Yokomo YZ-4

[neallewis]

Originally Posted by badger5

The press release comments on the desire for small diffs, I presume this is to reduce rotating mass and inertia but how will this make the car easier to drive? Surely the wheels and tyres will have a far bigger influence on rotating mass and inertia, will we see lightweight wheels/tyres/inserts in the future? Or do the diffs have a different influence?

This is to reduce the distance between the centre of the out drive and the lowest point on bottom of chassis, so roll centre adjustment. The issues with the Bmax4 roll centres, height of outdrives, and requirements for a high roll stiffness (thick antiroll bars and stiff springs) are limiting to the setup. This is because of the size of the diff casing and crown gear sets the minimum height the geometry has to be. Reduce the diff size, and rotating mass of the diffs, and it solves the issue. I've discussed this with Shin and Lee when trying to address handling characteristics of the bmax4iii
I suspect the yz4 will use regular bmax2/yz2 gear and ball diffs as the diameter of the diff casing is ideal.

[badger5]

Cheers Neal for the detailed reply. Would this be an issue with the new Schumacher K2 then? The Schumcher diffs are pretty big.

[The Doctor]

Must admit to feeling the same underwhelmed emotion as others have expressed, having seen the first pictures of the "stock" YZ-4.

With the YZ-2, Yok set a high quality standard which now becomes the expectation for the YZ-4. And it just looks to me like it's below that standard, particularly the amount of plastic molded components vs carbon or aluminium parts.

On the other hand of course, if it goes well and is a strong car then who cares!

So - will I be rushing to place a pre-order? No. I'll stick with my BMAX4-iii, see how the YZ-4s fare and what the release spec turns out to be and then make my choice.

[neallewis]

Originally Posted by badger5

Cheers Neal for the detailed reply. Would this be an issue with the new Schumacher K2 then? The Schumcher diffs are pretty big.

The BMAX4iii is a very heavy car, and typically Schumacher (K1/areo) are quite a bit lighter, this does away with the need for such high roll stiffness.

The belts in the Schumachers give a different characteristic power delivery over the shaft drive, again referring back to inertia and rotating mass brief, its a lot lower in the belt car. Schumacher belts go round the diffs, so will be rotating at different speeds to the yz4 belts. although both driven from a similar central shaft off spur. I guess driving both will be a good comparison.

Schumacher wishbone pivot points are in different places compared to the bmax4iii, so again, the roll centres are different.

I've seen the new k2 in person at the last EOS (As i did the yz4) and both look fantastic cars. The move to a belt car is a positive one, reinforced by the success of the Schumacher cars. I've not had a 4wd K series car, but do refer fondly back to my Procat in the 90's.

[neallewis]

Originally Posted by skyaflake

Erm. Can't interpret? Look at all (i mean, seriously, the cars are loaded) the cars the team drivers are running. People see all those parts. You must understand they will never release a kit that team drivers run, but they went the cheap way now. I mean (even though it's not final yet) plastic shocktowers? Plastic steering parts? That stuff didn't came standard on the YZ-2, they went premium on that car and look how it payed off: YZ-2 is doing fine worldwide. The only downside what they did with the YZ-2 is that they didn't make a lot of profit per kit. But yeah, they earn more on parts than on kits anyway. I guess they went the "cheap" way to get more money in. Come on, go a bit more premium and people will be more satisfied. As posted above, the K2 (not that i'm going to drive one, ill get myself a YZ4 anyway) is "much" more bang for buck out of the box.

If you compare the YZ-4 to the B-Max4 III, the B-Max4 III looks much better when you compare the parts.

I know, kit isn't final yet (Carbon towers wouldn't surprise me at all). But yes, some people are disappointed, maybe you are not, but you will max out your car anyway. Some people don't, some people want decent cars out of the box - I don't say the YZ-4 isn't decent. But you pay a fair amount of money, so yeah, some Alu would be fine. Just like the YZ-2.

Ah ok, I'd not seen the photos of the "release" kit on the mibosport site, only the shots from lee's car (and others at the worlds), and the ones I took of Tom's. Also referring back to the cars I've seen in person, which do feature lots of alloy bits.

The allow bits to exist now, so it would make sense to release a blinged up box at a higher price point. I know which I'd buy from the off, but you're right, I'll stick the fancy bits on anyway.

I'm no too worried by plastic shock towers (over carbon), they will be pretty durable (did anyone ever break a bmax2 tower?), but yes some of the pulleys and steering parts would be best in alloy in the box. Roll bars will be needed, so at least a kit pair should be included.

I think the price, spec and pitch of the YZ2 kit was right. It wasn't cheap, though felt a high quality piece of kit out the box, but they have still managed to release lots of nice (but not essential) hop ups, hubs, rear bulkhead servo posts, which don't need to be in the kit. I balance needs to be struck I think.

I'm still not disappointed though, stuff like this is what it is. Either you buy into a platform and run with it, or pick something else.

By comparison, Schumacher have the a pretty bad record in (my mind) for releasing a kit, then selling every possible "essential" or team upgrade going. Plus their plastic is made of jacobs crackers. I still think they are good cars. The most I ever spent in one year on one car was was my xray XB4 ('13). I've not spent half of that in two years on my bmax4iii, and it's still a far batter car!

[Piles]

I to am a bit dissapointed. Release photos of the new car as the pro's use it is fine and, yes it wont be as the rest of us will race it, but the car isn't even available yet and the pics we see are that of a car which is a million miles from what we are going to be able to purchase.
As some have pointed out, the release of the YZ2 set a high standard and to see that slip back is unfortunate. Have the bean counetrs taken control of the YZ4?

[GlenC]

The car has a the feel of being like the RS Bd7 is to the full blown BD7.
Plastic rear hinge pin holders and no sway bars are really unforgivable.
The rest, while not being flash, I can live with if the parts perform well.

[skyaflake]

@Neal, Yeah. Yokomo parts are of great quality. I don't break things easily on all of my Yokomo cars. I think nobody ever broke a tower on a B-Max2. B-Max4 III (and all 4WD's) is a bit different, but you take that into account. Besides that, the Yokomo cars are all of great quality and brake seldom.

I can/may announce some new Yokomo news in a couple of hours, waiting for a confirmation from Yokomo. They are a little bit changing stuff lately: first there would be two kits, then one, and now they are telling different things. More news soon (probably today). >> More news SOON after the worlds. I let Yokomo do this.

And yes, most people will know that Schumacher makes great cars but they are very prone to breaking. They all look great though.

[Ashlandchris]

Originally Posted by neallewis

...I'm no too worried by plastic shock towers (over carbon), they will be pretty durable (did anyone ever break a bmax2 tower?)...

Am I allowed to be the exception to the rule? my Bmax2 Worlds suffered a broken front shock tower, although it didn't seem to affect my driving or lap times.
Early summer when the missing bearing came to light in my YZ2 (Thanks Neal for identifying and sorting), I ran one round with my spare BMax and at end of heat when checking car over I noticed it had a broken tower. Odd because I hadn't crashed anywhere, but hey ho
That said, I think the Yokes are bombproof and certainly exceed the B44.1 I ran for a few months and never made it to the end of a heat with, and my Team C which also seemed to get through front wishbones at a rate until I discovered the higher carbon content versions.
I don't think I will get a YZ4 simply as I never seemed to get time / chance to run my BMax4iii so suspect the same will apply with any 4WD, that said, I'd rather get a high spec "straight from box" - the YZ2 was perfect - it felt like the right balance between plastic / carbon / alloy.

[claymoreman]

the hype surrounding the car is what is feeding the masses of what it should and shouldnt have in the box. Yokomo are a company that need to make money. If they release an all singing dancing car straight out the box once people have bought it thats the end. A fully specced race kit thrown together with a new car means one mass profit at the start but nothing to follow putting a nail into a new car before people even buy it where as releasing a lower specced car then releasing goodies for that car over the course of its life means they can keep people interested in the car for a longer period of time. Does everyone want to see a brand new car with all the bells and whistles be released only to die a month or two later as nothing new to add to the car which is what will happen if they release the big box of goodies like everyone wants it to be. Remember everyone a lot of the cars at the worlds are still prototypes and still have prototype parts on and not all prototype parts will make it to production.

[cmgreen]

Oh come on guys, look on the Bright side, the Schumacher K2 looks and is fantastic!

[neallewis]

Originally Posted by cmgreen

Oh come on guys, look on the Bright side, the Schumacher K2 looks and is fantastic!

but still has plastic made of jacobs crackers!

Actually it looked undrivable in CP1. for sure Orlowski got it together by CP5 or 6 (the last one)

[cmgreen]

Originally Posted by neallewis

but still has plastic made of jacobs crackers!

Actually it looked undrivable in CP1. for sure Orlowski got it together by CP5 or 6 (the last one)

Think theres only 2 bits of plastic on it, you know you want one Neal, come on deep deep down you want one, you want the best LOL

As long as its together by Quaily then that's what counts

[neallewis]

Originally Posted by cmgreen

Think theres only 2 bits of plastic on it, you know you want one Neal, come on deep deep down you want one, you want the best LOL

As long as its together by Quaily then that's what counts

For sure. Orlowski will do well, he's a bloody good young driver.


I'd have a free K2, like my free KF

[AfroP]

Originally Posted by cmgreen

Think theres only 2 bits of plastic on it, you know you want one Neal, come on deep deep down you want one, you want the best LOL

As long as its together by Quaily then that's what counts

judging by the seeds and positions after todays cp's then the k2 would only be third best...

Kyosho would be best followed by Xray

and based on number of cars in the top 10 Kyosho is top.

Lee is doing far better with 4wd and the YZ-4 overall seems to be doing better than the YZ2

[cmgreen]

Originally Posted by neallewis

For sure. Orlowski will do well, he's a bloody good young driver.


I'd have a free K2, like my free KF

Ha ha, love it!

I still think deep deep deep down you are itching to get a K2

Just imagine what Lee Martin could do with a K2, domination LOL

Might pop down to Batley one sunday, see you there

[RDG 40]

Originally Posted by skyaflake

I can/may announce some new Yokomo news in a couple of hours, waiting for a confirmation from Yokomo. They are a little bit changing stuff lately: first there would be two kits, then one, and now they are telling different things. More news soon (probably today). >> More news SOON after the worlds. I let Yokomo do this. .

Id b happy just for two version tbh

[skyaflake]

As far as I know.. your wish may be granted. However, it's not certain if it will be a worlds or a factory kit, depends on the results by Yokomo at the worlds and a bit more variables. I will know more after the worlds and if I may, i will share the info right here.

[AfroP]

http://www.rccarshop.co.uk/index.php...ls/yokomo.html

MB models are showing 2 versions of the YZ4
a "limited" and a "standard"

[Chris Larner]

This thread is great and has had me entertained for day if not weeks! All the "I know this about the YZ4" and "I've seen this I've seen that" talk it's brilliant.
Made me laugh when so many people put down a deposit on a car they hadn't seen or new much about, now for them to moan it's not how they wanted/hoped. I'm sure some facts and guesses are true.
Yokomo 'will' release a buggy and it will cost 'some' money. But it's funny how grown men can't just wait and get the facts and info when it officially released
But please keep this thread up as I'm loving it.