Lazer zxr

[alcyon]

ok now we all have 2 options that i narrowed down.
1. New layshaft that uses new rear pulley but existing front pulley and one way. This layshaft will be cheapest to produce, but a new pulley must be bought, like from MISUMI corporation, the problem is you need to buy 2 things, the new layshaft and new aluminium pulley. Might not be cheap. With this option, you only need to use 1 original pulley, so saves you 1 piece original pulley, extending original pulley life. the pulley catalog is shown. note that 14 Tooth is the minimum pulley size and it has set screw in the middle of a tooth, the shaft ID is also 4mm, perfect for the Lazer.

Option 2.
New layshaft with peak performance style spline slot. That means both the front and rear original lazer pulleys must be used. Now the question is, how hard is it to get new Kyosho lazer pulleys if your current ones wear out? If the original pulleys can last very long or is easy to get, then this option makes the most sense cause you only need to buy the layshaft.

I can make a 3D solidworks model for both, you guys have a look and vote on it.

Pic 1, Misumi industrial S3M pulley catalog, pulley uses M3 grub screw in between a tooth for lock pulley.
Pic 2. Kawada Sv-10 Aluminium 16T pulley, look how compact it is. will fit great on the lazer layshaft.
Pic 3 Kawada SV-10 pulley side view, notice the slot cut into it. for the 1mm pin to lock the pulley.
Pic 4. Kawada SV-10 Layshaft, its 4mm like the lazers, and the pin holes are 1mm. i have yet to break these layshafts on my SV-10 eventhough i have ran the car for 10 years + and used crazy motors on it.
Pic 5 My Kawada SV-10 Alcyon II, yes thats where i got my name.Notice how simliar it is to the Lazer, graphite saddle pack chassis, twin belts, mid motor, layshaft above the motor.
Can anyone find a similar pulley in 14T?

[Ema]

I think that the type of pulley used into RC cars is HTD 3M, so not really sure that the mitsumi pulley will works correctly.

Bye
Ema

[alcyon]

Originally Posted by Ema

I think that the type of pulley used into RC cars is HTD 3M, so not really sure that the mitsumi pulley will works correctly.

Bye
Ema

according to the catalog is S3M, and i checked with the Kawada belt it also says S3M. if this pulley doesnt work, have any of you seen any pulley that is similar in mounting to the kawada pulley i shown?

[isobarik]

As i posted before yes i have an 14 S3M pully that is avaliable from the LHS since thats where i got them from, pin fastening.

mvh Isobarik

[Welshy40]

Iso what make/brand is the pulley?

[Welshy40]

Originally Posted by alcyon

ok now we all have 2 options that i narrowed down.
1. New layshaft that uses new rear pulley but existing front pulley and one way. This layshaft will be cheapest to produce, but a new pulley must be bought, like from MISUMI corporation, the problem is you need to buy 2 things, the new layshaft and new aluminium pulley. Might not be cheap. With this option, you only need to use 1 original pulley, so saves you 1 piece original pulley, extending original pulley life. the pulley catalog is shown. note that 14 Tooth is the minimum pulley size and it has set screw in the middle of a tooth, the shaft ID is also 4mm, perfect for the Lazer.

Option 2.
New layshaft with peak performance style spline slot. That means both the front and rear original lazer pulleys must be used. Now the question is, how hard is it to get new Kyosho lazer pulleys if your current ones wear out? If the original pulleys can last very long or is easy to get, then this option makes the most sense cause you only need to buy the layshaft.

I can make a 3D solidworks model for both, you guys have a look and vote on it.

Pic 1, Misumi industrial S3M pulley catalog, pulley uses M3 grub screw in between a tooth for lock pulley.
Pic 2. Kawada Sv-10 Aluminium 16T pulley, look how compact it is. will fit great on the lazer layshaft.
Pic 3 Kawada SV-10 pulley side view, notice the slot cut into it. for the 1mm pin to lock the pulley.
Pic 4. Kawada SV-10 Layshaft, its 4mm like the lazers, and the pin holes are 1mm. i have yet to break these layshafts on my SV-10 eventhough i have ran the car for 10 years + and used crazy motors on it.
Pic 5 My Kawada SV-10 Alcyon II, yes thats where i got my name.Notice how simliar it is to the Lazer, graphite saddle pack chassis, twin belts, mid motor, layshaft above the motor.
Can anyone find a similar pulley in 14T?

I think your now seeing why i prefer doing this with the layshaft with a pin holding the pulley in place.

[isobarik]

Originally Posted by Welshy40

Iso what make/brand is the pulley?

Its a well known brand ...............

and i have 6 of them...... i think

mvh Isobarik

[Welshy40]

Originally Posted by isobarik

Its a well known brand ...............

and i have 6 of them...... i think

mvh Isobarik

Tamiya, kyosho, a&l tbh i have zero idea

[alcyon]

Originally Posted by Welshy40

I think your now seeing why i prefer doing this with the layshaft with a pin holding the pulley in place.

Welshy, still no one has told me, how easy is it to get new original Lazer pulleys, or alternatively, could they last very very long? i have yet to change my pulleys, but i only used my Lazer for like a few years so i wont know.

Also i might be able to locate 39655 blue steering parts at a good price, question is do i need to cut the parts and if yes at which area?

[Welshy40]

Originally Posted by alcyon

Welshy, still no one has told me, how easy is it to get new original Lazer pulleys, or alternatively, could they last very very long? i have yet to change my pulleys, but i only used my Lazer for like a few years so i wont know.

Also i might be able to locate 39655 blue steering parts at a good price, question is do i need to cut the parts and if yes at which area?

The pulleys last quite some time if using a lower wind motor like a 10.5 but if using a 5.5 then at the moment not long however this is the reason why im redesigning the rear gearbox with tensioners to stop this hsppening. With a revised layshaft designed and made by you we should have stopped the belt snapping and damaging the pulley. The pulleys can be made by my friend Matt but all dependant on his work load and his prices are very resonable.

Blue steering you dont need to cut at all but i tend to cut the end lug off by cutting through the last screw hole where the servo tie rod attaches but not really needed if its not rubbing on the belt.

[isobarik]

Originally Posted by Welshy40

Tamiya, kyosho, a&l tbh i have zero idea

Its KYOSHO .....damn arent i like the best parts finder in the world ???

mvh Isobarik

[oosh123]

Originally Posted by alcyon

according to the catalog is S3M, and i checked with the Kawada belt it also says S3M. if this pulley doesnt work, have any of you seen any pulley that is similar in mounting to the kawada pulley i shown?

Kyosho Spider Alloy Pulleys

[isobarik]

Originally Posted by oosh123

Kyosho Spider Alloy Pulleys

ta da........

mvh Isobarik

[alcyon]

Originally Posted by oosh123

Kyosho Spider Alloy Pulleys

hmm but i thought the spider is out of production... anyway can you show me a pic of those pulleys front and side view?

[alcyon]

Originally Posted by Welshy40

The pulleys last quite some time if using a lower wind motor like a 10.5 but if using a 5.5 then at the moment not long however this is the reason why im redesigning the rear gearbox with tensioners to stop this hsppening. With a revised layshaft designed and made by you we should have stopped the belt snapping and damaging the pulley. The pulleys can be made by my friend Matt but all dependant on his work load and his prices are very resonable.

Blue steering you dont need to cut at all but i tend to cut the end lug off by cutting through the last screw hole where the servo tie rod attaches but not really needed if its not rubbing on the belt.

thats good if original type pulleys can be remade, so should i first design the layshaft to use original pulleys for the rear?

[Welshy40]

Originally Posted by isobarik

ta da........

mvh Isobarik

Its going to be one of those days

[Welshy40]

Originally Posted by alcyon

thats good if original type pulleys can be remade, so should i first design the layshaft to use original pulleys for the rear?

Im now wondering about this now. Maybe you are right as if we fit a hole in the layshaft how are we going to fit the void between the pulley and outer bearing? Maybe the solution is your A&L idea.

[alcyon]

Originally Posted by Welshy40

Im now wondering about this now. Maybe you are right as if we fit a hole in the layshaft how are we going to fit the void between the pulley and outer bearing? Maybe the solution is your A&L idea.

filling the void, is a machined step in the shaft itself, whether using the peak performance style layshaft or the one with the pin, thats step will be there to take the place of the missing rear layshaft hub, to hold the outer 8x14mm bearing. Now...it rained tonight with lightning so i did not log on to the net tonight..until now. i was doing a week long download and compilation of various vintage tamiya and kyosho videos to put on a DVD so that i can watch them on my big screen LCD TV, but since it was a thunderstorm and couldnt log on, i spent about 2 hours plus on the layshaft design. i already got a working idea, have a look at the pic.
PIC 1 shows the layshaft assembled with the B4 slipper plates, spur gear, and spring in place. Note the spring is set at zero compression so thats why the nut looks like its far out at the edge. Also slipper pads not shown but you get the idea.
Pic 2. The layshaft only from slipper spur gear side. note the B4 end that will work perfectly with the B4 parts. the "wall" after the flat to hold the B4 plate, is to stabilise the B4 plate becuase the end of the B4 plate will sit on this wall. the diameter is 8mm. then it goes to 10mm, then back to 8mm to hold the inner 8x14mm bearing.
Pic 3. The layshaft as seen from One way side. Notice its as if the rear hub is bonded to the layshaft, peak performance style. So you can place in your original pulley for the rear. The circlip groove distance is exactly the same as the original ZX shaft. Asembling this shaft is by placing the 8x14mm bearing inside , then slot the layshaft from the spur gear side of the gearbox, next place in the rear pulley, then place in the thrust bearing parts, then lock your e clip in. then place your front pulley and one way hub, the end washer and the M3 Nut. Voila.

If you notice in the first picture that the hub looks like its somehow joined with the 4mm layshaft, well the actual part wont be like that. it will be one complete piece. In solidworks there is an option to create all the parts seperately then joined them together in a file part, by inserting a part into a part, thats why the shaft looks like its made of 2 pieces.
That means the stock material will follow the largest diameter on the part which is 10mm. then will be machined down to 8mm steps on left and right side, then to 4mm to place the one way, then to 3mm to thread the ends. You get the idea?

So if you guys got any suggestions,questions, objections, praises ,etc, voice it out now.

[Welshy40]

Originally Posted by alcyon

filling the void, is a machined step in the shaft itself, whether using the peak performance style layshaft or the one with the pin, thats step will be there to take the place of the missing rear layshaft hub, to hold the outer 8x14mm bearing. Now...it rained tonight with lightning so i did not log on to the net tonight..until now. i was doing a week long download and compilation of various vintage tamiya and kyosho videos to put on a DVD so that i can watch them on my big screen LCD TV, but since it was a thunderstorm and couldnt log on, i spent about 2 hours plus on the layshaft design. i already got a working idea, have a look at the pic.
PIC 1 shows the layshaft assembled with the B4 slipper plates, spur gear, and spring in place. Note the spring is set at zero compression so thats why the nut looks like its far out at the edge. Also slipper pads not shown but you get the idea.
Pic 2. The layshaft only from slipper spur gear side. note the B4 end that will work perfectly with the B4 parts. the "wall" after the flat to hold the B4 plate, is to stabilise the B4 plate becuase the end of the B4 plate will sit on this wall. the diameter is 8mm. then it goes to 10mm, then back to 8mm to hold the inner 8x14mm bearing.
Pic 3. The layshaft as seen from One way side. Notice its as if the rear hub is bonded to the layshaft, peak performance style. So you can place in your original pulley for the rear. The circlip groove distance is exactly the same as the original ZX shaft. Asembling this shaft is by placing the 8x14mm bearing inside , then slot the layshaft from the spur gear side of the gearbox, next place in the rear pulley, then place in the thrust bearing parts, then lock your e clip in. then place your front pulley and one way hub, the end washer and the M3 Nut. Voila.

If you notice in the first picture that the hub looks like its somehow joined with the 4mm layshaft, well the actual part wont be like that. it will be one complete piece. In solidworks there is an option to create all the parts seperately then joined them together in a file part, by inserting a part into a part, thats why the shaft looks like its made of 2 pieces.
That means the stock material will follow the largest diameter on the part which is 10mm. then will be machined down to 8mm steps on left and right side, then to 4mm to place the one way, then to 3mm to thread the ends. You get the idea?

So if you guys got any suggestions,questions, objections, praises ,etc, voice it out now.

Looks good, thats basically how I imagined it when I was trying to use the hyper clutch parts but the layshaft was too short. This should resolve all issues and also should mean that the layshaft pulleys will last a very long time.

Im still a bit puzzled by what you are saying about "then will be machined down to 8mm steps on left and right side, then to 4mm to place the one way, then to 3mm to thread the ends. You get the idea?" Im sorry if I sound dense (shut up Iso ) but do I understand the one way which is on the opposite side of the gearbox will be 4mm depth and the other side where the slipper clutch is will be 8mm or am I being really dense (most probably especially the way I feel).

[Ema]

Originally Posted by alcyon

...

So if you guys got any suggestions,questions, objections, praises ,etc, voice it out now.

Amazing job !!!!

Welshy, the 3mm parts are necessary to create the threaded sections for the two locknuts, one for the one way and one for the slipper (if alcyon don't want to use an imperial 5/40 nut ...).

Is a 3mm nut enough big to keep in place the B4 spring ?
Or maybe is it necessary a plate assembly like the B4.1 ?

In any case really a great job , hope that sooner or later we can got it in our hands .

Bye
Ema