touring car esc+motor combo

[team n.o.m.a.d]

im going to run a mi4lp and need a esc+motor brushless combo (13.5) what would be good to use? reasonably priced options

[Matt_N]

What do you consider as reasonably priced? I'd recommend the Tekin RS + Tekin 13.5t combo personally. A slightly cheaper option, which I'd also recommend, is the Hobbywing Xtreme Stock with GM 13.5t with 1600 Gauss rotor. For this, you'll need to buy the LCD Programming box should you wish to update the software when any new versions come out.

Matt

[Swalls]

Hi, I currently run a GM Genius 90 and 13.5 combo and am really happy with it. The system has got real linear feel and is really driveable, unlike some systems which I have tried and hated (yes that's right I'm looking at you Tekin!).

If the GM stuff is a bit much price wise then I think a Speed Passion combo is good. I would say though as a final point, although the GM is a little more dosh up front it is a truly future proof system and clever to boot. You will need to delve a little deeper into your grey matter with it but at the end of the day I think the GM stuff is the cleverest out there.

So it all depends on how you define your value and I'm lovin' the GM gear.

[Matt_N]

Another combo which is ballistic outdoors is the GM Genius 75 with Graupner 13.5t. However, the motor isn't BRCA legal, which would be a problem if you wish to compete in bigger events.

Matt

[ianhaye]

i run gm120 with sp v3 motor, and i admit the esc is great, but... i wouldnt rekomend it for not very experanced drivers, the pc softwere is pretty complicated to work out, so would need to know a good bit about brushless to get the most out of it. if u can do that they uve got uself a flyer :-)

[Hobbywing UK]

Originally Posted by team n.o.m.a.d

im going to run a mi4lp and need a esc+motor brushless combo (13.5) what would be good to use? reasonably priced options

Hobbywing Xtreme Stock Combo available, ESC, 13.5T Motor and LCD (PC) Program Card all for £134.99 use PROMO Code OOPLE for additional discount.

http://www.racersinexile.org.uk/Hobb...0_1607315.aspx

HWUK

[kartdemon]

I have to say that Nick from Demon Products in the UK uses the following and it out paces everything.

GM 120 2010 ESC
Graupner 13.5T

The solder jobs on these motors is not great so he normally resolders the points in the motor with High Temp solder.

Maybe his ESC settings contribute but he is normally happy to pass them to anyone.

I will be trying a Hobbywing 120amp with the Graupner/Corally 13.5 in an effort to keep up with him this Sunday down the straight.

I tried my Hobbywing and X12 but was off his speed down the straight. Tried everything with this combo. Even pushing the motor to the limits not caring what I blew up. 130C in 2 runs motor temp and then 110c but to no avail. And no damage was done to the motor either.

Just going to do a straight swap with the Graupner leaving settings on the ESC similar along with the FDR.

Grr.

[NTS]

I have a Tekin available if anyone is interested. It is a pretty safe choice as they tend run cool and there is plenty of setup advise available.

http://www.oople.com/forums/showthread.php?t=68106

[colmo]

Originally Posted by kartdemon

I tried my Hobbywing and X12 but was off his speed down the straight. Tried everything with this combo. Even pushing the motor to the limits not caring what I blew up. 130C in 2 runs motor temp and then 110c but to no avail. And no damage was done to the motor either.

I was under the impression the Hobbywing ESC and X12 motor was not a good combination because the LRP motors have too much timing? The idea being you have zero or little timing on the motor, and ramp it right up as the RPMs increase via the ESC. This means efficient, high torque at low RPMs, ramping up to huge top-end RPM as the timing advances - iirc, maxing out at a total of 60 degrees, counting timing advance + boost + motor timing.

I know the Speed Passion V3 / Speed Passion w/ HW firmware is the preferred choice of the #1 speed freak at UMCC, and he is constantly tinkering with ESC/motor to get more power.

The last firmware update from hobbywing really impressed me - lots of detail, and they switched to real units from arbitrary numbers. Timing advances x degrees per y RPMs etc.

I'd look at the latest GM motors with 1600 gauss magnets (barely less than those insane Graupner Sport motors) and adjustable timing, with either Hobbywing or GM ESC.

[damselfly]

I'd highly recommend the Fusion exceed. I use the exceed 10.5 race, but am aware that they do a 13.5t for about £80.
I've had mine for several months in a buggy with a fdr of about 6.70. The motor and esc hasn't gone over 120F and the car does around 40-45mph and still has scope for higher gearing.
With the Fusion exceed being available from the UK it's also supplied with a warranty.

[damselfly]

I'd highly recommend the Fusion exceed. I use the exceed 10.5 race, but am aware that they do a 13.5t for about £80.
I've had mine for several months in a buggy with a fdr of about 9. The motor and esc hasn't gone over 120F and the car does around 40-45mph.
With the Fusion exceed being available from the UK it's also supplied with a warranty.
PS- It's also a sensored setup and has numerous programming options including; Max temperature, max speed, abs, current voltage, ETC.. ETC..

[colmo]

Originally Posted by damselfly

I'd highly recommend the Fusion exceed. I use the exceed 10.5 race, but am aware that they do a 13.5t for about £80.
I've had mine for several months in a buggy with a fdr of about 9. The motor and esc hasn't gone over 120F and the car does around 40-45mph.
With the Fusion exceed being available from the UK it's also supplied with a warranty.
PS- It's also a sensored setup and has numerous programming options including; Max temperature, max speed, abs, current voltage, ETC.. ETC..

I have to disagree there - yes, the Fusion Exceed does fine in a buggy. However, this thread is specific to touring cars, and currently there is something of an arms race in ESC technology in the stock classes. The main runners are Tekin, GM, Speed Passion/Hobbywing and LRP/Nosram. Not only do they all have timing advance, something I believe the Exceed does not, but have regular firmware updates to get their noses slightly in front.

I can tell you a tourer running a 13.5T motor and ESC with no dynamic timing advance will be destroyed by those that do. I was running a tourer with boosted 17.5 motor that was as quick as the 10.5 non-boosted I ran previously.

[damselfly]

Originally Posted by colmo

I have to disagree there - yes, the Fusion Exceed does fine in a buggy. However, this thread is specific to touring cars, and currently there is something of an arms race in ESC technology in the stock classes. The main runners are Tekin, GM, Speed Passion/Hobbywing and LRP/Nosram. Not only do they all have timing advance, something I believe the Exceed does not, but have regular firmware updates to get their noses slightly in front.

I can tell you a tourer running a 13.5T motor and ESC with no dynamic timing advance will be destroyed by those that do. I was running a tourer with boosted 17.5 motor that was as quick as the 10.5 non-boosted I ran previously.

it's a good job the exceed range have timing advance then!

Here is an image of the programming options on mine;

[big air]

Originally Posted by damselfly

it's a good job the exceed range have timing advance then!

Here is an image of the programming options on mine;

Don't think it's dynamic though ie Turbo

[SpeedPartners]

Hello,

Maybe this can help you.

GM i think the fastest speedcontrol available this moment but the hardest to set-up.

Speedpassion Stock or LPF: easy to set-up and very reliable and with the optional case to put the latest software in the speedcontrol.

Tekin: Sorry guys, but my opinion is hard to set-up but less then GM. I have seen a lot of blow-ups with this speedcontrol.

Hobbywing: think the same as Speedpassion.

If you are an experienced driver you have to get the GM.
If you are a club driver with less experience you must take the hobbywing or speedpassion and drive a lot to get more experience in set-up the car and speedcontrol.
You can have the best speedcontrol but when you can not handle the power it's a waste of the money. Better to use this on tires and driving the car a lot. When the time comes to get a better speedcontrol you have then the latest technology.

The Schumacher MI4LP is a very good car and choice.

Have fun driving.

SpeedPartners

[qatmix]

Hi all I don't want to threadjack, but I have a question

I have been racing for years at my club and although it's a very tight track (the longest straight is 15m) however we use 8.5 -10.5t motors in the fastest heat with our TC's

As you can expect a 10.5t usually wins as it's more consistant, as the infield is very tight so there is a lot of sharp corners where you scrub a lot of speed.

I was wondering, would a 13.5t boosted be a better solution? Keeping things smooth on the infield and boosting on the straight? Or would I just be too slow?

Also is boost useable on such a tight circuit? The straight is usually over in less than 1.5 secs?

Sorry for the questions but despite our racers being experienced., noone has ever used boost on our esc's. (I have a SP v2 lPf which I have never upgraded)

Cheers

[DCM]

I exclusively run Tekin products, but here goes (by the way, every Tekin I have set up for people have never seen a blow up, you just don't need to turn up everything to the Max...).

I was running on a large indoor track with foams and 10.5 in boosted trim, and it was exciting but was a little 'wayward' with all the power, I decided to try a 13.5 and what a transformation. OK I would lose a foot maybe on the straight, but mostly I would lose nothing, but would gain 0.5s to a second on the infield as the car was just much easier to drive out of the corners, the less grunt meant I could get it out the corner precisely every time and would easily pull a gap on 10.5's.

[SpeedPartners]

Hello,

You are right about the 13,5T.
If you look at the ETS and see almost the same times between the modified and super stock.

A 13.5T is smoother than a 10.5 but if u are a experience driver, u are faster with a lower turns. Most drivers think they are experience so there it goes wrong and they are faster with higher turns.

About the speedcontrols, the most people want to have the best speedcontrol available but don't want to learn a LOT about setting it up and make then the wrong set-ups. That's why they blow up. The GM has a temp control and shuts down the power. The other side of this speedcontrol is the enormous possibility for settings. Almost to much.

[sosidge]

Originally Posted by qatmix

Hi all I don't want to threadjack, but I have a question

I have been racing for years at my club and although it's a very tight track (the longest straight is 15m) however we use 8.5 -10.5t motors in the fastest heat with our TC's

As you can expect a 10.5t usually wins as it's more consistant, as the infield is very tight so there is a lot of sharp corners where you scrub a lot of speed.

I was wondering, would a 13.5t boosted be a better solution? Keeping things smooth on the infield and boosting on the straight? Or would I just be too slow?

Also is boost useable on such a tight circuit? The straight is usually over in less than 1.5 secs?

Sorry for the questions but despite our racers being experienced., noone has ever used boost on our esc's. (I have a SP v2 lPf which I have never upgraded)

Cheers

I've run my 13.5 on a few tracks that size (Chippenham, Gloucester) against people running motors as quick as 10.5 boosted.

All you will lose against the quicker cars is a couple of metres at the end of the straight, but the milder motor is a lot more consistent. No point being quick on the straight if you can't hit your apexes!

I also find boost harder to drive on a small track like that due to to the uneven power delivery.

Basically, the faster motor is worth a couple of tenths per lap, but hard to do consistently.

My regular club track (Chippenham) has a straight just under 20m (sometimes they lay out a shorter straight of 16m), I find that 13.5 boosted is a shade too fast, and prefer 13.5 zero-timing.

As it happens, I couldn't find a good boost settings at the last Carpet Thrashnal (30x16m track), so switched to zero-timing, threw on a big pinion, and matched my best laptimes. The only place I was losing time was at the end of the longest straight, and the end of a medium straight in the middle of the track. Through the corners I was just as fast, if not faster as it was easier to drive.

[qatmix]

Thanks for that. I am quite consistent with my current motor but it's all about the infield and I am sure the softer motor will be great for that.

Is it worth updating the software, even if I don't intend to use boost?