rear shock mod kit fitted.......

[Garry Spice]

any one fitted their rear shock mod yet? any pictures?

[MHeadling]

Hi Garry, pics of the kit fitted, you can see the difference with the white CAT (Std). Took ten minutes to fit! Who knows what it will be like indoors?!

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You will have to excuse the funky full spikes! They are for polished wood floor at Faversham!

[MHeadling]

One of the new camber plate:

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The inner hole is std fitment for the Phil Booth edition rear camber plate, there is not much clearence between the ball joint and rear out drive, if you are running diff savers it will be close or not fit!

[Chrislong]

Indoors, on carpet -> try it and if you don't like it, put std rear end back on

[DaveG28]

Does the update kit come with any setup advice, eg are you meant to extend/shorten shock shafts, change springs etc?

Asking as the Tamiya 511 has a very similar option, but no advice, and I really struggled to sort a setup!

[mikeyscott]

It increases the rear toe in massively.. need to loose some shims on the rear.

What rear toe in are people generally using?

People still running this mod?

[discostu]

you must have somthing wrong if you turn the arms and mounts around and use the same washers in the same position it is the same if you just turn the arms around to get the swb vesion again the washers in the same place it will be the same apart from wheel base.

stu

[mikeyscott]

I'll check it over again tonight, but 99% I've done it right. Need to check my camber etc. anyway and toe in on the front etc. with a set-up station I have.

It was very late when I did it originally.

How much toe in are people generally running on the back anyway?

[geerno]

I flipped the arms and didn't notice any increased Toe In

Mod is good. Great for loose tracks. I filed back the inner arms at the rear to lengthen the wheel base back a couple of mm. The shafts popped from the out-drive from random impacts. Also running 2 whities on each rear shock shaft to limit travel. Kept breaking rear updated out drives (3) on a jump we have that has a crap landing transition.

Still using mod as I like the shorter wheel base, not sure of the benefits of having the shocks further back other than weight and front of arm flex.

[mikeyscott]

Originally Posted by geerno

I flipped the arms and didn't notice any increased Toe In

Maybe due to it being late I didn't take note of how it was originally

[stefke]

I tried the mod but only liked it on smooth slippery tracks. On bumpy tracks the increased rear driveshaft angle just seems to lock the suspension to much when on power.

I mostly use the original arm position with the shocks at the rear.

Toe-in : most of the time I use 3.2° or 3.6°. Sometimes 2.6° on astro tracks.

[mikeyscott]

Originally Posted by stefke

I tried the mod but only liked it on smooth slippery tracks. On bumpy tracks the increased rear driveshaft angle just seems to lock the suspension to much when on power.

I mostly use the original arm position with the shocks at the rear.

Toe-in : most of the time I use 3.2° or 3.6°. Sometimes 2.6° on astro tracks.

Interesting as I've been looking at it after fitting it and I'm not 100% convinced. I noticed that at the Euros Mossy was running the Cat is standard kit form.

I'm racing on a reasonable bumpy astro turf track with a few small jumps.

[stefke]

Originally Posted by mikeyscott

I'm racing on a reasonable bumpy astro turf track with a few small jumps.

IMHO those very conditions are a big no-no for the arm reverse mod.

But I do like the mod on clay tracks.

[mikeyscott]

Still need to sort out the camber, which I'll do later tonight

See how I get on this weekend

[discostu]

i see you have done the short wheel base mod i can tell by the drive shaft angle to be fair im not conviced on this i think the by swapping the hangers around aswell and cutting the rear bumper it keeps the wheel base the same as standard but the added advantage of getting more weight over the rear of the car.

stu

[mikeyscott]

Originally Posted by discostu

i see you have done the short wheel base mod i can tell by the drive shaft angle to be fair im not conviced on this i think the by swapping the hangers around aswell and cutting the rear bumper it keeps the wheel base the same as standard but the added advantage of getting more weight over the rear of the car.

stu

So I need to flip the purple mounting points round too

I see how the drive shafts now rub against the diff cups when suspension is at full travel.. Part of me is somewhat not convinced about this mod.

I'm half tempted to shove it back to standard

[geerno]

It all comes down to lap times in the end.

[bender]

Originally Posted by discostu

i see you have done the short wheel base mod i can tell by the drive shaft angle to be fair im not conviced on this i think the by swapping the hangers around aswell and cutting the rear bumper it keeps the wheel base the same as standard but the added advantage of getting more weight over the rear of the car.

stu

After trying the swb mod a few weeks ago my car was better, but I was convinced it was mainly due to the driveshaft sweep and not the placement of the shocks.

I calculated the weight % and distance when the shocks were at the back and the value was relatively small, so I didn't think it would make much of a difference.

Last raceday I modified the arms so that the driveshaft sweep was the same as the swb mod, but the shocks were back on the front of the arm, and I expected the car to perform similar to the previous meeting.

In the end, the car was terrible, and I had a lot of trouble trying to get grip. I ended up running almost 4 degrees of toe-in at the back, which combined with the driveshaft sweep, made the car handle very badly. This was very surprising as I didn't think the location of the shocks was that important.

For tomorrows meeting I have made further changes, reversing the suspension mounts as posted above (the Chris Long method).
You end up with a slightly shorter wheelbase than std, plus only a little more driveshaft sweep, and of course the shocks are at the back of the car, but doing it this way also means all the arms and suspension mounts are further back too, which adds to the weight at the back.

[discostu]

we done a little test at a race meeting my car was running the long rear shock mod and my good friend and long time racing buddy ran his as standard what was intresting as the day went on we changed his car slowley into mine we already had the same roll centres and shock pistons oils springs toe caster camber motor etc what i am getting at towards the end of the day from a car that was nearly 1.5sec alap slower down to only a 10th slower by the end of the day im not saying its a must do mod and i do believe it does depend on race track and driving style but certanly for myself it seems to work.

on a simular sinario a rear shcok mod was done for the corally rdx phi tc i also tried this when it was first seen for a simular reason to get more forward traction however i found this to make the car a little unpredictable as it genrated a pendulm effect when of throttle and genraly upset the overal balance of the car i aprectiate that a tc is a compleatle diffrent form of racing than off road but the setups will work across the board in very simular situations i ended up going back to the orignal shock setup and that car just felt better and faster to me and on the race track it was.

stu rand

[discostu]

Originally Posted by bender

After trying the swb mod a few weeks ago my car was better, but I was convinced it was mainly due to the driveshaft sweep and not the placement of the shocks.

I calculated the weight % and distance when the shocks were at the back and the value was relatively small, so I didn't think it would make much of a difference.

Last raceday I modified the arms so that the driveshaft sweep was the same as the swb mod, but the shocks were back on the front of the arm, and I expected the car to perform similar to the previous meeting.

In the end, the car was terrible, and I had a lot of trouble trying to get grip. I ended up running almost 4 degrees of toe-in at the back, which combined with the driveshaft sweep, made the car handle very badly. This was very surprising as I didn't think the location of the shocks was that important.

For tomorrows meeting I have made further changes, reversing the suspension mounts as posted above (the Chris Long method).
You end up with a slightly shorter wheelbase than std, plus only a little more driveshaft sweep, and of course the shocks are at the back of the car, but doing it this way also means all the arms and suspension mounts are further back too, which adds to the weight at the back.

yeah dont forget these cars are very small and it only takes a slight change in spring oils wieght distribution to compleate change the feel of the car prime example the tamiya 501x and the 511 they are very simular cars the battery placement is about 2mm diffrence on the chassis making it feel maybe easier on the track if its easier on the track its easy to drive it fast and more importanly consitant.