B4.2 release

[Moose]

It is just that good! The only thing it has going against it (in mainland Europe) is the fact that it's not metric!

Sure the B4 is still great but it is by far not the number one car which it was for average racers. Five years back there were 95% Associated cars in european races. Today there is 1%. Some have the vega or centro but certainly not many. I just cant imagine the B4.2 will change that. I really think there will be a mid car soon with a different name. If it is cost wise stupid to release a mid motor car no company would produce a mid motor car... and some have a much smaler market than asso

the new mid Yokomo (as run on the EOS) is to replace the rear-motor Yokomo entirely

No. Yokoma has both in one kit rear and mid. And the price is very competitive. Yokomo sells Associated in Japan and the R12 has many asso parts but thats all. They dont share teamdrivers.

[Origineelreclamebord]

Originally Posted by Moose

Sure the B4 is still great but it is by far not the number one car which it was for average racers. Five years back there were 95% Associated cars in european races. Today there is 1%.

Perhaps then there lies the actual problem: The B4 chassis line is absolutely brilliant, but after all those years the majority of it's design doesn't feel special, new, fresh like all those new releases we've had for the last 2 years. It's not because it's bad or ugly, it's just because it's something 95% of the drivers got used to working on over all these years. If all of a sudden all these new cars start showing up, no wonder all those drivers are interested in what these new cars are like.

And indeed, then the B4.2 won't make all those people step back to the brand. I think they're past that point though, no matter what they release: Going from 2 to 6+ 2WD buggy brands with a considerable market share* is something you don't recover from as a brand... unless a B5 would be as big a step ahead of the competition as the B4 was when it was first released. And I'm honest, I don't want a 2WD buggy being released that sweeps all the competitors off the market!

*Globally, I'm not taking dominanty used surface per region into account here for the market share.

[Robby]

Originally Posted by DCM

So, being a B4.2, it isn't a 'new' car, just an update. Hex's, slipper and finally got rid of the crap bellcranks, oh, and big bores..... So, what a lot of people already run if they still use a B4 or B4.1....

Frankly, I don't know what all of you are whining about.
Had they not allowed all those updated parts to slip into the pipeline over the last year, and instead had waited and introduced the big bores, bell cranks, hex's, slipper, and extended chassis all at once every damn one of you would have been slobbering all over yourselves.
Instead of pitching a fit, perhaps you should be thanking them for not forcing you to buy a complete new car - because you already have it.

And with all the B4-based centro conversions out there already on the market, did you really think AE was going to build a car just for the limited UK-market or one for the rest of the world that doesn't need a mid-motor car?

[johnboy]

Originally Posted by Robby

Frankly, I don't know what all of you are whining about.
Had they now allowed all those updated parts to slip into the pipeline over the last year, and instead had waited and introduced the big bores, bell cranks, hex's, slipper, and extended chassis all at once every damn one of you would have been slobbering all over yourselves.
Instead of pitching a fit, perhaps you should be thanking them for not forcing you to buy a complete new car - because you already have it.

And with all the B4-based centro conversions out there already on the market, did you really think AE was going to build a car just for the limited UK-market or one for the rest of the world that doesn't need a mid-motor car?

Exactly what my thoughts are

[Moose]

And with all the B4-based centro conversions out there already on the market, did you really think AE was going to build a car just for the limited UK-market or one for the rest of the world that doesn't need a mid-motor car?

Yep that's what I think. And I still think it will happen this year, maybe a centro by AE like the BJ4, thats what looks most possible now. It is not the UK market anymore its whole Europe. Only the US has professional dirt tracks which are the whole year in a great shape. Even in Asia there are more and more astro tracks. If RC was 100% US market than there woulnd't be any midmotor cars or a 8ight EU or Mugen EU.

[Origineelreclamebord]

Originally Posted by Moose

Yep that's what I think. And I still think it will happen this year, maybe a centro by AE like the BJ4, thats what looks most possible now. It is not the UK market anymore its whole Europe. Only the US has professional dirt tracks which are the whole year in a great shape. Even in Asia there are more and more astro tracks. If RC was 100% US market than there woulnd't be any midmotor cars or a 8ight EU or Mugen EU.

I do agree that mid-motor seems to be the trend currently - even on clay mid-motors can be made to work extremely well actually (X6, and a mid 210 seems to do really well on clay too with a bit of rear weight).

However, I don't see Associated replacing the B4 for mid-motor only, and actually I don't see them making a hybrid that can be mid/rear converted. They have a very strong all-round rear motor, if they do anything at all with a new model 2WD it will be in the direction of making a very strong allround mid-motor... and even that I'm not sure they'll do. B4 mid conversions have been around for ages, which cover all the reasons why you might want a mid-motor (all-round like X6, or as specific for higher bite as a Centro).

People still buy a standard B4 for converting, and another B4-like mid-motor with the only difference that it actually comes from Associated? Nah, not extremely profitable I suppose. However, there is a cheap solution that may make mid B4s very attractive and realistic. They could supply CML with the needed parts to sell complete Centro kits instead of conversion kits and tell them to solve the chassis durability issues. I think that's where it'll end for Associated's mid-motor adventures.

[Oval/offroadracer43]

Im getting one of these for sure just because of the Big Bores.

[Danosborne6661]

We're people really expecting a new car? With a name like B4.2 it's clear that it's only going to be an update. Associated will definitely be producing a B5 but at the moment they are clearly just updating what they already have.

If anyone actually purchases this for over £200 then they must be BONKERS. To think you can get a used B4 for around £50 and refine it from there... I don't imagine they're going to get quite so many sales on this one.

[Richard Lowe]

Originally Posted by Danosborne6661

If anyone actually purchases this for over £200 then they must be BONKERS. To think you can get a used B4 for around £50 and refine it from there... I don't imagine they're going to get quite so many sales on this one.

I say the opposite actually! Buying a £50 B4 and updating all the parts to .2 spec doesn't make financial sense. Big bore's and a couple of sets of springs are around £100, then add in the stuff on that second hand car that will be tired (diff outdrives and driveshafts) and you're pushing £200 already... And after doing that you still end up with a mostly worn car, with a new kit you get fresh everything for not much more

[Robby]

Originally Posted by Richard Lowe

I say the opposite actually! Buying a £50 B4 and updating all the parts to .2 spec doesn't make financial sense. Big bore's and a couple of sets of springs are around £100, then add in the stuff on that second hand car that will be tired (diff outdrives and driveshafts) and you're pushing £200 already... And after doing that you still end up with a mostly worn car, with a new kit you get fresh everything for not much more

You have a point, yet most of the AE devotees that would buy the .2 are ones that have been buying the updated parts as they've become available in the preceding months - so the only reason they need it is for the RC10B4.2 stickers

[Burty248]

I cant see them selling too much of these in the uk.

Anyone with a b4 knows that upgrading to a c4/vega would be a more useful investment. nore is it going to attract many to buy it as anyone who is not new knows that a mid motor has the edge over a rear motor on Astro and carpet. its just an American car in UK stores thats all

[sheriff]

Apologies for my ignorance here (been out of the racing game for a long time) but what makes the Kyosho car over £100 more expensive?

Not being argumentative by the way, just wondered

[Moose]

Apologies for my ignorance here (been out of the racing game for a long time) but what makes the Kyosho car over £100 more expensive?

The price tag basically. Kyosho has a slightly better fit than most cars. Design is 95% Losi copy. Doesn t put the sprues back in the mashine(because they sell them with the parts ) The shocks are stunning. Diff is great too. So its a nice car and because we don t live in communism every company can set the price without asking us. I don t know what price should be right maybe 50 maybe 500.

If you want a B4 now its the best to buy a B4.2 so it is great they have updated it. Buying an old car and upgrade it might be fun but if you have the money for a new car than go for it and in this case it is really nicely priced with great shocks etc.

Origineelreclamebord: I don t think they should or will stop the B4 but I think an additional midmotor car is what they need and I can t imagine associated has a different view. it always was the same everyone pretends it doesnt make sence now but it is 100% sure they dont have a solution for carpet right now. They dont even send the team to any carpet races right now.

[peetbee]

Originally Posted by Robby

You have a point, yet most of the AE devotees that would buy the .2 are ones that have been buying the updated parts as they've become available in the preceding months - so they only reason they need it is for the RC10B4.2 stickers

Part number 9782 - HTH

[Robby]

Originally Posted by peetbee

Part number 9782 - HTH

So you're saying you already ordered yours .............

[Robby]

Originally Posted by sheriff

Apologies for my ignorance here (been out of the racing game for a long time) but what makes the Kyosho car over £100 more expensive?

Not being argumentative by the way, just wondered

Going back decades, I've never known a Kyosho model that didn't have a higher pricepoint than competitive models.

Now, for whatever reason, they've also never taken advantage of the "distributor networks" that they larger brands have - and as a result they don't move as much product (total sales) which ultimately affects their bottom line. So while most manufacturers base pricing on the basis of planned selling of 100,000 units (or whatever number you want to choose) Kyosho's forced to base their pricing on the basis of selling 10,000 units.

[Robby]

Originally Posted by Moose

Origineelreclamebord: I don t think they should or will stop the B4 but I think an additional midmotor car is what they need and I can t imagine associated has a different view. it always was the same everyone pretends it doesnt make sence now but it is 100% sure they dont have a solution for carpet right now. They dont even send the team to any carpet races right now.

The other thing to consider is that with the Worlds coming up this year (isn't it?) - and, just a wild guess, no plans for the Worlds being run on carpet/astro - that they were in no big hurry and lacked any real reason or motivation to bring out a mid-motor car at this time.

But at the end of the day, there's no telling what the boys at Area 51 are really working on.

[peetbee]

Originally Posted by Robby

So you're saying you already ordered yours .............

LOL, no still running V1 shocks on my B4 so it would take more than just stickers!
However, it's pretty worn now so will be buying a B4.2 as soon as I raise some money.

[Moose]

Robby: Doesnt even have something to do with the sales. When everyone was running the MP7.5 it was still more expensive. For some Kyosho cars the price makes sence for some not so it s just policy. But with the RB6 they certainly made something right though its a nasty copy.

[Robby]

Originally Posted by Moose

Robby: Doesnt even have something to do with the sales. When everyone was running the MP7.5 it was still more expensive. For some Kyosho cars the price makes sence for some not so it s just policy. But with the RB6 they certainly made something right though its a nasty copy.

We're not talking about the price of an individual car, company's profit margin are based across their entire line of products and vehicles.