a high grip, high speed situation, I didn't really feel this as an improvement. I believe that this could be better on clay with rear motor, but on Astro I didn't really like it.

The Pookster setup though, was very interesting. It was so grippy I went from good forward drive, to constant wheely king driving. It makes the car feel a bit stiff and unpredictable though, so unless the grip is down, I'd much rather run the stock car.

What I have found to be the "it" thing for me, is moving the shocks out on the rear arms. It can feel a bit slippier, but the rear end is just more there, more in tune with the front, so you don't have to wait for the car to turn going through tight corners.

As of now, I run regular saddles and no weights. tried some weight plates under the battery, but didn't really feel any better, just heavier and slower.

I feel I need to stop the car from rolling so much with the front, gonna test some springs and stuff this week. Here's my setup so far:

[Kusal]

And how was the chassis with the arms turned?

[hansie]

hello all,

I wasn't sure where to post this but the idea is from this thread.
The 22 in rear motor config is also lacking grip in low grip conditions.
When i read the idea of swapping the rear arms i was eager to try this.
This moves the motor back from the tires by 14 mm or so.
Which should give it more pressure on the rear tires.
I ran it yesterday for the first time and it was great.
More traction and a better balance between front end grip and rear grip.
The 22 always felt loose under acceleration wich was way better this way.
I drove a B4 yesterday for a comparison and my 22 felt better.
That was a first I can tell you.
When there is a lot of grip the 22 is fantastic, but that is rarely the case
at my track. So maybe with this solution I can get the car to work in
all conditions. The only downside I ran into is the weird forward sweep
that the driveshafts make. I ran about 6 packs and no problems so I think
it will hold.

Greetings

Hans

[OneKiwi]

What bits from maplan are you using?
Do you need the turnbuckel from the gear case to battery strap?

[The Pookster]

I'm currently moving the gearbox to chassis strap back to standard as I had a good look round and tinker with a C4.1 at the weekend and despite the balljointed chassis strap the chassis was very stiff, much stiffer than mine is at the moment. Not tested this yet though as I need to make a new battery strap which I'll do today.

Also because of the extra rear end my car now has it can get a bit locked in so I'm reducing rear toe to 3.5 and then 3.0 to see what happens. C4.1 was running 3.0 according to the block fitted.

Other thing I noticed about the C4.1 was how soft the suspension set was in terms of damping.

[Anibal Henriques]

Why do you compare always de 22 with C4.1 ,C4.1 is a proto and is driving buy expereinece pilots and if you look right you see lot of weight and bad finish production,22 is a production car already finish and need time for fine tunnig .I have a 22 now and im like a lot, i have driven a Kyosho RB5,X6 and a B4 and 22 is the one for me ,dont have weights,midmotor,astro track and have a good results ,last race podium it is all Losi,1-xxxcr2,2-22 Midmotor and 3 myself 22 midmotor.

[Razer]

Originally Posted by Anibal Henriques

Why do you compare always de 22 with C4.1 ,C4.1 is a proto and is driving buy expereinece pilots and if you look right you see lot of weight and bad finish production,22 is a production car already finish and need time for fine tunnig .I have a 22 now and im like a lot, i have driven a Kyosho RB5,X6 and a B4 and 22 is the one for me ,dont have weights,midmotor,astro track and have a good results ,last race podium it is all Losi,1-xxxcr2,2-22 Midmotor and 3 myself 22 midmotor.

The C4.1 has been pretty dominant on the UK scene this summer, whilst the 22 has not, so I guess that's a rather plausible reason...

[hansie]

Hello all,

The 22 is great on grippy tracks.
I ran the 22 rear motor on astro and it was very good.
Mid motor it wasn't all that great.
I do wander why a lot of people haven't tried running the
22 in rear motor config in the UK.
I was at a astro track 2 weeks ago for a national and the
22's running in rear config looked better than the mid 22's.
2 rear config 22's were on the podium.
The first mid 22 was in the B-final if I recall correctly.
I do know that a driver makes the difference but it still is
a nice benchmark.
So judging by that the mid motor version needs some work.
And even in rear config the 22 is loose on low grip tracks.

Greetings

Hans

[The Pookster]

Originally Posted by Anibal Henriques

Why do you compare always de 22 with C4.1 ,C4.1 is a proto and is driving buy expereinece pilots and if you look right you see lot of weight and bad finish production,22 is a production car already finish and need time for fine tunnig .I have a 22 now and im like a lot, i have driven a Kyosho RB5,X6 and a B4 and 22 is the one for me ,dont have weights,midmotor,astro track and have a good results ,last race podium it is all Losi,1-xxxcr2,2-22 Midmotor and 3 myself 22 midmotor.

Reason is because the C4.1 has won everything this year plus I've been watching Tom Yardy and a few others run it in the W. Midlands regionals. They are simply faster than anything else.

[The Pookster]

With some more work the car is really working well now. There is so much more traction on the rear it has responded well to less toe, so now steers and drives out of corners more naturally. Have also moved to a 25/5 front castor set up and stiffer front springs as well as the low friction damper o rings (work really nice). Also added more weight forwards.

Basic set up:

Front:
Black spring
4 x 55 piston with 30wt losi oil + low friction o ring
25 kick up with 5 castor block
2mm bumpsteer
1mm each end on camber link
0.5 deg camber
0.5 deg toe out

Rear:
Arms reversed
Yellow spring
4 x 1.5mm taper with 32.5wt losi oil + low friction o ring
3.5 deg LRC
Hubs LWB
1 deg camber

1670g total weight

[SHY]

Originally Posted by Razer

So, now I've tried the short Rossmods chassis, the stock setup, and stock chassis with arms turned.

With the Rossmods, the car felt quite nimble, but in a high grip, high speed situation, I didn't really feel this as an improvement. I believe that this could be better on clay with rear motor, but on Astro I didn't really like it.

The Pookster setup though, was very interesting. It was so grippy I went from good forward drive, to constant wheely king driving. It makes the car feel a bit stiff and unpredictable though, so unless the grip is down, I'd much rather run the stock car.

What I have found to be the "it" thing for me, is moving the shocks out on the rear arms. It can feel a bit slippier, but the rear end is just more there, more in tune with the front, so you don't have to wait for the car to turn going through tight corners.

As of now, I run regular saddles and no weights. tried some weight plates under the battery, but didn't really feel any better, just heavier and slower.

I feel I need to stop the car from rolling so much with the front, gonna test some springs and stuff this week. Here's my setup so far:

Seems like you did something right my man! This guy won the Norwegian Championship last weekend!

[Razer]

Originally Posted by SHY

Seems like you did something right my man! This guy won the Norwegian Championship last weekend!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7miRCLeFSJo

[JoelMaher]

I tried this today on carpet on the JM08 Stealth chassis. Although the backend felt more stable in the corners I think there is too much forward sweep on the driveshaft resulting in a loss of drive. I swapped the wishbones back around into the normal positions after 2 rounds of qualifying and the car was overall alot better, it was able to clear the doubles with ease unlike before. My time was also signifficantly better with the wishbones in the normal positions so I'm not really convinced with this 'solution'.